The Value of Jay Cutler

**DamnGoat** · 11-20-2012, 01:03 PM

It starts with the O-line though. The only unit worse in the entire NFL is the Arizona Cardinals. This whole group needs to be completely revamped. The only guy worth keeping is Lance Louis.

Cutler's shown that when he has time he can be very good. There's plenty of talent at RB, WR & QB, but if you don't have time to do anything or have a playcaller with a clue, then your offense is going to suck. I'm not convinced that it'll get any better this year either, not unless Tice is gone or completely changes his offensive philosophy.

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:05 PM

We basically need to sign a LT, we need a sure thing, then we need to draft 2 lineman, a guard and a center, carimi will improve and lance Louis is solid and worth keeping

Speaking of Louis, what happened with the leg injury?

**BowDown** · 11-20-2012, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by Full-Size Ditka

It's become clear to me that Jay not only makes the offense as a whole better, but also makes the OL somehow look better. That's just about the worst they have looked all season.

I bet our FO is shocked at how bad our OL is right now, despite the fact that its been just about as bad the past three seasons and we haven't done much outside of drafting Carimi and picking up Rachal to fix it.

It's also become obvious to the FO why Cutler is always hurt, even though PSD has been saying it for years.

Who is Trillman?

**TheLegend** · 11-20-2012, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by jpro611

The fact that the Bears are 26-9 in games he's started and finished and 1-8 in the other games proves to me he is borderline elite... If he had an offensive line that wasn't god ****ing awful he could be in the conversation IMO

I mean Campbell isn't that bad, he just had no ****ing time last night, the lie is trash... The fact that cutler can do anything behind it is amazing

In football you can't go by record and say this guy is elite because Of that. It's to many other variables. We have had a bad offensive line the last two years and not great OC's, but u wouldn't say our offensive line or the OC is great because we went 26-9 would you???

The Ravens won a Super Bowl years ago with a Qb that wasn't that good,yet they won. In fact, he was the first Super Bowl Qb to win a ship and get cut the next year. In football, you have to look beyond record a bit. But I do understand your point and why you say that.

I tend to grade a Qb by their skills, ability to read the coverage, and mechanics. How accurate is his deep ball, and does he take what the defense gives him. That's why I'm not a big cutler fan because he don't have great mechanics, he forces passes, and he hasn't learned to take what the defense give you. Tom Brady will ding you all the way down field for 6 yard passes if u give him that. Cutler has to learn that and stop the force passes into double/triple coverage.

**TheLegend** · 11-20-2012, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by jpro611

The 49ers defense is great and the pressure they bring is amazing... But if you saw last night they weren't even being tricky, they didn't stunt because they didn't have to, they just bull rushed the line cuz it is so horrible

At one point I read Aldon smiths lips and he said, "oh my god, this is too easy"... That shows me that it was just the offensive line being ****ing pathetic

Some truth to that. It is not a good line by any means

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by TheLegend

Some truth to that. It is not a good line by any means

Some truth? It's pretty ****ing obvious that they are the worst unit in the NFL outside of the Arizona Cardinals and maybe the Philadelphia Eagles?

Will you downplay anything to continue to belittle Cutler?

I mean last night's game and the last 9 games we haven't had Jay has been a tell tale sign that Cutler is the most important player on our offense

**TheLegend** · 11-20-2012, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by DamnGoat

It starts with the O-line though. The only unit worse in the entire NFL is the Arizona Cardinals. This whole group needs to be completely revamped. The only guy worth keeping is Lance Louis.

Cutler's shown that when he has time he can be very good. There's plenty of talent at RB, WR & QB, but if you don't have time to do anything or have a playcaller with a clue, then your offense is going to suck. I'm not convinced that it'll get any better this year either, not unless Tice is gone or completely changes his offensive philosophy.

Yup, but let me ask u this. Do you think this offense would look this bad if we had a guy like Tom Brady or Peyton Manning? That's why those guys are great, they would adjust to the situation by taking what the defense gives them and getting rid of the ball quicker. I'm not saying they would be fabulous behind our line, but they would make this offense work.

Any Qb can look god when he has time. Arron Rogers has a shady offensive line to don't he? Yet, he still gets it done at a pro bowl level. The point is, defenses game plan for u to have less time as possible.

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:15 PM

Originally Posted by TheLegend

In football you can't go by record and say this guy is elite because Of that. It's to many other variables. We have had a bad offensive line the last two years and not great OC's, but u wouldn't say our offensive line or the OC is great because we went 26-9 would you???

The Ravens won a Super Bowl years ago with a Qb that wasn't that good,yet they won. In fact, he was the first Super Bowl Qb to win a ship and get cut the next year. In football, you have to look beyond record a bit. But I do understand your point and why you say that.

I tend to grade a Qb by their skills, ability to read the coverage, and mechanics. How accurate is his deep ball, and does he take what the defense gives him. That's why I'm not a big cutler fan because he don't have great mechanics, he forces passes, and he hasn't learned to take what the defense give you. Tom Brady will ding you all the way down field for 6 yard passes if u give him that. Cutler has to learn that and stop the force passes into double/triple coverage.

The Ravens could have thrown anyone in at QB that year... Their defense was going to win them the championship... You can't say that about this Bears team... The Bears couldn't win a championship with Jason Campbell in... They might not be able to do it with Cutler either, but they've gotta pretty good shot if he's healthy... The offensive line can't keep him healthy for one thing... They also can't protect him when he is playing.

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by TheLegend

Yup, but let me ask u this. Do you think this offense would look this bad if we had a guy like Tom Brady or Peyton Manning? That's why those guys are great, they would adjust to the situation by taking what the defense gives them and getting rid of the ball quicker. I'm not saying they would be fabulous behind our line, but they would make this offense work.

Tom Brady and Peyton Manning would suck dick behind this line... They would get destroyed, it would be ugly... Aaron Rodgers could work behind this line because he can move around, but I really can't think of many QBs that would succeed behind this offensive line

**TheLegend** · 11-20-2012, 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by jpro611

Tom Brady and Peyton Manning would suck dick behind this line... They would get destroyed, it would be ugly... Aaron Rodgers could work behind this line because he can move around, but I really can't think of many QBs that would succeed behind this offensive line

Bro, let me make this quote and you can take it the bank. Tom Brady and Peyton Manning are so GREAT, that they would still be HOF'ers and elite QBs even with this line we have. They are to great. They can read a defense before they snap the ball. They know who should be open and when. They don't need much time. Cutler is NOT like that. In fact, our line wouldn't look half as bad because defense would be to scared to blitz.

Tom Brady proved to me a few years ago that he didn't even need a rb, this dude was in shot gun the entire Hall and the defense couldn't do a damn thing about it.

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:29 PM

It's way different to not have a running back then to not have a competent O-line

Peyton and Brady have had a great offensive line for their entire careers... They are both elite and great QBs, but they need to be able to sit in the pocket... You clearly saw that last night there's no sitting back in this pocket with the Bears ever

Cutler is more mobile than both of those guys which is why he is able to avoid a lot of pressure that comes from this piss poor offensive line

**TheLegend** · 11-20-2012, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by jpro611

It's way different to not have a running back then to not have a competent O-line

Peyton and Brady have had a great offensive line for their entire careers... They are both elite and great QBs, but they need to be able to sit in the pocket... You clearly saw that last night there's no sitting back in this pocket with the Bears ever

Cutler is more mobile than both of those guys which is why he is able to avoid a lot of pressure that comes from this piss poor offensive line

I don't think you understand. Manning and Brady will pick a elite defense apart. They are simply to good with their reads, they know who has the match up advantage and the hot read before the ball is snapped. Cutler isn't like that, theres a reason why he constantly throwing to one receiver all game. Why not execute the hot read and take what the defense gives u? And eventually that's the downfall, he's to dependent on one receiver. Manning and Brady was never like that. They knew what was going to be open before the ball was snapped.

Manning was great in Indy, now great in Denver, so u think he has a great offensive line now?

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:44 PM

Yeah, Manning does have a good offensive line again

I don't think you get it

**DESERTDWELLER** · 11-20-2012, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by TheLegend

Yup, but let me ask u this. Do you think this offense would look this bad if we had a guy like Tom Brady?

If Brady would have started his career behind the current Bears Oline with Tice calling the plays, you would have different results. You don't realize the value of a good Oline or play caller.

**jpro611** · 11-20-2012, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by DESERTDWELLER

If Brady would have started his career behind the current Bears Oline with Tice calling the plays, you would have different results. You don't realize the value of a good Oline or play caller.

You can tell he's never played organized ball, give him a break

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