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View Poll Results: If you had a vote, select who you would vote for (note: max of 10 votes per person)

Voters
293. You may not vote on this poll
  • Barry Bonds

    173 59.04%
  • Roger Clemens

    149 50.85%
  • Curt Schilling

    140 47.78%
  • Craig Biggio

    181 61.77%
  • Kenny Lofton

    40 13.65%
  • Sammy Sosa

    74 25.26%
  • Mike Piazza

    222 75.77%
  • Jack Morris

    54 18.43%
  • Jeff Bagwell

    162 55.29%
  • Lee Smith

    46 15.70%
  • Tim Raines

    80 27.30%
  • Alan Trammell

    58 19.80%
  • Edgar Martinez

    112 38.23%
  • Fred McGriff

    49 16.72%
  • Larry Walker

    83 28.33%
  • Mark McGwire

    80 27.30%
  • Don Mattingly

    75 25.60%
  • Dale Murphy

    35 11.95%
  • Rafael Palmerio

    38 12.97%
  • Bernie Williams

    53 18.09%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Results 121 to 135 of 442
  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by atl_braves_fan View Post
    ^^ it is not a court of law, but it is a history museum. Picking and choosing what stories you want to tell and burying other stories that clearly have historical significance is not how history should work.
    Well I agree to some extent. They should tell the whole story then and have a "steroid wing" and induct them with an asterisk attached to them because we don't know the validit of their achievements.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    It's inuendo. I wrote a piece about 3-4 months delving deeply into the false crap written about him. There isn't anything passing muster against him, just whispers, guesses, and several ill informed judgmental tool bags bereft of the merest clue of what they were talking about.
    same with Piazza

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by keymax View Post
    I don't know the validity of the reports that have linked him back then, but wouldn't you agree that this is the biggest reason he didn't make it in 2 tries?
    I would agree ignorance and innuendo is why he didn't get in yet, but the 2nd year it seems some amount of ignorance was dispelled as his vote total went up. 41.7% > 56%.

    By any reasonable examination, he's a top 6 1B all time, and easily the best all around player of the bunch.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by keymax View Post
    Well I agree to some extent. They should tell the whole story then and have a "steroid wing" and induct them with an asterisk attached to them because we don't know the validit of their achievements.
    Are you going to have the "coke" wing for guys in the 20's, 30's, 70's, 80's, 90's?

    How about a greenie wing for every decade since the 40's?

    How about the hot dogs and beer wing for Ruth and co?

    How about the racist/murderer wing for Cobb?

    Where does it stop? Ozzie and Harriet?


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by ciaban View Post
    same with Piazza
    As a catcher he's got less guys to push against. I'll have to see to vote, and listen to the comments of any holier then thou voters that might spill the beans here.

    BTW, what's wrong with Walker? PED's or Coors? He's a HOF in my book.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    As a catcher he's got less guys to push against. I'll have to see to vote, and listen to the comments of any holier then thou voters that might spill the beans here.

    BTW, what's wrong with Walker? PED's or Coors? He's a HOF in my book.
    I have him too

    My 10 are:

    Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Jeff Bagwell, Tim Raines, Curt Schilling, Craig Biggio, Kenny Lofton, Mike Piazza, Edgar Martinez, Larry Walker


    I feel Alan Trammel deserves it as well, but I left him off in favor of Tim Raines. Trammel, Walker, Lofton, Biggio, and Raines are the most borderline choices for me, and someone had to be left off, I haven't put enough thought into why I chose Trammel, or if I actually had a vote, if that is what I would actually do.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Are you going to have the "coke" wing for guys in the 20's, 30's, 70's, 80's, 90's?

    How about a greenie wing for every decade since the 40's?

    How about the hot dogs and beer wing for Ruth and co?

    How about the racist/murderer wing for Cobb?

    Where does it stop? Ozzie and Harriet?
    I know that cheating has always been a part of baseball. But the amount of records that were obliterated during that time is just too obvious to completely ignore it. Look at some players during that era. Richard Hidalgo for criying out loud posted a 314/.391/.636 line with 44 homers, 122 RBI, 118 runs, 42 doubles, 13 stolen bases. He finished 20th in the NL MVP vote.

    It is pretty safe to say that steroids had a more severe influence in skewing those numbers than any amount of greenies ever had.

    Any way you look at it the BBWAA really has a mess on their hands. Especially after those writers lauded Sosa and McGwire for their ludicrous HR race that made a mockery of this sport.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by keymax View Post
    I know that cheating has always been a part of baseball. But the amount of records that were obliterated during that time is just too obvious to completely ignore it. Look at some players during that era. Richard Hidalgo for criying out loud posted a 314/.391/.636 line with 44 homers, 122 RBI, 118 runs, 42 doubles, 13 stolen bases. He finished 20th in the NL MVP vote.

    It is pretty safe to say that steroids had a more severe influence in skewing those numbers than any amount of greenies ever had.

    Any way you look at it the BBWAA really has a mess on their hands. Especially after those writers lauded Sosa and McGwire for their ludicrous HR race that made a mockery of this sport.
    It wasn't the writer's fault, they were just reporting what was happening. It was the fault of Selig and his minions, who looked the other way to line their pockets.

    If any of those scumbags (Selig and his boys) get in the Hall, that will be the real disgrace.

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    I have him too
    I left Raines off and put Trammell in due to positional scarcity. Trammell is what? #6 or #7 all time SS. Raines, depending on where you count Musial must be a bit lower.

    I think the rest of the list is the same.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Are you going to have the "coke" wing for guys in the 20's, 30's, 70's, 80's, 90's?

    How about a greenie wing for every decade since the 40's?

    How about the hot dogs and beer wing for Ruth and co?

    How about the racist/murderer wing for Cobb?

    Where does it stop? Ozzie and Harriet?
    Let's not even start on the Klan wing for people like Tris Speaker.

  11. #131
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    Biggio is the only player I voted for. The other players are either simply non-deserving, were steroid users, or were possibly steroid users. And I wouldn't vote for any possible steroid users until that list of 100+ positive tests from 2003 comes out of the closet. Sosa and A-Rod were leaked out, so the rest should be leaked out.

    Bagwell's spike in OPS from pre-1994 to 1994 (especially) and possibly (1996-2003) looks unnatural and had a close connection to Ken Caminiti. Piazza was considered clean until he had some suspicious acne on his back and got fatter/bulkier late in his Mets career.
    Last edited by dodgerdave; 11-28-2012 at 03:43 PM.

    Future Hall of Shamers:
    (1) B.A.L.C.O. Barroids (2) Mark McJuicer (3) Jose Chem-seco (4) Rafael Palmeiroids (5) Ken Chem-initi (6) Jason Gi-andro (7) Ryan Fraud (8) Muscle Melk (9) Woman-Ram (10) Shammy Sosa (11) Roger Clear-mens (12) A-Roid

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by dodgerdave View Post
    Biggio is the only player I voted for. The other players are either simply non-deserving, were steroid users, or were possibly steroid users. And I wouldn't vote for any possible steroid users until that list of 100+ positive tests from 2003 comes out of the closet. Sosa and A-Rod were leaked out, so the rest should be leaked out.

    Bagwell's spike in OPS from pre-1994 to 1994 (especially) and possibly (1996-2003) looks unnatural and had a close connection to Ken Caminiti. Piazza was considered clean until he had some suspicious acne on his back and got fatter/bulkier late in his Mets career.
    You realize that it is highly speculated that Biggio used PEDs, right?


    I find it interesting when people accuse people of potentially using PEDs because of a spike in performance as their reasoning (we have no idea how much, if any it actually affects a players numbers) during their prime playing years, and on noticing that a player got bigger as they aged. That is not enough proof to 'send an innocent man to jail' so to speak. People will 'crucify' others for such little evidence, it's unmanning.

    That, and we have several known cheaters in the hall of fame, and one steroid user. Why are we making these judgments?
    Last edited by Jeffy25; 11-28-2012 at 03:50 PM.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    My 10 are:

    Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Jeff Bagwell, Tim Raines, Curt Schilling, Craig Biggio, Kenny Lofton, Mike Piazza, Edgar Martinez, Larry Walker


    I feel Alan Trammel deserves it as well, but I left him off in favor of Tim Raines. Trammel, Walker, Lofton, Biggio, and Raines are the most borderline choices for me, and someone had to be left off, I haven't put enough thought into why I chose Trammel, or if I actually had a vote, if that is what I would actually do.


    Note: I had to edit my original vote because I accidentally still had Trammell selected on my vote, so I had to hit edit, and change my vote. So that's why my name is still next to his as a vote, but I didn't affect the number.
    I voted the same you did but only went with 9. Didn't include Edgar

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    I left Raines off and put Trammell in due to positional scarcity. Trammell is what? #6 or #7 all time SS. Raines, depending on where you count Musial must be a bit lower.

    I think the rest of the list is the same.
    Yeah. And I wouldn't fight you on it.

    I think both deserve to be in, but the limit is 10, and I have 11 that I feel deserve.

  15. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Max Power View Post
    It wasn't the writer's fault, they were just reporting what was happening. It was the fault of Selig and his minions, who looked the other way to line their pockets.

    If any of those scumbags (Selig and his boys) get in the Hall, that will be the real disgrace.
    Especially while Marvin Miller isn't in

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