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  1. #16
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    well this thread is dumb
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  2. #17
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    I want to change this forum to another set of A's and B's

    Derozen or Bargnani
    Ross or Derozen
    Lowry or Valaciunas

    I don't think the problem is that we have too many players who do the same thing (other then Ed-Amir and Kleiza-Fields), I think it's that we don't have an identity.

    Do we want to be a high octane offense or a half court team? Do we want to be a zone defense or build a great personnel for a man defense. Are we a balanced team, jump shooting team, or interior team offensively?

    All of these questions are unanswered because our roster consistently is mixing and matching pieces that don't fit together.

    If we want to be a running team, then build around Lowry, DD, Ross, Davis and Valanciunas and get rid of Bargnani, Calderon and others.

    If we want to be a half court team, then build around Lowry, DD, Ross, Bargnani and Valanciunas, get proper backup PG and C and go from there.

    If we want a zone based defense, keep the guys above because they fit the scheme and have the most potential as an offensive unit.

    If we want that Thiboudou-esk man defense, then Lowry, Ross, Valanciunas, Davis and maybe Derozen are here to stay.

    See guys, the problem is we simply sign players without thinking how they fit into the scheme of thigns because I don't thinkour management truly understands what it is they want to put onto that hardcourt.

    Right now, we are a team without an identity, without a reputation, without any other descriptor other then "basketball team".

    We need to gain an identity and acquire proper pieces to make it work. If we want a defense, trade for a guy like Varajeo. If we want offense, then go sign a Kevin Martin and we can be that 110 PPG team every team knows it'll have to outscore.

    Either way, choose a direction.
    Where Pick n Roll...Pick and Roll...Pick and Roll...Rebound Happens

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps Insider 12 View Post
    I am with you 100% but the DD hopefuls will cut you to pieces.
    Ross has two things that I like in a starting SG: defense and shooting.

    I know what I see with DeRozan, I've seen it for years, and it hasn't changed a whole lot. I don't think DeRozan stinks, I just don't look at him as a championship calibre wing player. Can't play D and can't stretch the D. You can't even look at him as an Andre Iguodala type, and it's debatable if AI2 is the type of SG/SF you want helping you win a championship.

    I've argued it for a long time and done a lot of work to back up my views, so I don't care to do it all again. Let them cut me to pieces, and I'll let them be wrong.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tmath View Post
    Giving up way too much
    Lmao in no way at all is that giving up too much, I never understand half of you guys on here just expect to trade away bums and get ok to great players.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dol-Fan View Post
    Valanciunas
    Ross
    Davis

    Valanciunas because I'd rather have a premier C than PG. Love Lowry to death but I gotta go with the big man here.

    Ross because he's an unknown. I already know that I'm not confident in DD. Ross could end up being worse, no doubt, but it's not like DD is anything special.

    I just dislike Bargnani. Would take Ed's limited offense and millionx better D any day.
    Derozan has been the only bright spot for the raptors all season(which isn't that much) but still like he was the 9th pick wth do you want him to do?

  6. #21
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    Jonas, Ed and Ross.. thats too easy come on
    We are Anonymous,
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    Expect us

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dol-Fan View Post
    Ross has two things that I like in a starting SG: defense and shooting.

    I know what I see with DeRozan, I've seen it for years, and it hasn't changed a whole lot. I don't think DeRozan stinks, I just don't look at him as a championship calibre wing player. Can't play D and can't stretch the D. You can't even look at him as an Andre Iguodala type, and it's debatable if AI2 is the type of SG/SF you want helping you win a championship.

    I've argued it for a long time and done a lot of work to back up my views, so I don't care to do it all again. Let them cut me to pieces, and I'll let them be wrong.
    He has shown signficant enough improvement in keys areas since his rookie season that I can see the value he can bring to the team. I agree he won't ever be a star and is unlikely to be a championship calibre wing "starter." But I think he could be an exceptional sixth man with his ability to run the floor, post up smaller defenders and get to the basket. Unless he magically improves on the two areas you noted (shooting and defense), it is hard to see him developing into anything more.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by I Rock Shaqs View Post
    Derozan has been the only bright spot for the raptors all season(which isn't that much) but still like he was the 9th pick wth do you want him to do?
    Read my post above. I think my criticisms are fair. I like DeRozan but don't think he's got the skill set to be a starting wing on a championship team. Great 6th man though with his ability to drive/get to the FT line and knock down the mid-range.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by pebloemer View Post
    He has shown signficant enough improvement in keys areas since his rookie season that I can see the value he can bring to the team. I agree he won't ever be a star and is unlikely to be a championship calibre wing "starter." But I think he could be an exceptional sixth man with his ability to run the floor, post up smaller defenders and get to the basket. Unless he magically improves on the two areas you noted (shooting and defense), it is hard to see him developing into anything more.
    Definitely. His handle has gotten better, his mid-range has gotten better, his confidence/assertiveness has improved. He's got value, just not the skill set I want in my starting 2.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Il Mago50 View Post
    I want to change this forum to another set of A's and B's

    Derozen or Bargnani
    Ross or Derozen
    Lowry or Valaciunas

    I don't think the problem is that we have too many players who do the same thing (other then Ed-Amir and Kleiza-Fields), I think it's that we don't have an identity.

    Do we want to be a high octane offense or a half court team? Do we want to be a zone defense or build a great personnel for a man defense. Are we a balanced team, jump shooting team, or interior team offensively?

    All of these questions are unanswered because our roster consistently is mixing and matching pieces that don't fit together.

    If we want to be a running team, then build around Lowry, DD, Ross, Davis and Valanciunas and get rid of Bargnani, Calderon and others.

    If we want to be a half court team, then build around Lowry, DD, Ross, Bargnani and Valanciunas, get proper backup PG and C and go from there.

    If we want a zone based defense, keep the guys above because they fit the scheme and have the most potential as an offensive unit.

    If we want that Thiboudou-esk man defense, then Lowry, Ross, Valanciunas, Davis and maybe Derozen are here to stay.

    See guys, the problem is we simply sign players without thinking how they fit into the scheme of thigns because I don't thinkour management truly understands what it is they want to put onto that hardcourt.

    Right now, we are a team without an identity, without a reputation, without any other descriptor other then "basketball team".

    We need to gain an identity and acquire proper pieces to make it work. If we want a defense, trade for a guy like Varajeo. If we want offense, then go sign a Kevin Martin and we can be that 110 PPG team every team knows it'll have to outscore.

    Either way, choose a direction.
    did you mean to put Derozan in 2 of those pairings?

    i'll assume you did. my choices are:

    Bargnani
    Ross
    Valanciunas
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick O View Post
    well this thread is dumb


    Lol I'll try harder next time

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    did you mean to put Derozan in 2 of those pairings?

    i'll assume you did. my choices are:

    Bargnani
    Ross
    Valanciunas
    I'm surprised u took Bargs over derozan

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by smith&wesson View Post
    I'm surprised u took Bargs over derozan
    you shouldn't be. i think he could be a marvelous weapon in the right circumstances.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  14. #29
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    You made it so easy to pick between.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    did you mean to put Derozan in 2 of those pairings?

    i'll assume you did. my choices are:

    Bargnani
    Ross
    Valanciunas
    Yeah I did because those two are the "stars" of the team aside from Lowry. I'd go the same direction as you did too.
    Where Pick n Roll...Pick and Roll...Pick and Roll...Rebound Happens

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