Manning 2004 vs. Brady 2007

[alexander_37]

I am pretty sure many people consider Brady's 2007 campaign the best of any QB ever. I was in that category until I went back and looked a the stats in a debate I am having.

Volume stats

Brady 4806 yards 50 TD's

Manning 4557 yards 49 TD's


Brady broke Manning's single season TD record and threw for more yards but if you look at the efficiency numbers.


Brady 68.9 completion % 8.3 Y/A 8.7 TD%

Manning 67.6 completion % 9.2 Y/A 9.9 TD%

let me reiterate that one in every 10 passes went for a TD and almost every pass average a first down.... that's insane.

Last but not least Brady threw EIGHTY ONE more passes. So I guess it all boils down to whether you prefer efficiency or volume stats.

[NormSizedMidget]

Are we assuming they played with the exact same offense.

[subroc]

I gave my vote to Brady. I follow the Patriots, so that is one reason. The other reason is yards, TDs, completion % and INTs. It is close enough that in the end there really is no wrong answer. These are two of the best QB to ever play the game playing at the height of their powers.

This should help:

<PRE>                                                                                                                   
                                           Game    Pass                                                            
Rk           Player Year Age Draft  Tm  Lg    G GS  Cmp Att  Cmp%  Yds TD Int  Rate Sk  Y/A SkYds  AY/A ANY/A   Y/G
1         Tom Brady 2007  30 6-199 NWE NFL   16 16  398 578 68.9% 4806 50   8 117.2 21 8.31   128  9.42  8.88 300.4
2    Peyton Manning 2004  28   1-1 IND NFL   16 16  336 497 67.6% 4557 49  10 121.1 13 9.17   101 10.24  9.78 284.8
</PRE>

[kozelkid]

Are we assuming they played with the exact same offense.

Only if you're subroc.

[subroc]

Only if you're subroc.

you are actually entitled to vote in this poll and make your case! really!

[alexander_37]

I gave my vote to Brady. I follow the Patriots, so that is one reason. The other reason is yards, TDs, completion % and INTs. It is close enough that in the end there really is no wrong answer. These are two of the best QB to ever play the game playing at the height of their powers.

This should help:

<PRE>                                                                                                                   
                                           Game    Pass                                                            
Rk           Player Year Age Draft  Tm  Lg    G GS  Cmp Att  Cmp%  Yds TD Int  Rate Sk  Y/A SkYds  AY/A ANY/A   Y/G
1         Tom Brady 2007  30 6-199 NWE NFL   16 16  398 578 68.9% 4806 50   8 117.2 21 8.31   128  9.42  8.88 300.4
2    Peyton Manning 2004  28   1-1 IND NFL   16 16  336 497 67.6% 4557 49  10 121.1 13 9.17   101 10.24  9.78 284.8
</PRE>

So basically ignore efficiency??

[subroc]

No, I don't ignore efficiency. I am not giving efficiency more than its due as a single data point in a full stat line as part of an evaluation. I weight INTs and completion % fairly high in an evaluation though. The TDs are a wash.

[alexander_37]

No, I don't ignore efficiency. I am not giving efficiency more than its due as a single data point in a full stat line as part of an evaluation. I weight INTs and completion % fairly high in an evaluation though. The TDs are a wash.

So 2 interceptions and 1.3% completion rate makes up for the fact that at his pace, given the same amount of throws Manning would have had roughly 58 TD's and well over 5000 yards?

[subroc]

So 2 interceptions and 1.3% completion rate makes up for the fact that at his pace, given the same amount of throws Manning would have had roughly 58 TD's and well over 5000 yards?

But, he didn't.

Look, taking a data point and trying to establish what it "might" mean and then using that "might" as a conclusion to dismiss everything else is...well...a bit silly really.

I try to live in the real world.

[LegendX]

Marino's '84 season >>> All.

[subroc]

Worth a review, sorted by passer rating, filter includes 105 passer rating or greater, over 100 completions and 14 games:

<PRE>                                                                                                                          
                                                 Game    Pass                                                             
Rk               Player Year Age  Draft  Tm   Lg    G GS  Cmp Att  Cmp%  Yds TD Int  Rate Sk   Y/A SkYds  AY/A ANY/A   Y/G
1         Aaron Rodgers 2011  28   1-24 GNB  NFL   15 15  343 502 68.3% 4643 45   6 122.5 36  9.25   219 10.50  9.39 309.5
2        Peyton Manning 2004  28    1-1 IND  NFL   16 16  336 497 67.6% 4557 49  10 121.1 13  9.17   101 10.24  9.78 284.8
3             Tom Brady 2007  30  6-199 NWE  NFL   16 16  398 578 68.9% 4806 50   8 117.2 21  8.31   128  9.42  8.88 300.4
4          Steve Young* 1994  33    1-1 SFO  NFL   16 16  324 461 70.3% 3969 35  10 112.8 31  8.61   163  9.15  8.24 248.1
5             Tom Brady 2010  33  6-199 NWE  NFL   16 16  324 492 65.9% 3900 36   4 111.0 25  7.93   175  9.02  8.25 243.8
6      Daunte Culpepper 2004  27   1-11 MIN  NFL   16 16  379 548 69.2% 4717 39  11 110.9 46  8.61   238  9.13  8.02 294.8
7            Drew Brees 2011  32   2-32 NOR  NFL   16 16  468 657 71.2% 5476 46  14 110.6 24  8.33   158  8.78  8.23 342.3
8            Drew Brees 2009  30   2-32 NOR  NFL   15 15  363 514 70.6% 4388 34  11 109.6 20  8.54   135  8.90  8.31 292.5
9          Otto Graham* 1947  26    1-4 CLE AAFC   14  9  163 269 60.6% 2753 25  11 109.2    10.23       10.25       196.6
10          Kurt Warner 1999  28        STL  NFL   16 16  325 499 65.1% 4353 41  13 109.2 29  8.72   201  9.19  8.31 272.1
11          Dan Marino* 1984  23   1-27 MIA  NFL   16 16  362 564 64.2% 5084 48  17 108.9 13  9.01   120  9.36  8.94 317.8
12          Brett Favre 2009  40   2-33 MIN  NFL   16 16  363 531 68.4% 4202 33   7 107.2 34  7.91   247  8.56  7.61 262.6
13         Steve Young* 1992  31    1-1 SFO  NFL   16 16  268 402 66.7% 3465 25   7 107.0 29  8.62   152  9.08  8.12 216.6
14   Randall Cunningham 1998  35   2-37 MIN  NFL   15 14  259 425 60.9% 3704 34  10 106.0 20  8.72   132  9.26  8.54 246.9
15            Tom Brady 2011  34  6-199 NWE  NFL   16 16  401 611 65.6% 5235 39  12 105.6 32  8.57   173  8.96  8.25 327.2
16        Philip Rivers 2008  27    1-4 SDG  NFL   16 16  312 478 65.3% 4009 34  11 105.5 25  8.39   151  8.77  8.04 250.6
17          Bart Starr* 1966  32 17-200 GNB  NFL   14 13  156 251 62.2% 2257 14   3 105.0     8.99        9.57       161.2
</PRE>

[Pinstripe power]

gabbert

[Bigdaddyburch]

I am pretty sure many people consider Brady's 2007 campaign the best of any QB ever. I was in that category until I went back and looked a the stats in a debate I am having.

Volume stats

Brady 4806 yards 50 TD's

Manning 4557 yards 49 TD's


Brady broke Manning's single season TD record and threw for more yards but if you look at the efficiency numbers.


Brady 68.9 completion % 8.3 Y/A 8.7 TD%

Manning 67.6 completion % 9.2 Y/A 9.9 TD%

let me reiterate that one in every 10 passes went for a TD and almost every pass average a first down.... that's insane.

Last but not least Brady threw EIGHTY ONE more passes. So I guess it all boils down to whether you prefer efficiency or volume stats.

Hmmm Actually I dont. I would take Marino in his second season. Reason because he played before the rule changes. No way either Brady or Manning would do what Marino did if they had to play in 84.


Now as far as who I would pick. Easy Brady had the better year and actually has outplayed Manning his whole career.

[Patriot Pride]

Brady's second MVP season was more impressive I think. He played a bunch of good defenses that year and roasted most of them. Had a terrible defense, recovering Welker, 2 rookie tight ends, and UDFA's Woodhead and Green-Ellis as his backs.

[alexander_37]

Hmmm Actually I dont. I would take Marino in his second season. Reason because he played before the rule changes. No way either Brady or Manning would do what Marino did if they had to play in 84.


Now as far as who I would pick. Easy Brady had the better year and actually has outplayed Manning his whole career.

Any reasons other than "I just think so "