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  1. #76
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    evan turner: i'm in

    ^ agree, he needs to look for teammates before the defense closes in on him, and his teammates need to know this is gonna happen and get in a position to be open for a pass/jumpshot.

    Its a 2-way street that its up to the coaching staf to fix.

    The best part is, once turner (and holiday for that matter) learn to do this, the defenses wont be able to collapse on them so easily and our guards will be tht much more dangerous.


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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knowledge View Post
    PnR's really are hurting the team since our bigs are so useless. At the same time, Evan and Jrue are settling at times for horrible shots. I would like to see us give Jrue more freedom to go one on one by spreading the court with shooters and having the bigs stay out of his way.

    Evan needs to control himself and stop playing so out of control (especially toward the end of the games). Sometime when he has good games it is a double edged sword because he starts to believe the shots he was hitting when he was hot will be there consistently.

    Those fade-away step backs and pull ups should minimized. Even if he is a good mid range shooter, he can't keep relying on it like he has.
    When the defensive intensity picks up...later in the 4th usually, I'd like to see a bit more of this for both Jrue and ET. I think they are both more likely to get a respectable shot up without turning it over in that scenario. Although, sometimes I also think if Jrue has 1 pick and pop big with him setting a screen with the rest spread out, that works also. ET seems better off using his handle plus his size advantage (if he's at guard) than trying to score off a screen.
    Last edited by wannabGM; 12-10-2012 at 09:25 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by RickyPrior View Post
    When you go out of the way just to hate...no one takes you seriously.

  3. #78
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    evan turner: i'm in

    Id love to see ET get better at coming off a screen tho.

    The principle isnt too much different than the catch and shoot from the corner 3 hes improved upon.

    They really dont run any mid range screen plays for anyone, and i think nick young would be really good at that.


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  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knowledge View Post
    I would like to see us give Jrue more freedom to go one on one by spreading the court with shooters and having the bigs stay out of his way.
    .

    The only problem with that is that the Big defenders will simply abandon their assignment and meet Jru in the lane...since Jrue will have become more dangerous than their assigned guy. And so it will very well lead to our Bigs taking 14 footers when Jrue kicks to them.

    Not a horrendous option...but I'd prefer to get the ball in the hands of guys who shoot those mid-rangers at a higher percentage as they come off screens.

    What I wish we saw more of is Jrue driving and others slashing to the basket. Or Evan posting or working his way low and others cutting to the basket.

    We don't score enough in the paint...and so why not utilize the guys we do have who are capable of converging...BUT then take advantage of that penetration.

    Too often we see, for example (don't shoot the messenger) ET getting close only to have his shot blocked by 2-3 players. Imagine his options if Jrue, JRich and Thad attacked, without the ball, from various angles.

    We haven't had off-the-ball 'activity' since before AI arrived. There's no structure to our half court...and I'm not sure why. We have always had speed and athleticism and aggressive players. So......?
    Last edited by RickyPrior; 12-10-2012 at 11:20 AM.

  5. #80
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    Theoretically, what's in your mind makes some sense.

    Except Jrue scores in crunch time repeatedly well in ISO situations, or when shooting pull-ups off the dribble.....at a higher percentage than what any of our shooters off screens can hit.

    What your talking about sounds reasonable for the first roughly 3.5 quarters of the game, when it's easier to run that type of play.
    Quote Originally Posted by RickyPrior View Post
    When you go out of the way just to hate...no one takes you seriously.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by wannabGM View Post
    Theoretically, what's in your mind makes some sense.

    Except Jrue scores in crunch time repeatedly well in ISO situations, or when shooting pull-ups off the dribble.....at a higher percentage than what any of our shooters off screens can hit.

    What your talking about sounds reasonable for the first roughly 3.5 quarters of the game, when it's easier to run that type of play.
    I wasn't discussing end of game, last second shots. Mine is an offensive theory; a gameplan for the half court. I may have misunderstood.

    I don't normally involve myself in last-second, who's-going-to-shoot-it stuff. (Except to say it still makes sense to add movement with the goal being getting guys into their individual highest percentage spots.) Frankly, I think this last second :14 on the clock stuff is...eh...not that important.

    Others here love defining Iggy's and Lou's whole careers on these Hail Mary situations.

    One general rule I will add to my parenthetical, above, is that we never seem to shoot with :04-:05 left. It's always :01-:02. And when you have a guy like Thad in there...and Lavoy...to mop up... I think it's a mistake not to account for an offensive rebound.

  7. #82
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    Another option would be to play Moultrie and let him make mistakes/develop. He may be the only big on the roster with PnR potential.

    I would rather watch a rookie make mistakes and grow than kwame, hawes, and lavoy take turns with incompetence.

    Lavoy should be better than this. I never thought he was more than a complimentary/backup long term, but he should be serviceable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Hinkie
    "I'm probably pretty boring to watch a game with because I''m all about expected values. I don''t even care if it goes in or not, I'm all about, '‘Should it go in?'' I can live with randomness. I mean, if it''s a close game in the end, yeah, I''m just like anyone else. But I just want us to play the odds all the time."
    TerminH1NK13


  8. #83
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    evan turner: i'm in

    I agree with ricky, an im prettu sure i said the exact same things over and over recently.

    Wannabe, we are talking about the offense throughout the game... If u wanna concern urself with the final 10th of the game, thats a different discussion, but theres 42minutes of a game that comes before that to even be in a position to win a close one at the end.

    Wannabe, every team makes changes at the end of game situations.... The first 3 quarters and change are just as imortant (often more so) than last minute offense.


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  9. #84
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    I'll also add this about Evan and Iso-ing. I'm not as much a fan of him doing it as I don't think he can get by people 1 on 1. He seems to work best using picks and creating some problems from there. He also isn't very good at involving his teammates and this has been a problem since he got here.

    I think Jrue has the skills and athleticism to be a force from the PG spot, while I think Evan needs to get his within the flow of the offense and take advantage of when he has a mismatch. When teams put bigger defenders on Evan, he has problems because of his lack of athleticism (which shows in how much his shot gets blocked) and sometimes he gets in "hero" mode where he wants to take every shot and be Jordan.

    Once he realizes his own limitations, it will benefit the team so much more.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Hinkie
    "I'm probably pretty boring to watch a game with because I''m all about expected values. I don''t even care if it goes in or not, I'm all about, '‘Should it go in?'' I can live with randomness. I mean, if it''s a close game in the end, yeah, I''m just like anyone else. But I just want us to play the odds all the time."
    TerminH1NK13


  10. #85
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    And I will once again go out on a limb and say Evan, I believe, never had a good coach. The things he does/doesn't do are really basic. He seems to have learned ALL of his tactics from the men's league at the YMCA.

    Either that or he's dumb. Which, no, I don't believe to be true.

    But by now it'd be nice to see him handle things (off the ball...with the ball...team 'd'...) progressively better. Not so sure he has.

  11. #86
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    I think our offense could really benefit from the addition of a vet backup pg. it's a great experience for jrue and ET to only have the ball but ultimately I think they'll play too many minutes on an incomplete team. I would try to get involved with Toronto to acquire calderone. Hopefully spence would be enough.

    I would basically give Moultrie his minutes. I'd give calderone 25-30 minutes a night. Jrue can play off the ball with him. Neither Wayns or ET are good enough to use jrue at the two. Calderone would help that.

    Yes we'd be losing a seven footer but I think the leadership from a vet playmaker would be really good for the youngins. They've already proven they can run the show. However that won't result into meaningful wins until the big mAn arrives. But in the mean time we can really help our young big develop.
    Pay attention. You might learn something.

  12. #87
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    evan turner: i'm in

    I would trade spencer for calderon, but i woulnt give him more than 18-22 min a night.


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  13. #88
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    I would. Jrue and ET have nothing to prove. He'd be taking minutes from Wayns, Richardson and probably wright mostly. And I would only do it til we start getting something substantial down low. Whether that's production from Moultrie and brown or Allen asserting himself. My interest right now isn't winning games but teaching.
    Pay attention. You might learn something.

  14. #89
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    evan turner: i'm in

    I dont need evan playing more 3 and hes been good as a backup pg.


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  15. #90
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    Thats where he starts. He's the best one we have.
    Pay attention. You might learn something.

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