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View Poll Results: If you had a vote, select who you would vote for (note: max of 10 votes per person)

Voters
293. You may not vote on this poll
  • Barry Bonds

    173 59.04%
  • Roger Clemens

    149 50.85%
  • Curt Schilling

    140 47.78%
  • Craig Biggio

    181 61.77%
  • Kenny Lofton

    40 13.65%
  • Sammy Sosa

    74 25.26%
  • Mike Piazza

    222 75.77%
  • Jack Morris

    54 18.43%
  • Jeff Bagwell

    162 55.29%
  • Lee Smith

    46 15.70%
  • Tim Raines

    80 27.30%
  • Alan Trammell

    58 19.80%
  • Edgar Martinez

    112 38.23%
  • Fred McGriff

    49 16.72%
  • Larry Walker

    83 28.33%
  • Mark McGwire

    80 27.30%
  • Don Mattingly

    75 25.60%
  • Dale Murphy

    35 11.95%
  • Rafael Palmerio

    38 12.97%
  • Bernie Williams

    53 18.09%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Results 136 to 150 of 442
  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    (we have no idea how much, if any it actually affects a players numbers)
    If any? You don't think a 37 old who all of a sudden belts 73 homers is a little suspicious?
    I remember Sosa well when he came up after being traded to the Sox. He was a little guy with a big swing with warning track power at best who hit 11(!) homers as a career best in the minors. And I should believe that steroids didn't have any effect in seeing him crank 60+ homers built like a fullback?


    To deny that steroids had a huge effect on a offensive outburst that was unprecedented and slowly went away when a stricter testing policy was put in place is oblivious.

  2. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by keymax View Post
    If any? You don't think a 37 old who all of a sudden belts 73 homers is a little suspicious?
    I remember Sosa well when he came up after being traded to the Sox. He was a little guy with a big swing with warning track power at best who hit 11(!) homers as a career best in the minors. And I should believe that steroids didn't have any effect in seeing him crank 60+ homers built like a fullback?


    To deny that steroids had a huge effect on a offensive outburst that was unprecedented and slowly went away when a stricter testing policy was put in place is oblivious.
    We don't know how much, that much is clear.

    And of course it's suspicious. But I don't know how much it really affects the actual on field numbers. I can take an educated, common sense guess. But there are also a slew of players who didn't perform better even with proven tests.

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    I would agree ignorance and innuendo is why he didn't get in yet, but the 2nd year it seems some amount of ignorance was dispelled as his vote total went up. 41.7% > 56%.

    By any reasonable examination, he's a top 6 1B all time, and easily the best all around player of the bunch.
    I have nothing against Bagwell. It was always fun to compare Big Frank with him since, as you may know, they were born on the same day.

    Maybe they go in together as well

  4. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by dodgerdave View Post
    Biggio is the only player I voted for. The other players are either simply non-deserving, were steroid users, or were possibly steroid users. And I wouldn't vote for any possible steroid users until that list of 100+ positive tests from 2003 comes out of the closet. Sosa and A-Rod were leaked out, so the rest should be leaked out.

    Bagwell's spike in OPS from pre-1994 to 1994 (especially) and possibly (1996-2003) looks unnatural and had a close connection to Ken Caminiti. Piazza was considered clean until he had some suspicious acne on his back and got fatter/bulkier late in his Mets career.
    Bagwell's 1993 (.903) seaaon is within .142 OPS of any of the following 12 seasons except 1994.

    This is very much like Helton's pre season (.981) - within .107 of every other year he had outside of Y2K.

    BTW, adjusted for park Bagwell's '93 was a .914 OPS and Helton's was a .847.

    Lots of other guys had a power surge in their 20's. Thome, Ortiz, Bautista and plenty more.... if this is the extent of your evidence....


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  5. #140
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    Ahhh the steroid ignorance once again. Lol steroids make you hit the ball farther! Lol ya no iys not hard work in the gym or a gift. Steroids wont give you hand eye coordination. Please people do your steroid research. All of those guys deserve too be in. In their time era they were the BEST. Who are the voters or anyone else to pass judgement on anyone without 100% true facts. I think he did so im not voting is stupid honestly disqualify one with out the facts disqualify the entire era. You truely dont know who did them. And for those that did you have to have the talent steroids dont make you a hall of fame caliber player.
    Last edited by cubbiefan_est88; 11-28-2012 at 05:35 PM.

  6. #141
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    I haven't really been following, but something I was wondering. just watching PTI and when asked, Kornheiser said he would vote for Bonds/Clemans/Sosa, but not in the first year. I don't understand this. what is going to change from this year to next year? nothing. they're done playing, their stats are what they are.
    maybe not voting them in for the first year of eligibility is a way of punishing them? just seems childish to me. numbers alone are HOF worthy. now if you feel they cheated and want to punish them, don't vote for them at all.

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  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpecialFNK View Post
    I haven't really been following, but something I was wondering. just watching PTI and when asked, Kornheiser said he would vote for Bonds/Clemans/Sosa, but not in the first year. I don't understand this. what is going to change from this year to next year? nothing. they're done playing, their stats are what they are.
    maybe not voting them in for the first year of eligibility is a way of punishing them? just seems childish to me. numbers alone are HOF worthy. now if you feel they cheated and want to punish them, don't vote for them at all.
    HOF voters are big on symbolic, ultimately meaningless gestures. In his defense, it still makes more sense than keeping them all out.
    2013

  8. #143
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    Only five Hall of Famers have hit more home runs while hitting for a higher average than Mike Piazza: Stan Musial, Lou Gehrig, Ted Williams, Jimmie Foxx and Babe Ruth.

    Says it all for me. Piazza should be a lock. I know there is circumstantial evidence and people have questions, but this guy deserves to be in the HOF
    “It's still a game and you'd rather win it than lose it.”



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  9. #144
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    Biggio
    Morris
    Piazza
    Smith
    Raines
    Murphy
    Bagwell
    Walker
    Martinez
    Trammel
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  10. #145
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    Bagwell, Schilling, Raines would be on my ballot.
    I don't think Trammell is worthy, because I don't trust fielding metrics calculated for games that were played in the 80s. By the eye test he isn't a hall of famer.
    And as I already said, I would rather vote for Todd van Poppel before I'd consider Bonds et al.

    edit: forgot Piazza but whatever...

  11. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by keymax:24496622
    Bagwell, Schilling, Raines would be on my ballot.
    I don't think Trammell is worthy, because I don't trust fielding metrics calculated for games that were played in the 80s. By the eye test he isn't a hall of famer.
    And as I already said, I would rather vote for Todd van Poppel before I'd consider Bonds et al.

    edit: forgot Piazza but whatever...
    Bagwell was steroid era who is to say he didnt juice?

  12. #147
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    I'd let basically all of them in , however the 11 would be:
    Bonds; Clemens, Sosa, Piazza, Raines, Bagwell, Edgar, McGwire, Mattingly, Biggio, and Raphael Palmiero.
    Last edited by Cosmic_Canon; 11-28-2012 at 07:25 PM.
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  13. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubbiefan_est88 View Post
    Bagwell was steroid era who is to say he didnt juice?
    Nobody but I don't know better.
    we're talking about a fictional hall of fame vote, I'm not puttig anyone on death row.

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubbiefan_est88 View Post
    Ahhh the steroid ignorance once again. Lol steroids make you hit the ball farther! Lol ya no iys not hard work in the gym or a gift. Steroids wont give you hand eye coordination. Please people do your steroid research. All of those guys deserve too be in. In their time era they were the BEST. Who are the voters or anyone else to pass judgement on anyone without 100% true facts. I think he did so im not voting is stupid honestly disqualify one with out the facts disqualify the entire era. You truely dont know who did them. And for those that did you have to have the talent steroids dont make you a hall of fame caliber player.
    Explain Mark McGwire before 1992, and after. Explain how a .201 hitter, started getting huge with acne all over his back, and explain how he'd have gotten all the BB's and HR's and even an opportunity to get them w/o the stuff?

    Explain to me the normal decline of players age 35-40, even elite HOF hitters, and then explain Bonds's explosion in that age range - never seen before.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  15. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by cubbiefan_est88 View Post
    Bagwell was steroid era who is to say he didnt juice?
    Evidence.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

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