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  1. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by BSardogan View Post
    Okay, so, I know this ain't happening so don't burn me for this, but how awesome would this trade be for us:

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=blzu8cv


    Yeah, they're getting a bunch of roleplayers and rookies, but hey, at least they're young.

    AND, Hollinger projects a +3 win total for them, that might be the decisive factor here lol.
    morey deserves the gm of the year award if he can make this happen
    Quote Originally Posted by lol, please View Post
    1. Thunder
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    Quote Originally Posted by lol, please View Post

    I already have that scrizzguap on the Dubs winning a 'ship.
    Sincerely,
    delusional Warriors fan

    Quote Originally Posted by COOLbeans View Post
    What do you do for a living because I guarantee it's not in academics or psychology?

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    This has been an interesting discussion to read and I actually agree with both sides of the argument. First off, I love Chandler Parsons, but he's not anywhere close to a player of Aldridge's caliber, who is probably a top 5 player at his position and a perennial all-star. Aldridge provides exactly what this team needs in terms of a big man who can stretch the floor, rebound and defend the paint at the 4.
    I didn't say that. But, Parsons is clearly the best defensive player and it's a lot easier to find good PFs than SFs. Not the other way around how FOB said. And on top of that, he plays almost for free and he is much younger.

    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    Paul George is better right now and you could make a case for Kirilenko, Galinari and maybe Marion or Wallace. But no matter how you look at it, he's in that third tier behind the superstars and the stars at the position. I love Parsons, but his ceiling is maybe a No. 3 on a contender. And he has to become far more consistent before he reaches that level.
    Oh come one, I'll give you George as I forgot about him, even though I think it's debatable. But Galinari, Kirilenko, Marion and Wallace have not been better than Parsons. No way.

    I agree he's better than a role player, but 20 a game is a stretch. There are only 10 guys in the league doing that right now. And as Fob said, he's our No. 2 out of necessity, not necessarily based on talent.
    So how is he our second guy if he isn't talented to be? I know Lin was brought to be the second guy, and maybe Asik was brought to be the third guy, actually first and second before the trade, but Parsons has been the second guy behind Harden, plain and simple.

    Quote Originally Posted by FOBolous View Post
    i would add Andre Iguodala to the list also. either way, none of us have control over what happened. all our bickering really doesn't matter in the end. we have to wait and see what Morey has planned.
    Well, Iggy is not a SF anymore as he plays with Galinari, and I don't know, he doesn't look like the old Iguodala.

    Quote Originally Posted by b@llhog24 View Post
    Except Matthews sucks and the whole point of trading with Houston presumably would be to acquire some mixture of cap relief, picks and front-court players.

    A lineup of: Lillard, Batum, Parson, (whichever pf(s) the Rockets send us) and Meyers looks pretty darn good for a rebuilding team.
    I'm not gonna discuss about Matthews with a Portland fan as I haven't watched more Portland games than you, I hope. But Matthews' numbers seem pretty good and Batum has been amazing. And you're getting a player at one of the two position you don't need IMO.


    Milsap is overrated, Jefferson has just lost the whole "blackhole" label, Smith has the IQ of a fruit-rollup and Gasol just sucks. Cousins is interesting from a potential standpoint but Aldridge has already proven capable of functioning as a first and second option. Parson also isn't a top 7 Sf.
    Based on what? Tell me why Millsap is overated, why Gasol sucks and how really has Aldridge proved can be a first guy as he hasn't won a series in the playoffs in his carreer. Then we could have a discussion.
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  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by EDUTEXANS View Post
    I didn't say that. But, Parsons is clearly the best defensive player and it's a lot easier to find good PFs than SFs. Not the other way around how FOB said. And on top of that, he plays almost for free and he is much younger.
    Parsons does have an extremely valuable contract because he provides more bang for the buck than maybe any player in the NBA, but I totally disagree that 20-point big men are easier to come by than 12-15-point small forwards who play good defense. Also, Aldridge is a pretty solid defensive 4. I'd put him in the same realm as someone like Millsap.

    Oh come one, I'll give you George as I forgot about him, even though I think it's debatable. But Galinari, Kirilenko, Marion and Wallace have not been better than Parsons. No way.
    Galinari's advanced numbers are actually better and he's been better for longer. Wallace might be a bit of a stretch, but you could make a case for Kirilenko and Marion. They might not be as productive, but they're phenomenal defenders.

    So how is he our second guy if he isn't talented to be? I know Lin was brought to be the second guy, and maybe Asik was brought to be the third guy, actually first and second before the trade, but Parsons has been the second guy behind Harden, plain and simple.
    What are you talking about? Just because a guy is a team's No. 2 doesn't mean he SHOULD be a No. 2. Look at the worst teams in the league. Based on point production, guys like Nene and Shannon Brown are No. 2s. Does that mean they should be? Parsons right now is not a consistent No. 2 on a contending basketball team. Look at his point production the last five games: 12, 23, 7, 9 and 9. Does that seem like a No. 2 to you?


  4. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    Parsons does have an extremely valuable contract because he provides more bang for the buck than maybe any player in the NBA, but I totally disagree that 20-point big men are easier to come by than 12-15-point small forwards who play good defense. Also, Aldridge is a pretty solid defensive 4. I'd put him in the same realm as someone like Millsap.
    I'm not saying that, I'm saying it's easier to replace PFs than SFs. If we trade Parsons, who could we raplace him with? At PF, Jefferson, Smith and Millspa are FAs next year and Cousins and Gasol will porbably be in the market and both will be FAs the year after next.

    Galinari's advanced numbers are actually better and he's been better for longer. Wallace might be a bit of a stretch, but you could make a case for Kirilenko and Marion. They might not be as productive, but they're phenomenal defenders.
    I don't care what advanced numbers say, always look at his simple stats first, he has been pretty bad. He is a scorer, a shooter who doesn't provide much else, and he has been extremely inefficient. Wallace didn't play well last year after the trade and he hasn't been playing well this year. You could make a case for AK but not for Marion IMO. Anyway, this discussion is kinda stupid, I don't really care how well ranked he is, and probably you don't care either.

    What are you talking about? Just because a guy is a team's No. 2 doesn't mean he SHOULD be a No. 2. Look at the worst teams in the league. Based on point production, guys like Nene and Shannon Brown are No. 2s. Does that mean they should be? Parsons right now is not a consistent No. 2 on a contending basketball team. Look at his point production the last five games: 12, 23, 7, 9 and 9. Does that seem like a No. 2 to you?
    But we're not one of the worst teams in the league. We're 16-12, 6th best team in the West. He has been the second best player in a playoff team right now, and we did face some good teams so far. And I know he isn't a number 2 guy on a contending team, I didn't say that. But he has been the second best player on the team, and the team has exceed expectations. That's it.
    Rockets | Texans | Astros

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by EDUTEXANS View Post
    I'm not saying that, I'm saying it's easier to replace PFs than SFs. If we trade Parsons, who could we raplace him with?
    Why not Morris? He's not ideal, but he has the shooting chops to play SF and he can defend the 3 well enough. Offensively, he wouldn't be a huge dropoff in terms of production from Parsons. He's nowhere near as good of an all around player, but it's not a monumental drop.

    At PF, Jefferson, Smith and Millspa are FAs next year and Cousins and Gasol will porbably be in the market and both will be FAs the year after next.
    But this is on the assumption that one of those guys will necessarily be available. We don't know that yet. Also, Aldridge is the most reliable of those guys mentioned and if the Rockets can get him without moving Asik or Harden, they can easily justify that move.

    I don't care what advanced numbers say, always look at his simple stats first, he has been pretty bad. He is a scorer, a shooter who doesn't provide much else, and he has been extremely inefficient.
    You're contradicting yourself. You say don't look at advanced stats, but then rip him for being inefficient. But advanced stats say he's inefficient, but not terribly so. In fact, his career .573 TS% is well above average. Consider that even though he only shoots 39% from the floor, he gets to the line 5 times a game and shoots better than 80%. That makes him efficient. He's also a very good rebounder, passer and defender for his position. And he rarely turns the ball over.

    But we're not one of the worst teams in the league. We're 16-12, 6th best team in the West. He has been the second best player in a playoff team right now, and we did face some good teams so far. And I know he isn't a number 2 guy on a contending team, I didn't say that. But he has been the second best player on the team, and the team has exceed expectations. That's it.
    Then you're proving my point. He's the second best player on a team that is not in contention. Look at any contender in the NBA and Parsons would probably be the fourth best player talent-wise on their roster. If the Rockets are going to win a championship, Parsons cannot be the second best player on their team. If he has to get dealt to get a player that could bring them a title, they could definitely justify trading him.


  6. #216
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    I'm not gonna discuss about Matthews with a Portland fan as I haven't watched more Portland games than you, I hope. But Matthews' numbers seem pretty good and Batum has been amazing. And you're getting a player at one of the two position you don't need IMO.
    The high was good while it lasted
    Wes's numbers arent good, closer to being decent than anything. He starts for us out of necessity but he is ideally a 6th man. From Portlands perspective we still would need an infusion of new talent, Parsons is on a cap friendly contract and Batum has played the 2 guard at multiple times in hit career.

    Based on what? Tell me why Millsap is overated, why Gasol sucks and how really has Aldridge proved can be a first guy as he hasn't won a series in the playoffs in his carreer. Then we could have a discussion.
    Milsap is overrated because I say he is, and Gasol is old and has been on a steady decline for years. Also if your definition of proving to be a capable number one option is gettin out of the first round then I guess Tmac wasn't a capable number one.
    Last edited by b@llhog24; 12-28-2012 at 02:06 AM.


    Quote Originally Posted by rhymeratic View Post
    Shoot I'd even put up Glen Rice and Mitch Richmond in their prime at or slightly better than James. Even Glenn Robinson who is a forgotten beast.


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  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    Why not Morris? He's not ideal, but he has the shooting chops to play SF and he can defend the 3 well enough. Offensively, he wouldn't be a huge dropoff in terms of production from Parsons. He's nowhere near as good of an all around player, but it's not a monumental drop.
    Didn't most people on here want to cut Morris before the season started, now you want him to start if we trade Chandler ? We simply should not trade him, main reason I just ordered his jersey only 2 days ago.

  8. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by b@llhog24 View Post
    Wes's numbers arent good, closer to being decent than anything. He starts for us out of necessity but he is ideally a 6th man. From Portlands perspective we still would need an infusion of new talent, Parsons is on a cap friendly contract and Batum has played the 2 guard at multiple times in hit career.



    Milsap is overrated because I say he is, and Gasol is old and has been on a steady decline for years. Also if your definition of proving to be a capable number one option is gettin out of the first round then I guess Tmac wasn't a capable number one.

    Your post is pointless, cause I say it is.

    I saw MBT kinda contradict himself in a way,but not in a bad way. Our fanbase has to realize that our only KEEPER is Harden. We can't build around Parsons. I'd love for him to br a Rocket forever, but a player of LMA's level would quickly make me forget.

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  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by sep11ie:24882960
    Quote Originally Posted by b@llhog24 View Post
    Wes's numbers arent good, closer to being decent than anything. He starts for us out of necessity but he is ideally a 6th man. From Portlands perspective we still would need an infusion of new talent, Parsons is on a cap friendly contract and Batum has played the 2 guard at multiple times in hit career.



    Milsap is overrated because I say he is, and Gasol is old and has been on a steady decline for years. Also if your definition of proving to be a capable number one option is gettin out of the first round then I guess Tmac wasn't a capable number one.

    Your post is pointless, cause I say it is.

    I saw MBT kinda contradict himself in a way,but not in a bad way. Our fanbase has to realize that our only KEEPER is Harden. We can't build around Parsons. I'd love for him to br a Rocket forever, but a player of LMA's level would quickly make me forget.
    Well that's always nice.


    Quote Originally Posted by rhymeratic View Post
    Shoot I'd even put up Glen Rice and Mitch Richmond in their prime at or slightly better than James. Even Glenn Robinson who is a forgotten beast.


    Quote Originally Posted by LoveMeOrHateMe View Post
    Kobe GOAT LOL
    ^Finally got one.

  10. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMAC94:24882796
    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    Why not Morris? He's not ideal, but he has the shooting chops to play SF and he can defend the 3 well enough. Offensively, he wouldn't be a huge dropoff in terms of production from Parsons. He's nowhere near as good of an all around player, but it's not a monumental drop.
    Didn't most people on here want to cut Morris before the season started, now you want him to start if we trade Chandler ? We simply should not trade him, main reason I just ordered his jersey only 2 days ago.


    Quote Originally Posted by rhymeratic View Post
    Shoot I'd even put up Glen Rice and Mitch Richmond in their prime at or slightly better than James. Even Glenn Robinson who is a forgotten beast.


    Quote Originally Posted by LoveMeOrHateMe View Post
    Kobe GOAT LOL
    ^Finally got one.

  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    Why not Morris? He's not ideal, but he has the shooting chops to play SF and he can defend the 3 well enough. Offensively, he wouldn't be a huge dropoff in terms of production from Parsons. He's nowhere near as good of an all around player, but it's not a monumental drop.


    But this is on the assumption that one of those guys will necessarily be available. We don't know that yet. Also, Aldridge is the most reliable of those guys mentioned and if the Rockets can get him without moving Asik or Harden, they can easily justify that move.


    You're contradicting yourself. You say don't look at advanced stats, but then rip him for being inefficient. But advanced stats say he's inefficient, but not terribly so. In fact, his career .573 TS% is well above average. Consider that even though he only shoots 39% from the floor, he gets to the line 5 times a game and shoots better than 80%. That makes him efficient. He's also a very good rebounder, passer and defender for his position. And he rarely turns the ball over.


    Then you're proving my point. He's the second best player on a team that is not in contention. Look at any contender in the NBA and Parsons would probably be the fourth best player talent-wise on their roster. If the Rockets are going to win a championship, Parsons cannot be the second best player on their team. If he has to get dealt to get a player that could bring them a title, they could definitely justify trading him.
    That bolded part is exactly the whole point that got this discussion started. It's not about Parsons being replacable or Gallinari's advanced stats (lol). The point is, we could throw our assets at Aldridge now and build around Lin/Harden/Aldridge/Asik OR we could keep this core and keep all other options open.

    So basically repeating what Edu and I were trying to make clear (I'm assuming that was what he meant as well): If you take Aldridge, you settle for that roster and for those guys as your final core. If you keep Parsons, you have a million other options, whether that'd be Millsap, Josh Smith, Chris Paul, waiting till 2014 FA or developing one of our rookies.

    And in this particular case I'd rather keep Parsons and await our options rather than throwing our money and tradeable pieces at Aldridge and hope to contend with these guys now. Because honestly, with Harden being a first option, Aldridge being a second and Lin being a third I see us making a terrific run but in the end we wouldn't stand a chance against the real Elite teams anyways.
    Last edited by BSardogan; 12-28-2012 at 08:38 AM.


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  12. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMAC94 View Post
    Didn't most people on here want to cut Morris before the season started, now you want him to start if we trade Chandler ? We simply should not trade him, main reason I just ordered his jersey only 2 days ago.
    Dude, Morris is starting right now. Would you rather have Parsons and Morris at the forward spots or Morris and Aldridge? My point is simply that Parsons is hardly irreplaceable in terms of talent.

    Quote Originally Posted by sep11ie View Post
    Your post is pointless, cause I say it is.

    I saw MBT kinda contradict himself in a way,but not in a bad way. Our fanbase has to realize that our only KEEPER is Harden. We can't build around Parsons. I'd love for him to br a Rocket forever, but a player of LMA's level would quickly make me forget.
    I realize I contradicted myself. But the point I'm trying to make is that, at some point, you have to stop trading every likable fan favorite and start letting your fan base get acquainted with your roster. Morey has been criticized for dealing every player the second he gets a chance to, but it's been worth it to get to this point. BUT, not only will your fans start to hate you, but incoming free agents will start to take notice of your lack of loyalty.

    If the Rockets can build a contender without dealing Parsons, that should be their first priority. But if Morey sees a way to get a top 5 PF or C and Parsons has to get dealt, I suppose I'd be okay with it in the long run.


  13. #223
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone View Post
    Dude, Morris is starting right now. Would you rather have Parsons and Morris at the forward spots or Morris and Aldridge? My point is simply that Parsons is hardly irreplaceable in terms of talent.
    Parsons and Aldridge

  14. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by TMAC94 View Post
    Parsons and Aldridge
    Wow...so you legitimately believe that Parsons is a better basketball player than Aldridge? How? Based on what?


  15. #225
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    Quote Originally Posted by mightybosstone:24885064
    Quote Originally Posted by TMAC94 View Post
    Parsons and Aldridge
    Wow...so you legitimately believe that Parsons is a better basketball player than Aldridge? How? Based on what?
    I think he wants both of Parsons and Aldridge instead of LA and Morris.

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