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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    umm. that's because you are making a giant assumption.

    and i'm talking about being more vocal on the court not complaining to the league.
    What assumption?.

  2. #77
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    well from now on moving forward, we have put the benefit of the doubt in the minds of the league's officials. They will def make more of an effort and we'll come out in times like those.

    but i'm all for Shabazz in 2013 and Wiggins in 2014. LAUGHS

    ^ thats a solid foundation at the wing positions.



  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    i think we can be more vocal and assertive without getting a reputation for complaining on every play. there is a very fine line here.
    100%
    I've seen a few posts that say we need to shed the label of "soft" by going at the refs.... I think that's the wrong way of going about it. We can show displeasure with the calls without going directly at the refs. Besides, that's the last thing we need is to go from getting no calls because we have a rep for being soft to getting no calls because the refs don't want to fall for our whining. I think playing through the lumps and taking the hits will be the way we'll get more respect from the refs.
    .....also, we need to start taking accountability for missed free throws. If we'd hit a decent amount in the last few games there might not even have been an issue.


    "Juuuuuuuuuuuuust a bit outside. Wild Thing tried for the corner and missed."

  4. #79
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    Jamie you realize the soft spoken Calderon who rarely complains got a tech vs Indy on a stretch where they were looking to cut a 9 point Raptor lead. Followed by a clear path on Klieza who was side by side the apposing player chasing the ball down.

    If there is a reffing agenda for a game (whatever reason, popular bias, sport betting etc..) being vocal on court is not going to have a positive effect.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by B2B View Post
    What assumption?.
    that there is a direct correlation between the complaints and this particular incident where the NBA admitted fault.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by B2B View Post
    Jamie you realize the soft spoken Calderon who rarely complains got a tech vs Indy on a stretch where they were looking to cut a 9 point Raptor lead. Followed by a clear path on Klieza who was side by side the apposing player chasing the ball down.
    the implication being that Calderon was unfairly t'd up? or that he was so frustrated by bad calls that he lost his cool?

    Quote Originally Posted by B2B View Post
    If there is a reffing agenda for a game (whatever reason, popular bias, sport betting etc..) being vocal on court is not going to have a positive effect.
    i agree with you. but if there is a reffing agenda and the people in charge of this league saw it that way i'm sure they would do something about it. unless of course they are overseeing it. in either case i don't think complaints from the Raptors front office will make a bit of difference.
    Quote Originally Posted by nycericanguy View Post
    well unfortunately it looks like you were right about Bargs...

    but hopefully we can use his expiring, if not at least we unloaded Novak's deal...

  7. #82
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    I think some of the calls are based on the players reputation.

    Example: Artest swung his arm hitting Lin when Lin tried to pulled him down while making a layup, refs without hesitation called a flagrant 1. I don't know if there was really an intent to hurt as far as Artest is concerned but because refs already have this preconceived notion that he is a dirty player, a call was made. If we switch the table and it was Artest who pulled Lin down, I am sure that act was called a flagrant.

    Most of the Raptors have these reputation for being soft. IMO this is one of the reason that they don't get these "star preferred calls".

    Amir on the other hand has the reputation to be foul prone so his mere presence on the team IMO is detrimental to their progress going forward.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    the implication being that Calderon was unfairly t'd up? or that he was so frustrated by bad calls that he lost his cool?
    True, he was unfairly treated lost his cool & t'd up, have you ever seen Wade complain to officials..

    What's a t for Calderon, is not a t for Wade. Being vocal for a team that doesn't get the same respect, could be a negative. Especially if there's any kind of agenda or mandate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jamiecballer View Post
    i agree with you. but if there is a reffing agenda and the people in charge of this league saw it that way i'm sure they would do something about it. unless of course they are overseeing it. in either case i don't think complaints from the Raptors front office will make a bit of difference.
    My opinion is if they are corrupt which I think some are for various reasons, you have to call them out & put a spot light on them. Instead of politely pleading for equal favor.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps Insider 12 View Post
    I think some of the calls are based on the players reputation.

    Example: Artest swung his arm hitting Lin when Lin tried to pulled him down while making a layup, refs without hesitation called a flagrant 1. I don't know if there was really an intent to hurt as far as Artest is concerned but because refs already have this preconceived notion that he is a dirty player, a call was made. If we switch the table and it was Artest who pulled Lin down, I am sure that act was called a flagrant.

    Most of the Raptors have these reputation for being soft. IMO this is one of the reason that they don't get these "star preferred calls".

    Amir on the other hand has the reputation to be foul prone so his mere presence on the team IMO is detrimental to their progress going forward.
    Lowry lost his individual reputation as a pit bull joining the Raptors?.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by B2B View Post
    Lowry lost his individual reputation as a pit bull joining the Raptors?.
    Some are tissue soft.

    Except Lowry, Kleiza and Val.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps Insider 12 View Post
    I think some of the calls are based on the players reputation.

    Example: Artest swung his arm hitting Lin when Lin tried to pulled him down while making a layup, refs without hesitation called a flagrant 1. I don't know if there was really an intent to hurt as far as Artest is concerned but because refs already have this preconceived notion that he is a dirty player, a call was made. If we switch the table and it was Artest who pulled Lin down, I am sure that act was called a flagrant.

    Most of the Raptors have these reputation for being soft. IMO this is one of the reason that they don't get these "star preferred calls".

    Amir on the other hand has the reputation to be foul prone so his mere presence on the team IMO is detrimental to their progress going forward.
    I've had this mindset. Demar is getting so much better at getting to the rim that even the refs haven't noticed that he's actually taking contact and making better basketball moves. They're used to watching him fly into traffic and just miss contested shots. THAT is what a reputation call is. When the refs have to make calls on the fly they're often looking at who the player is and what kind of plays they usually make. It's not perfect, but Basketball is known as the hardest sport to officiate for a reason.
    These are the kind of calls that will change throughout the season. It's the blatant ones (like that clear-path foul against Indy) that just make no sense. I have a feeling that our calls will be getting better by the all-star break.


    "Juuuuuuuuuuuuust a bit outside. Wild Thing tried for the corner and missed."

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps Insider 12 View Post
    Some are tissue soft.

    Except Lowry, Kleiza and Val.
    The only soft non aggressive players on roster are, Bargnani & Calderon..

    DeRozan attacks the rim at a very high rate & has done so for the last couple years. Amir, Ed, Acy I don't consider soft. Anderson, Mcguire? maybe Fields.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by C_Mund View Post
    I've had this mindset. Demar is getting so much better at getting to the rim that even the refs haven't noticed that he's actually taking contact and making better basketball moves. They're used to watching him fly into traffic and just miss contested shots. THAT is what a reputation call is. When the refs have to make calls on the fly they're often looking at who the player is and what kind of plays they usually make. It's not perfect, but Basketball is known as the hardest sport to officiate for a reason.
    These are the kind of calls that will change throughout the season. It's the blatant ones (like that clear-path foul against Indy) that just make no sense. I have a feeling that our calls will be getting better by the all-star break.
    Those blatant calls are exception to the norm IMO and I think that has something to do with the Refs.

    Example: the one that you mentioned and the one when a corrupt ref(B2B please remind me what his name again) called a 5 second inbound violation during a Lakers game with the raps playing at home up by 1.

    Going forward, I think the complaint will benefit the Raptors but it would help if BC acquires another Lowry type player as a legit no.1 option then I am sure this reputation will change especially if we are winning basketball games.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps Insider 12 View Post
    Those blatant calls are exception to the norm IMO and I think that has something to do with the Refs.

    Example: the one that you mentioned and the one when a corrupt ref(B2B please remind me what his name again) called a 5 second inbound violation during a Lakers game with the raps playing at home up by 1.

    Going forward, I think the complaint will benefit the Raptors but it would help if BC acquires another Lowry type player as a legit no.1 option then I am sure this reputation will change especially if we are winning basketball games.
    Foster - ties with Donaghy & big money bets.

    ^ Lead official in the Utah game.

    DeRozan 22-24 shots at the rim 7FT's
    Jefferson 8 shots at the rim & 10Ft's

    Utah 24 FT's - 1 2nd half in a game that went to overtime.

    DeRozan had a dunk & 1 to close out the game which resulted in a non call.

    The entire game had a feel that Toronto should be up double digits, yet weren't. Anyone of DeRozan's 10+ attempts at the rim in the second half get rewarded for FT's 2 & possibly 3, Raptors win.

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by B2B View Post
    The only soft non aggressive players on roster are, Bargnani & Calderon..

    DeRozan attacks the rim at a very high rate & has done so for the last couple years. Amir, Ed, Acy I don't consider soft. Anderson, Mcguire? maybe Fields.
    Derozan attacks the rim but never gets the calls IMO because most of his drives to the rim in the past were misses. It is somewhat ridiculous to say this but the fact that the NBA have added the no flopping rule this year, refs are thinking that he may just be flopping just like the old days.

    Yes you are right that Bargs and Calderon have the reputation to be non aggressive but both are the ones that are logging most minutes and are on the floor most of the time.

    Amir as I said has a different reputation being foul prone and he is also one of those that log most minutes with high playing time.

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