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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbacknick View Post
    I agree with you. However, the number of wins don't mean anything to me.
    If they don't make the playoffs (and they won't) then it's been a failure.
    It's not the losses that bother me much, but the way that they've lost.
    I feel you, there's nothing like the excitement of watching your team move through the regular season and then knock down the playoff games one by one, those are great times.

    Maybe because I'm a little older, I'm having a better appreciation for the trip as well as the destination.

    We will soon have what we both want......
    " I have only three rules, be on time, pay attention, and play like hell on Sunday"

    -John Madden

  2. #62
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    I have said this time and time again, I really feel for the younger fans that never had the opportunity of experiencing a Raiders Super Bowl win.

    Their passion in light of not experiencing the glory years is commendable.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snake Plissken View Post
    I have said this time and time again, I really feel for the younger fans that never had the opportunity of experiencing a Raiders Super Bowl win.

    Their passion in light of not experiencing the glory years is commendable.
    Man, I'm starting to feel old....
    " I have only three rules, be on time, pay attention, and play like hell on Sunday"

    -John Madden

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by corralski View Post
    Man, I'm starting to feel old....
    I don't feel old, but the calendar tells me I am getting old. I do know this, January 22, 1984 was a long time ago.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snake Plissken View Post
    I don't feel old, but the calendar tells me I am getting old. I do know this, January 22, 1984 was a long time ago.
    Better times are a coming, I feel it, after the offseason I will know it for sure.....
    " I have only three rules, be on time, pay attention, and play like hell on Sunday"

    -John Madden

  6. #66
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    I think so as well. Al Davis used to proclaim that the greatness of the Raiders was in its future, I believe it will be.

  7. #67
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    Thanks for the positive thinking. I hope both of you are right.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbacknick View Post
    Thanks for the positive thinking. I hope both of you are right.


    When you e seen the same mistakes made for three decades cost our team the chances to be competitive, it's hard not to be positive right now. This is the best season Ive seen in a long time. I can't wait for the next two years, even though this year is terrible. For once we will break the cycle of over paid, over hyped, under achieving, typical quitter football players and install disciplined coaches and smart draft picks.

    I blame this season on Al Davis. The man that traded our SB ring to TB, then proceeded to run a great franchise into the depths of hell. There is a reason we've been the laughing stock of the league for so long. Reggie will get us there, be patient my friends.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishedz View Post
    When you e seen the same mistakes made for three decades cost our team the chances to be competitive, it's hard not to be positive right now. This is the best season Ive seen in a long time. I can't wait for the next two years, even though this year is terrible. For once we will break the cycle of over paid, over hyped, under achieving, typical quitter football players and install disciplined coaches and smart draft picks.

    I blame this season on Al Davis. The man that traded our SB ring to TB, then proceeded to run a great franchise into the depths of hell. There is a reason we've been the laughing stock of the league for so long. Reggie will get us there, be patient my friends.

    I feel the same way, but not for the typical reasons. Last years team played better, but even when they were 7-4 I did not feel as though they were championship caliber. I enjoyed it why it lasted and never seriously believed they would be a legit contender, losing big to good teams late in the season confirmed this suspicion.

    Thus, despite last years fleeting success, this team offers a much better future because solid organizational fundamentals are being laid, and while they do not show up in the box score I am pleased with the direction.

    Opportunities for championship teams are created in years like the 2012 Oakland Raiders season. Some teams capitalize on them, some do not. The devil is in the details and I believe McKenzie understands this.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by corralski View Post
    I don't think that anyone here is prematurely calling McKenzie and Co. a rousing success. What we have here for the first time in forty years is a proper and logical delegation of authority. You speak of reality and one of the realities is that it would have been financially and logistically impossible for the goals we all seek to have been accomplished in one season.

    As to the intelligence of the team, I think that in certain instances you could make a case for this and this also merits my next question. Who do you think, given the exact same scenario could have done better for the Raiders? It is reality that you could insert any name here and have the same result as the GM never takes snap one. I believe that under the circumstances that McKenzie has done all that is possible at this juncture to mold us per his plan. What is that plan you ask? Well, since we don't get asked to attend meetings I would speculate that phase one was to start purging contracts that had no value to the Raiders and plug those holes with short term replacements that wouldn't have any long term impact to the cap. I would say that this is about two thirds done.

    Phase two is to accumulate draft choices as we know that our problems cannot be addressed through free agency alone. How this gets handled we have yet to see. We will also have a better evaluation at how McKenzie's eye for talent is after this off season.

    As for bringing in vets, there are two questions. One is who are those special guys that would lend their talent and expertise and not counter what you are trying to build, and two, how would you pay them without starting up the over the cap carousel again?

    The last thing, and this burns me a little, is just because McKenzie's resume' is a little thin at the position he currently holds doesn't mean that the man is unqualified. Guys need to think just a little on this, McKenzie comes from a franchise that is achieving some pretty impressive long term competitiveness. He also worked under the watchful eye of someone that most in the Raider nation know and respect.

    Back to the OP, the Niners didn't transform over night and they started with a few key pieces of a stout D in place. They also had a somewhat normal front office in place. We started with less, much less, so to expect results on a similar time would just be insane.

    McKenzie hasn't melted down or thrown anyone under the bus, he has stood at the mike and offered no excuses. Some might say that in the case of the D that he has lost the team to which I would answer that the D has responded pretty much the same as it has for the last three years as not enough change over of players has occurred yet. Unless you are just bat **** crazy, you can't hang that on McKenzie.

    I suspect that the only point we probably still strongly disagree on would be a time line for completion and only allowing some more time for this to develop will show that.

    Or we can be one and done and continue with the same ol' same ol'....
    I agree he inherited a mess and has done a greay job with the cap. It will be am interesting offseason with more cuts to come the draft and free agency. I can feel a 50% roster change coming atleast.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maxfly View Post
    I've been a Raider fan my whole life as well but have appreciated those teams that have been able to get out of the hole and become successful while this organization chose to do things so bassackwards it made us the laughingstock of the league. The 9ers like other successful organizations have built a team that will be successful for years as the development of Keapernick is proof and both defensive and offensive lines are solid,that's drafting,signing,developing and coaching ALL working through execution and consistancy...........that's what this organization desperatly needs.
    Thanks man, my thoughts exactly I can respect a franchise for turning it around and hooe tuat somehow someway our beloved Raiders can make the same turn around. Was curious to see if we all had faith in Mckenzie and instead I get called a traitor for just throwing out an example of a team that was looking pretty damn bad not too long ago and now are in serious contention. I like what he has done with the cap and cutting some of the trash.
    Last edited by slvrandblkatack; 11-25-2012 at 07:56 PM.

  12. #72
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    Heck no!! He is the worse of all the last coaches that fired. The Raiders really digressed they don't even make a game of it anymore; blew out in consecutive games. They need a good coach & give him or her the power that most coaches get. I aslo believe the Raiders should go back to signing proven players in their prime along with a few veterans. THey are a disgusting team now, worse than I've ver seen.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishedz View Post
    Yup...and it's all about Reggie's brand he brings from GB.

    The niners drafted four OL high since 07, three 1st and a 2nd. That's how it's done. Some damn fine defensive players as well... Not wr's and Db's which was Al's MO. You can't expect every 3rd/4th round OL to pan out period and rely on retreads cut from other teams. They built the lines and LB core, them added position players.

    I find peace in hearing Reggie say the game is won at the line. Given the amount of OL/DL he keeps bringing in I'd say he fully understands the problem, even if all we have access to is cuts and practice squad players. He is constantly looking for someone.
    Damn, right!
    Someone should have called Al on his BS pick when he took DHB with the 9th pick, but no one had the balls to. It's been proven throughout the league that good WRs can be had in the later rounds and even undrafted. Denarius Moore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Snake Plissken View Post
    I have said this time and time again, I really feel for the younger fans that never had the opportunity of experiencing a Raiders Super Bowl win.

    Their passion in light of not experiencing the glory years is commendable.
    Snake, I was thinking about this before the game, when I was a kid, I remember both the Colts and Patriots use to suck and one year they both had 2-14 records. There's a generation of football fans who are growing up thinking the Raiders are the worst organization of all-time without knowing this team's winning history. And that's unfortunate.
    You're right, I commend the younger Raider fans for enduring these losing seasons while still being a die hard fan.
    Last edited by AsfanSince99; 11-25-2012 at 08:34 PM.

    ahhh... the good ole days

    watch 4free here http://firstrownow.eu

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by AsfanSince99 View Post
    Damn, right!
    Someone should have called Al on his BS pick when he took DHB with the 9th pick, but no one had the balls to. It's been proven throughout the league that good WRs can be had in the later rounds and even undrafted. Denarius Moore.



    Snake, I was thinking about this before the game, when I was a kid, I remember both the Colts and Patriots use to suck and one year they both had 2-14 records. There's a generation of football fans who are growing up thinking the Raiders are the worst organization of all-time without knowing this team's winning history. And that's unfortunate.
    You're right, I commend the younger Raider fans for enduring these losing seasons while still being a die hard fan.
    I agree.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfe-Raider View Post
    I agree.
    On which part?

    'Cuz I remember when DHB was taken, and this board looked like someone had carpet bombed it.

    Full on meltdown mode, lmao...

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