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  1. #1
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    Lightbulb Offseason challenge!



    There's our cap details after the trade. Yeah could say its a bit early for offseason we still got good 25 games and playoffs. But figure now after the trade we have less options now. Since you factor in we only have RFA Middleton and player option for Dudley. I have a feeling Dudley stays now then he will expire 2016 in time for new tv deal and bigger contracts and capspace. If he opted out and wanted more years he will miss out on more money.

    So I think he stays. So only option is RFA Middleton unless he take QO to take 1 year deal then want more money on new TV deal 2016. But no matter what Middleton is a keeper. 3 and D are hard to find and don't come cheap. So if Middleton and Dudley stay then we have same roster as of now and this summer. 14 players under contract then.

    2 picks and 1 open roster spot. We have a first round sitting at #18 and second rounder at #48. Only have a spot for one barring anyone traded or waived or whatever. Could sell the second rounder or traded it for a future second. As for free agency doubt we land any top flight free agents like Marc Gasol or Jimmy Butler. I'd love to trade a package of Mayo, Zaza, Ersan for sure though.

    Also will have a healthy Parker back as well. I'd probably draft Jerian Grant if he's there. Other wise maybe Sabonis son. Not sure yet. Roster pretty much stays the same no free agents. Just sign Middleton and Dudley. Maybe shop Henson at draft time and sift through offers. Need a brute rebounding big man.

  2. #2
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    i would love to bring butler back to milwaukee... can the bulls match a max offer? Id rather have him than Middleton... I know its just a dream but still

  3. #3
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    Bulls would just salary dump trade Gibson.

  4. #4
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    I think people are actually underrating Middleton some. Butler is better, but Middleton has had a sneaky great year. He's never going to be a true offensive creator on the wing (although he'll get to show his skills in the coming weeks), he's a good offensive player who can operate without the ball, and he's been a really, really good defender by most metrics. Butler isn't leaving Chicago. With today's NBA salary cap situation, the current team can basically match anything. And given that he's Chicago's only true offensive wing player that can be relied on, he's there for the long haul.

    I would also be a little careful about projecting a rebound brute on this team. I don't think that's how Kidd wants to operate his defense. In the ideal world, he would have a mobile big fella who can rebound and block shots. While Henson isn't a great rebounder, you almost need someone of his skillset to be that guy on this team. I'm not opposed to bringing on a center in the draft, but whoever we bring on better be mobile and not just a big stiff.

  5. #5
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    I love Middleton, but I'm not quite ready to buy that he's a great defender. This year's metrics are great, and last year's were awful. He's benefitted from a new system, etc. I definitely want to see him back and think he has a great future in Milwaukee.

    As for the big man spot, I agree that what Kidd wants is length, quickness, rim protection, etc. Still, Henson doesn't get huge minutes because he just hasn't been rebounding well this season, which is weird because he used to be a monster on the boards.

  6. #6
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    As of now, here's what I'd so, assuming Dudley doesn't opt out (though I kinda think he will.)

    #18- Caris Levert
    Length, athleticism, and shooting ability could make him a perfect fit at the #2, where he could get plenty of minutes because of Middleton and Giannis' versatility.

    #48- Traded for 2016 2nd rounder
    The Bucks don't have roster spots, but in 2016 they have a bunch of expiring contracts that aren't likely to be resigned. Having picks that can be used to fill spots on the cheap will have more value next year.

    Resign Middleton- Probably like 4 years 40 million.
    He remains a great fit.

    Sign Bismack Biyombo- 4 years 24 milion-
    Biyombo is crazy long and athletic, but also has more strength than a guy like Henson. No offensive skill however, and hasn't been a favorite in Charlotte. Plus, they have Zeller and Vonleh waiting in the wings. Guy is only 22, and this is paying for potential a little bit, but he can be a great energy big off the bench and possibly develop into more.

    Buyout/Release Zaza
    He's toast.

    With those moves, the Bucks would be a couple million under the cap, and this would be their roster.

    PG- MCW, Ennis, Bayless
    SG- Middleton, Levert, Mayo
    SF- Giannis, Inglis, Dudley
    PF- Parker, JOB, Ersan
    C- Henson/Plumlee/Biyombo

    This offseason makes them a little better, but I feel it sets them up GREAT for the 2016 offseason where they have 3 picks, like 35 million in cap room and this roster

    PG- MCW, Ennis
    SG- Middleton, Levert
    SF- Giannis, Inglis
    PF- Parker, JOB
    C- Biyombo

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by thornga2 View Post
    As of now, here's what I'd so, assuming Dudley doesn't opt out (though I kinda think he will.)

    #18- Caris Levert
    Length, athleticism, and shooting ability could make him a perfect fit at the #2, where he could get plenty of minutes because of Middleton and Giannis' versatility.

    #48- Traded for 2016 2nd rounder
    The Bucks don't have roster spots, but in 2016 they have a bunch of expiring contracts that aren't likely to be resigned. Having picks that can be used to fill spots on the cheap will have more value next year.


    Resign Middleton- Probably like 4 years 40 million.
    He remains a great fit.

    Sign Bismack Biyombo- 4 years 24 milion-
    Biyombo is crazy long and athletic, but also has more strength than a guy like Henson. No offensive skill however, and hasn't been a favorite in Charlotte. Plus, they have Zeller and Vonleh waiting in the wings. Guy is only 22, and this is paying for potential a little bit, but he can be a great energy big off the bench and possibly develop into more.


    Buyout/Release Zaza
    He's toast.


    With those moves, the Bucks would be a couple million under the cap, and this would be their roster.

    PG- MCW, Ennis, Bayless
    SG- Middleton, Levert, Mayo
    SF- Giannis, Inglis, Dudley
    PF- Parker, JOB, Ersan
    C- Henson/Plumlee/Biyombo

    This offseason makes them a little better, but I feel it sets them up GREAT for the 2016 offseason where they have 3 picks, like 35 million in cap room and this roster

    PG- MCW, Ennis
    SG- Middleton, Levert
    SF- Giannis, Inglis
    PF- Parker, JOB
    C- Biyombo
    1st bold...
    Who would you compare him to in the league right now? Also how good of a scorer can he be? We are really going to need points from the 2 spot

    1st underline...
    I think we hold onto it until were on the clock than trade it if we dont have someone we like there. Also saying that I wouldnt mind keeping it because there is a chance that a 2nd rounder could beat out JOB, or even Inglis. I know plent of people are excited about Inglis as am I because of how much Hammond and co seem to like him and how they speak of him but the fact is he may not ever get healthy ala darrington hobson or another thing is that he just wont be good enough. hope neither of those things for Inglis but it is possible...

    2nd bold... 4/24 seems like an awful lot for potential. specially when there is a chance that Henson n Plumlee are ahead of him on the depth chart. We need to spend wisely.

    2nd underline..
    Zaza has looked horrible since the all star break but overall he has been a big part of our team this year. His contract could become valueable as a 5mil expiring as well. I'd like us to either trade him or keep him but play both Henson n Plumlee ahead of him next season because they are possibly the future and we really need to see what they have. Especially Henson who Will be due a contract after next season...

    Than the bolded underlined italic JOB... I really dont see how a 2nd rounder or Free agent this off season or next can not beat him out for a roster spot! I had hopes for him even though I didnt like the pick but this kid is really bad. For a pf he really cant rebound well, doesnt have a post game on offense, gets pushed around pretty easily on D which is suprising to me because he has a big body, and most of all his best asset is his close to mid range jumper and hes not even good at that! If it were not for injuries this year I think he would have been released instead of Wolters.. Just my opinion

  8. #8
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    I hesitate to say this, because of the type of player he turned into, but coming out, he actually carries almost an identical profile to Klay Thompson. Both were skilled spot up shooters, willing passers and decent athletes. Both are long shooting guards with a good feel for the game. And both of their weaknesses are that neither one was really great at finishing at the rim and neither is an elite athlete. There are some differences between the two, but as far as major profile, they are very similar. I would say Klay had a better stroke coming out, but that doesn't mean Lavert's is bad. Lavert is probably a better distributor and actually could play some point in a pinch, whereas I don't think Klay could have.

    Lavert really is a catch and shoot type of scorer though. As much as he can run the P&R and he is a really good passer, especially for a SG, he's not a good pull up jump shooter. He also needs to add strength to his game. It sounds as if he's added some strength to start this season, and hopefully he's continuing to work through his injury on strength training, because that's his weakness. When he drives to the dish he really doesn't have the strength to finish through contact, and isn't such an elite athlete that he'll just jump over guys, so he'll tend to shoot those pullup jumpers, which he really isn't a good shooter at.

    Lavert is a pretty good defender as well. His lack of strength hurts him here as well, as he can be bullied by bigger guards some, but he has pretty decent quickness, good length and he's a smart defender that can play passing lanes well. He may not yet be a plus defender, but even if he can get somewhat stronger, he probably turn into a plus defender with his length.

    Ultimately, the report on Lavert is that he probably should play a role somewhat similar to what Thompson plays in GS. He'll extend the defense with his range. He's a good enough ball handler and passer that he won't kill your ball movement and flow on offense. He can beat his man off the dribble, but needs to work on scoring more efficiently once he gets by his guy. He'll be at least an adequate player all around. Perhaps Kevin Martin is a good comp for him as well. I think Lavert is a better ball handler and beats his guy on the perimeter better than guys like Martin, but until he either learns to finish at the tin better or shoots better on pullups, his isolation game will never be that great. But his spot up game should translate right away as well as his active defensive ability, although not great. (Perhaps defensively he can almost be considered somewhat similar to how Giannis has been. Giannis is active and plays hard on defense, but he's still learning the nuances of NBA defense. Because of that, he's really not a great defender from a statistical standpoint, but clearly possesses the desire and tools to be a plus defender. Lavert is sort of the same way. While he doesn't have Giannis's highest upside on defense, he shows tools to be a good defender and is a willing defender.)

  9. #9
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    Got a crazy idea. Any chance Joe Johnson could be our FTD Stackhouse? Bucks can trade with Nets this summer since it be a year since the Kidd trade. Joe Johnson would be expiring $24,894,863. It's a bit expensive bench piece. But we do need a elite bench shooter when we go on droughts. But remember if Dudley stays and we extend Middleton our roster is 14 players on the books. Before this trade idea. 1 spot open for our first rounder. Second rounder doesn't have a chance unless JOB is waived.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=p5wwf9w

    Trade goes as follows Mayo, Ersan, Zaza, JOB for Joe Johnson. Nice 4 for 1 trade.

    Giannis
    Parker
    Middleton
    MCW
    Henson
    Johnson
    Plumlee
    Inglis
    Bayless
    Ennis
    Dudley
    #18
    #48

    11 guys and 2 picks for 13 guys and 2 spots open for a free agent or two. Maybe trade our first to Nets for Mason Plumee? Get the brothers together? Trade Clippers pick to Knicks for Thanasis? Think Nets kinda bummed out they didn't move Lopez. Yet they were talking with Thunder and Denver all week till trade deadline if not longer. Kidd probably doesn't like Lopez or Williams.

    Joe Johnson might fit in with Kidd of players stretching the floor. Russian owner break 1 player as in Joe Johnson and gets more depth with Mayo and highly coveted Ersan for 5 year they finally get him! Zaza be bench depth and salary filler as well as JOB as a throw in or Bucks could keep JOB but prefer him in the deal. Like them roster spots open for options down the road.


    Joe Johnson $23,180,790* $24,894,863

    for

    O.J. Mayo $8,000,000* $8,000,000
    Ersan Ilyasova $7,900,000* $7,900,000 $8,400,000 $400K guaranteed only final year
    Zaza Pachulia $5,200,000* $5,200,000
    Johnny O'Bryant $600,000* $845,059 $980,431 $1,251,245

    Pretty much expiring contracts traded. I still have this *seasons salaries included.*Other then Ersan's $400K and JOB's rookie deal. Nets save little over $1.4M off the top right away. They could reroute these guys if needed.
    Last edited by MILLERHIGHLIFE; 02-25-2015 at 12:55 PM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by MILLERHIGHLIFE View Post


    There's our cap details after the trade. Yeah could say its a bit early for offseason we still got good 25 games and playoffs. But figure now after the trade we have less options now. Since you factor in we only have RFA Middleton and player option for Dudley. I have a feeling Dudley stays now then he will expire 2016 in time for new tv deal and bigger contracts and capspace. If he opted out and wanted more years he will miss out on more money.

    So I think he stays. So only option is RFA Middleton unless he take QO to take 1 year deal then want more money on new TV deal 2016. But no matter what Middleton is a keeper. 3 and D are hard to find and don't come cheap. So if Middleton and Dudley stay then we have same roster as of now and this summer. 14 players under contract then.

    2 picks and 1 open roster spot. We have a first round sitting at #18 and second rounder at #48. Only have a spot for one barring anyone traded or waived or whatever. Could sell the second rounder or traded it for a future second. As for free agency doubt we land any top flight free agents like Marc Gasol or Jimmy Butler. I'd love to trade a package of Mayo, Zaza, Ersan for sure though.

    Also will have a healthy Parker back as well. I'd probably draft Jerian Grant if he's there. Other wise maybe Sabonis son. Not sure yet. Roster pretty much stays the same no free agents. Just sign Middleton and Dudley. Maybe shop Henson at draft time and sift through offers. Need a brute rebounding big man.
    As a side note, looking at the numbers Miller posted, I think we may end up keeping Ersan for his team option year. If the cap goes up as much as projected there are going to be ALOT of teams with space and a stretch four is always in demand. After his play has swung wildly over the years, Ersan's game seems to be leveling off this year into a decent rotation big (maybe a 7th or 8th man on a good team). Assuming he stays healthy, I think the worst case scenario is we trade him in the team option year for something.

  11. #11
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    I think we will probably get a decent chance to trade him next offseason. Having that non-guaranteed deal going into the summer of '16, which is supposed to be the next huge class would be huge for teams. I know the cap will jump, but they'll be teams hoping for 3 max roster spots that summer.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by crewfan13 View Post
    I think we will probably get a decent chance to trade him next offseason. Having that non-guaranteed deal going into the summer of '16, which is supposed to be the next huge class would be huge for teams. I know the cap will jump, but they'll be teams hoping for 3 max roster spots that summer.
    If that's the case, a lot of teams are going to be vastly disappointed. There are only so many max type players and way too many spots available. In supply and demand, the demand curve is going to shift outward significantly increasing the point of equilibrium. In short, prices are going to go up for players...a lot. IMO, we should lock in as many "core" and possibly serviceable players as we can (as per the CBA) to some longer term deals, ASAP.

    Some options:

    extensions for John Henson(4 yr/24 million?, tough to judge) and new contract for Middleton (changing my guess 4 yr/44) this summer

    if you think the following are good pieces, locking them up for two more years as well:
    Dudley ( 2 year extension @ 5-6 million per)
    Mayo (2 year extension @ 5-6 million per)
    Bayless ( 2 year extension @ 3 million per)

    If we did all these deals, we would lock up the back end of our playing rotation (besides Middleton, these are the first guys off the bench and spot starters) at prices, that I believe, will be well below the norm when the extensions kick in. At worst, these contracts would be easily tradeable. At best, they continue to produce at a solid level, providing us one of the best benches in the NBA, like we had for the majority of the season, at a fraction of the cost other teams who are all trying to keep all their space clear for multiple max level FA's. Add that to expected growth in Giannis' and Parker's game, plus the one max level FA we can actually add, and I think we have a championship contender in 3 years.

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