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  1. #91
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    Agreed! They're not THAT far away. Let's keep this very strong starting rotation intact. Spend carefully on 1 solid free agent OFer and 1 solid free agent Relief Pitcher, then lets see where we are. Patch together the C position for 1 more year (bat the catchers 8th) as long as the defense and game calling is there. We can be building toward the future while also being very competitive if we're smart.......(the world champion SF Giants are the model)

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by FloridaMetFan View Post
    While it fun to play fantasy baseball, we aren't spending money or making blockbuster trades to try and compete - its not happening.
    The fantasy is that we can compete without adding at least one quality outfielder. The rest of the problems can possibly be resolved or lived with. Most teams aren't getting much from the catching position. Bullpens can be unpredictable, and sometimes fixed on the cheap. We have quality pitching depth at AAA (including both Wheeler and Mejia possibly ready for rotation spots by June).

    But a platoon guy like Hairston or Ross isn't going to be enough to fix that outfield. Neither is even that much of an upgrade over Torres. You can certainly live with having guys like Kirk, Valdespin, and Duda on the roster, but you can't have them being in the running for best outfielder on the team.

    By hook or by crook this team needs to find a premium outfielder. If they can't get in on the top free agents, then they need to be in on trading for an Upton or Gordon, or failing that a top prospect like Meyers.

  3. #93
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    LOL here we go again, arent that far away, from what may I ask, we have no leadoff hitter, no production from the catching position, we have no outfielders with a real position, and no closer you can rely on, so again what are we close to, teams like San Francisco, and Cincinnati, and Washington and Atlanta are young also, but they improve their teams in the off season, the only thing we are closer too is maybe battling Philadelphia for 3rd place and not in 2013 maybe 2014

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by paletsgomets View Post
    LOL here we go again, arent that far away, from what may I ask, we have no leadoff hitter, no production from the catching position, we have no outfielders with a real position, and no closer you can rely on, so again what are we close to, teams like San Francisco, and Cincinnati, and Washington and Atlanta are young also, but they improve their teams in the off season, the only thing we are closer too is maybe battling Philadelphia for 3rd place and not in 2013 maybe 2014
    They have a potential closer in Parnell when FF starts to suck and then can always look to acquire bullpen help next week at the winter meetings.

    As for the OF, that's why they are looking to possibly deal Niese or Dickey to find OF help. They also mentioned in Newsday or the Post (and it was posted here) that they will be looking to spend some kind of money in FA with the OF being their priority.

    The catcher's spot, there are guys available like Jesus Flores, Maldanado, and others that could help..

    If they can fix some of their OF problems, offense from the catcher's position really becomes irrelevant (from an 8th place hitter)
    Last edited by metswon69; 12-02-2012 at 09:14 PM.

  5. #95
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    We are not that far away from the bottom. I'm thinking the Marlins will beat us out for the bottom spot. We have a garbage bullpen each and every year and someone needs to wake up our GM and alert him to addressing our needs. I hate this Moneyball crap.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toon88 View Post
    We are not that far away from the bottom. I'm thinking the Marlins will beat us out for the bottom spot. We have a garbage bullpen each and every year and someone needs to wake up our GM and alert him to addressing our needs. I hate this Moneyball crap.
    What moneyball crap? Moneyball was about redefining the assessment of a player's value to a team.
    "The 90 wins is about challenge. It's about changing the conversation. It's about framing questions for ourselves as to how we get there. So I stand by the notion that we need to get better, and in doing so we need to set concrete goals for ourselves so that we have sort of specific conversations among ourselves about how we're going to get there." -- Mr. Alderson

  7. #97
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    No Its Not

    Quote Originally Posted by Dugmet View Post
    What moneyball crap? Moneyball was about redefining the assessment of a player's value to a team.
    All about plugging in cheap players to keep a franchise afloat. Read the book if not netflix the movie.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toon88 View Post
    All about plugging in cheap players to keep a franchise afloat. Read the book if not netflix the movie.
    That's not what it's about solely (more so in reference to A's yes but not completely)

    It's pretense is finding value in players based on more advanced statistics and skills that were once overlooked.

    Ascetic long term statistical analysis has demonstrated that on-base percentage and slugging percentage are better indicators of offensive success.

    The Mets are trying to use that philosophy to build a successful baseball team but it doesn't necessarily mean they will only pick up "cheap" players when afforded otherwise.
    Last edited by metswon69; 12-02-2012 at 10:12 PM.

  9. #99
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    The fact is we have some holes that can be filled cheaply with a little creativety. Ryan Madson and Denard Span are two guys that were right there for the taking at very generous prices and the Mets did nothing. We still need a lefty reliever, another set up man, a catcher, outfielders, and depth. Nothing is being done. I was all for Sandy but he is really starting to test my patience. You don't have to mortgage the future or the payroll to get better everytime. Sometimes the answer is so obvious you miss it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Piazza View Post
    But I have to say that my time with the Mets wouldn't have been the same without the greatest fans in the world. One of the hardest moments of my career, was walking off the field at Shea Stadium and saying goodbye. My relationship with you made my time in New York the happiest of my career and for that, I will always be grateful.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5+7=DYNASTY!!! View Post
    The fact is we have some holes that can be filled cheaply with a little creativety. Ryan Madson and Denard Span are two guys that were right there for the taking at very generous prices and the Mets did nothing. We still need a lefty reliever, another set up man, a catcher, outfielders, and depth. Nothing is being done. I was all for Sandy but he is really starting to test my patience. You don't have to mortgage the future or the payroll to get better everytime. Sometimes the answer is so obvious you miss it.
    Alex Meyer for Span was not a cheap price at all.

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna28 View Post
    Alex Meyer for Span was not a cheap price at all.
    A starter who may very likely end up a reliever, in a hot system which means by all the "Top 100" lists he's likely to be slightly overrated. Sound familar? We have a surplus of pitching prospects and zero offensive, Span fills a huge gap cheaply for the next few years. He was absolutely worth it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Piazza View Post
    But I have to say that my time with the Mets wouldn't have been the same without the greatest fans in the world. One of the hardest moments of my career, was walking off the field at Shea Stadium and saying goodbye. My relationship with you made my time in New York the happiest of my career and for that, I will always be grateful.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5+7=DYNASTY!!! View Post
    A starter who may very likely end up a reliever, in a hot system which means by all the "Top 100" lists he's likely to be slightly overrated. Sound familar? We have a surplus of pitching prospects and zero offensive, Span fills a huge gap cheaply for the next few years. He was absolutely worth it.
    His peripherals don't really jump out at anybody even for the 4 fWAR type player in 2012.

    In fact if i had a choice for a short term solution i would rather have had Pierre (who is still a legitimate SB threat and raked on the road last year) Granted he doesn't hit LHP but that could have been the effective leadoff hitter the Mets were looking for this offseason even on a 1 year deal.

    I mean with Span you are talking about a .284 hitter with 4 homers, 41 rbis and 17 steals last season. That isn't entirely impressive for a guy they gave up in return who could eventually be a top of the rotation type pitcher for the Twins.

    That move is a "put us over the top because we are in win now" mode and more a way for the Nationals to excuse themselves out of the Michael Bourn sweepstakes.
    Last edited by metswon69; 12-02-2012 at 11:30 PM.

  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5+7=DYNASTY!!! View Post
    A starter who may very likely end up a reliever, in a hot system which means by all the "Top 100" lists he's likely to be slightly overrated. Sound familar? We have a surplus of pitching prospects and zero offensive, Span fills a huge gap cheaply for the next few years. He was absolutely worth it.
    He's not overrated, his stuff is very real. Past Wheeler, we don't have a pitching prospect as good as him.

    Span made sense for a team like the Nationals, definitely not the Mets.

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toon88 View Post
    All about plugging in cheap players to keep a franchise afloat. Read the book if not netflix the movie.
    You missed the point. That is the context, but it is not Moneyball. All 30 teams use the Moneyball philosophy to varying degrees. Even the Yankees use Moneyball.

    As the new A's ownership began tighten the purse strings, Alderson and then Beane began to reevaluate the assessment and valuation of players. As a result they began to lean on nontraditional stats.

    Depodesta in particular has always stated that Moneyball is the search for an edge in talent evaluation. In its earliest iteration, that was OBP. Nowadays, that has shifted to proprietary analytical computations, and height. Yes, height is the new Moneyball stat. See Kolten Wong and Branden Kaupe. (j/k).
    "The 90 wins is about challenge. It's about changing the conversation. It's about framing questions for ourselves as to how we get there. So I stand by the notion that we need to get better, and in doing so we need to set concrete goals for ourselves so that we have sort of specific conversations among ourselves about how we're going to get there." -- Mr. Alderson

  15. #105
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    I think the OF and the team got instantly better with the subtractions of Bay and Torres. Even if we don't pick anyone else up and go with what we had in the 1st half.

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