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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    Which would be why I said take him out of passing plays, or just use him as a blocker.

    Seriously, do you know nothing of football? Many tight ends get used as just blockers, you want us to not use Grew at all when he's an elite blocker? Are you seriously that stupid?



    I don't want undeserved wins playing weak opponents and be a pathetic 12-4 team. I'd rather be a team that is competitive against top opponents.



    Learn reading comprehension, it's a very good skill.

    I SPECIFICALLY said winning games against weak opponents, but getting your *** kicked against top competition. Being 12-4 and going to the playoffs does jack ****ing **** for you when you get to the playoffs and get destroyed because the only reason you made it to the playoffs is because you beat pathetic teams, all you end up with is a lower draft pick, and getting embarrassed on national TV.



    Again, I'd rather be good against top competition than beat low end opponents to get a good record and then get embarassed in the playoffs.

    And like you said, the goal is to win a superbowl, if all you can do is beat up on weak teams and get trounced by elite teams, you aren't going to ****ing make the superbowl are you? Use your brain for once, ffs.

    In fact, winning games like that only sets you back, as I said, you get lower picks, and it makes it harder for you to improve your team.



    My argument about Graham was just that, about Graham, less about Pettigrew.

    Pettigrew has **** the bed this year, I'd take him out of probably my top 15 TEs right now.

    The thing is - Graham is STILL overrated, he can't block for ****. You see how you're getting angry over Pettigrew not being good in the passing game? Well it's the same goddamn thing for Graham in the blocking game, which AGAIN, is half of a tight ends job. The fact that you think Grew is awful for being bad at half of a tight ends job just proves my point - Tight Ends need to fulfill BOTH roles, not just one, which Graham does not do. The fact that you can't see this is a little pathetic.

    At the end of the day, we're better than the other 4-7 teams. We just got unlucky with an extremely tough schedule, people overvalue wins.

    I repeat this again, winning games because you're facing weak opponents merely gets you a late draft pick, which makes it harder to improve. Then the next year when you face tougher teams and go 5-11, people are like "WHAT HAPPENED", You know exactly what the hell happened, your team was sorry and got where it got because they played weak opponents, not because they were good.

    People need to look more at how good a team plays rather than just wins, just because you lose does not mean you are aweful.

    Anyone who tells me that you'd rather have a better record by beating weak opponents is NOT SEEING THE BIG PICTURE.
    Graham is used more as a receiving threat in a pass happy offense. I would still rather have Graham in our offense than Pettigrew. We throw the GOD DAMN football more than any team in the league.

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  2. #47
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    But, but, but...he blocks SO well!!


    Scrap Detroit!!

    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    First of all, players like Matthews and Ware actually ARE overrated...

    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    No, the best comparison to Miggy is Albert Pujols. And I'll be honest, Cabrera doesn't really compare favorably to Pujols.

  3. #48
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    lol i dont think any one is happy with his drops...

    but that dosnt neglet the fact he really is a good blockr
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  4. #49
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    The dropped td's hurt, he makes me want to pull my hair out. the dropped first downs hurt, makes me gouge my eyes out. his fumbles pissed me off so bad, I bang my head against the wall... but damn that dude is a hellava blocker!

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  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by vader817 View Post
    Graham is used more as a receiving threat in a pass happy offense. I would still rather have Graham in our offense than Pettigrew. We throw the GOD DAMN football more than any team in the league.
    Did you even read my post? Seriously?

    I CLEARLY said Pettigrew has been crap this year, but that WASN'T MY POINT AGAINST GRAHAM.

    I said in that post, that the way Pettigrew is playing now, I would not take him over Graham, but that STILL does not change the fact that Graham can't block, and is not a top 5 COMPLETE TE in the NFL.

    Anyways, I came here to mostly just add this to for people who want to cry about the state of the detroit lions.

    You say being competitive means nothing, and that it's all about winning games.

    Well tell me this, would you HONESTLY rather have the franchise be in the state it was in 2004, with no talent on the roster, getting blown out by any tough opponents we faced, but pulling together a measly 6 wins, over the state where we are now? Where we're competing week in and week out, letting wins slip by, not because we're bad, but mostly because we just can't finish? Can you honestly tell me that?

    Now tell me this. Go look at the roster on the Detroit Lions from 2002-2008. Tell me ONE, just one position other than CB(dre bly was awesome) where that roster has an upgrade over what we currently have. You're honestly telling me you'd rather have that ****** 6 win team with that ****** roster, than what we have now?

    But back to my point. Look at the scores in that 6 win season. We were getting blown out all over the place, but you people have the ****ing balls to sit here and tell me that season was better because of a few more wins?

    Even our 7 win 2007 season had 5 losses of 20 or more points, and another 2 losses of 10 or more points, but you would rather we have a season like that?

    Let me put this into perspective.

    This year we were outscored in our losses by a whopping total of 43 points in 8 games, for an average of 5.37 points per game

    In 2007 we were outscored in our losses by 183 points in 9 games, for an average of 20.3 points per game.

    But again, because we got 3 more wins that season, it was better?

    EDIT: Also, Driz, your sarcastic comments you use when you can't back up your comments only makes you sound more idiotic, you're a very ignorant football fan that can't look past the stats, and you're wrong about Graham being a top 5 TE, get over it.(although, as I've admitted, Pettigrew has been **** this year, and isn't a top 15 TE himself)

    Apparently most of you are completely unaware of the fact that TEs CAN be used just as blockers, and until recently(recently as in the last 5 or so years), their primary job was to block, recieving was a secondary goal. So again, to not want an elite blocking TE on your team even if you don't use him in the passing game is idiotic.

    It's literally would be the same as me saying I don't want Graham because he can't block. Don't use him on run plays...not that complicated, still that weakness takes him out of the running of being a top 5 TE.
    Last edited by basch152; 12-03-2012 at 01:18 AM.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    This year we were outscored in our losses by a whopping total of 43 points in 8 games, for an average of 5.37 points per game

    In 2007 we were outscored in our losses by 183 points in 9 games, for an average of 20.3 points per game.
    I've been saying this for awhile now. The strength of our scedule has a lot of playoff bound teams on it and we are staying competative week in and week out...hell the best team in the AFC had to go to over time to beat us after being given 7 points. Last year I don't think we beat a single playoff team let alone stand toe to toe with teams like Greenbay.

    I'm not saying this has been a great season and I currently want Linehan gone at all cost (I didn't want him to begin with). However this season is not a step back IMO.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by garnotm View Post
    I've been saying this for awhile now. The strength of our scedule has a lot of playoff bound teams on it and we are staying competative week in and week out...hell the best team in the AFC had to go to over time to beat us after being given 7 points. Last year I don't think we beat a single playoff team let alone stand toe to toe with teams like Greenbay.

    I'm not saying this has been a great season and I currently want Linehan gone at all cost (I didn't want him to begin with). However this season is not a step back IMO.
    I tend to side with you. I'm extremely disappointed that we're 4-8 and I'm with you, never liked Linehan but with this schedule, I sort of saw this coming. Took a step back which hopefully humbled some of our more 'confident' players, make much needed secondary and LB upgrades in the offseason...oh and OC upgrade, and we'll be right back in the playoffs.

    On top of that, we have a 24 yr old QB who is threatening 5K again...that's scary production that will translate in W's again, just like last year.
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  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by garnotm View Post
    I've been saying this for awhile now. The strength of our scedule has a lot of playoff bound teams on it and we are staying competative week in and week out...hell the best team in the AFC had to go to over time to beat us after being given 7 points. Last year I don't think we beat a single playoff team let alone stand toe to toe with teams like Greenbay.

    I'm not saying this has been a great season and I currently want Linehan gone at all cost (I didn't want him to begin with). However this season is not a step back IMO.
    Not to mention our riddled secondary and receiving group. Next year (granted we re-sign some of our D), there's no excuse not to make the playoffs.



  9. #54
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    Actually, Jimmy Graham is a top 2 tight end...competing directly with Gronkowski for the #1 spot.

    Write as many books trying to defend your point as many times and as often as you'd like. It's a pathetic attempt to continue to stand by a point that week in and week out actual play on the football field proves wrong. Over. And over. And over again.


    Scrap Detroit!!

    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    First of all, players like Matthews and Ware actually ARE overrated...

    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    No, the best comparison to Miggy is Albert Pujols. And I'll be honest, Cabrera doesn't really compare favorably to Pujols.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by driz View Post
    Actually, Jimmy Graham is a top 2 tight end...competing directly with Gronkowski for the #1 spot.

    Write as many books trying to defend your point as many times and as often as you'd like. It's a pathetic attempt to continue to stand by a point that week in and week out actual play on the football field proves wrong. Over. And over. And over again.
    It just boggles my mind how he can makes such a sick catch (his TD against the Colts for example) then come back and drop 2 easy *** passes where he's wide open. How do you even do that?



  11. #56
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    No focus. Head not in the game. No consistency.

    A broken clock is still right two times a day!


    Scrap Detroit!!

    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    First of all, players like Matthews and Ware actually ARE overrated...

    Quote Originally Posted by basch152 View Post
    No, the best comparison to Miggy is Albert Pujols. And I'll be honest, Cabrera doesn't really compare favorably to Pujols.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by blujaysrock View Post
    Not to mention our riddled secondary and receiving group. Next year (granted we re-sign some of our D), there's no excuse not to make the playoffs.
    I agree with you...no excuse next year. Right now I don't believe Schwartz will be or deserves to be fired. He gets a chance to turn this thing around next season after the playoff season last year but if it's like this next season? Then he's had his 5 seasons and it's time for a change.
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  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by driz View Post
    Actually, Jimmy Graham is a top 2 tight end...competing directly with Gronkowski for the #1 spot.

    Write as many books trying to defend your point as many times and as often as you'd like. It's a pathetic attempt to continue to stand by a point that week in and week out actual play on the football field proves wrong. Over. And over. And over again.
    Amazing how you continue to say this without providing ANY reason other than "he haz nise futbol stats he iz gud".

    You haven't countered ANY points I've made against him, face it, you have no football knowledge and can't look past stats, end of story.

    This is probably LITERALLY the 20th time I've asked this.

    Do you honestly believe Graham is better than a Prime Gonzalez and Gates because of the stats he puts up?

    You seem to refuse to answer this.

    Oh, and he hasn't proved me wrong - at all.

    He still can't block, he is NOT A COMPLETE TIGHT END. I don't understand what's hard for you to understand about this. Until he can block.

    HE WILL NEVER BE BETTER THAN A COMPLETE TIGHT END THAT CAN BLOCK AND RECIEVE.

    He is MAYBE a top 8 TE.
    Last edited by basch152; 12-03-2012 at 05:24 PM.

  14. #59
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    Who the hell cares if the guy can't block? You do realize this is a passing league? and a pass catching tight end is way better than a blocking tight end that can't catch.

    I'd actually would love it if you listed all the "complete tight ends" for me...in your opinion
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  15. #60
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    I rather have a TE that can block and is a great TE when he's not dropping or fumbling the ball than a TE that can only catch

    Pettigrew doesn't drop every single pass.

    TE that can block and drops the catch maybe once or twice in 2 games > TE that can only catch

    And Grew is great after the catch, I hope you guys that Grew isn't dropping the passes because he's just dropping them, usually he brings the ball in an awkward way and it gets batted by the DB. He needs to get taught on how to bring in a ball he catches. I would rather have Jimmy than Grew btw.
    Last edited by rocket; 12-03-2012 at 05:44 PM.


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