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  1. #1
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    Has Mark Barron hit the rookie wall?

    Via Buccaneers101.com:

    Strong safety Mark Barron came out on fire early in the season, but lately the Tampa Bay Buccaneers' first first-round selection has been a liability at times on the field.

    Barron, who was drafted No. 7 overall by the Bucs in April, has struggled in the passing game as of late. He seems to be out of position way too much and has had trouble covering tight ends, which is something a fast, young player like himself should be able to do.

    Barron also hasn't learn a very simple principle that all defensive backs need to do get your head around when the ball is coming. Last week, Barron got flagged for pass interference after he didn't turn his head toward the ball while knocking down a pass. The flag was picked up so no harm was done.

    But he got called for the same thing on Sunday against the Panthers while trying to cover Greg Olsen in the end zone, and this time it cost him. Running back Jonathan Stewart punched it in from 1-yard out to give the Panthers a 14-10 lead after Barron's penalty.

    Look, we know Barron is a rookie and we have seen glimpses of the immense talent that he possesses.

    But maybe he has hit that so-called "rookie wall" 11 weeks into the season. Barron certainly isn't playing like he was earlier in the year, and the only splash plays he is involved in are the ones he is giving up to opposing players.

    Buccaneers 101 thinks Barron will be a fine pro this league for a long time. But we wouldn't be doing our jobs if we didn't point out the fact that he has struggled the past few weeks.

    Hopefully, Barron can improve his game because his teammates will need him at his best as they fight for a playoff berth.
    What do you guys think? Anyone else concerned with Barron?

  2. #2
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    I don't think he has hit a wall, I just think a lot of our fans have overated him! He is terrific against the run, but a liability in coverage. That has been the critisism against him since he was in college, and it looks tio be accurate. He can, and probably will improve, but it will take some time. So far, he is the 3rd best rookie on our team, and I think people are afriad to admit that because he was the first round pick. I look at him a lot like I look at M. Foster. I think once we get some more help in the secondary, it will open up Mark Barron to shine!

  3. #3
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    First off I read the story earlier this morning, I think it was bloated. The man cant miss a tackle once in a while? It was just a dumb little read a.k.a. media vomit. "The Wall" is overrated in my opinion.

    @aecon I dont think that is accurate bro. 1st off Mark Barron is not perfect, nobody is not Lavonte(bites on play action, can get lost in coverage) or anyone.

    Mark is obviously great against the run, one missed tackle on Cam in open field doesnt bother me at all. Now I believe it his ability against the pass that is being talked about in the article and by you. Go look at that PI. It was complete ********. He was face guarding, which is a valid technique and one that he is good at. He watches WRs/TEs and times himself off of what they are doing. He is very very good at it. There are lot of things that he does well in coverage.

    Now as far as him being the 3rd best rookie on the team. I think you are really either drinking some funky kool aid or getting way way ahead of yourself. The way a player or players are playing today or this month or this season does not make them the better player. I would hold off making any real concrete this guys better than this guy for a couple years at least. Mark is a very complete player. His pass coverage is better than your giving him credit for. His run game is very nice. Lavontes run game is nasty, a little better than Barrons, but I think his coverage skills are not as good as Barrons.

    When the man does his job properly, it doesnt always show up on the stat sheet. When a safety shades the side of the field, and makes his reads properly giving the QB no window to throw and the DE comes and sacks the QB. We look at the DE not the S or CB who took away the 1 or 2 guys he was trying to go to.

    Lastly if any of you are real football historians what are some of the easiest positions and hardest to transition to in the NFL. LB is def. one of the easiest because its pretty straight forward. Coverage schemes are a whole different animal, not to mention when you have E.J. Biggers, Myron Lewis, LeQuan Lewis, and LJ out there covering guys. What you are correct about is that when the secondary gets better it will help Mark Barron. Mason Foster is balling hard, that helps Lavonte. Josh is Ballin that helps doug. Ronde has played well this year, but you would be hard pressed to call our secondary ballin unless its free ballin.

    Analysis: 2 years too early to talk about whos better than who or what who can and cant do...coo coo ca choo

    We Want Winston

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwallstreet View Post
    First off I read the story earlier this morning, I think it was bloated. The man cant miss a tackle once in a while? It was just a dumb little read a.k.a. media vomit. "The Wall" is overrated in my opinion.

    @aecon I dont think that is accurate bro. 1st off Mark Barron is not perfect, nobody is not Lavonte(bites on play action, can get lost in coverage) or anyone.

    Mark is obviously great against the run, one missed tackle on Cam in open field doesnt bother me at all. Now I believe it his ability against the pass that is being talked about in the article and by you. Go look at that PI. It was complete ********. He was face guarding, which is a valid technique and one that he is good at. He watches WRs/TEs and times himself off of what they are doing. He is very very good at it. There are lot of things that he does well in coverage.

    Now as far as him being the 3rd best rookie on the team. I think you are really either drinking some funky kool aid or getting way way ahead of yourself. The way a player or players are playing today or this month or this season does not make them the better player. I would hold off making any real concrete this guys better than this guy for a couple years at least. Mark is a very complete player. His pass coverage is better than your giving him credit for. His run game is very nice. Lavontes run game is nasty, a little better than Barrons, but I think his coverage skills are not as good as Barrons.

    When the man does his job properly, it doesnt always show up on the stat sheet. When a safety shades the side of the field, and makes his reads properly giving the QB no window to throw and the DE comes and sacks the QB. We look at the DE not the S or CB who took away the 1 or 2 guys he was trying to go to.

    Lastly if any of you are real football historians what are some of the easiest positions and hardest to transition to in the NFL. LB is def. one of the easiest because its pretty straight forward. Coverage schemes are a whole different animal, not to mention when you have E.J. Biggers, Myron Lewis, LeQuan Lewis, and LJ out there covering guys. What you are correct about is that when the secondary gets better it will help Mark Barron. Mason Foster is balling hard, that helps Lavonte. Josh is Ballin that helps doug. Ronde has played well this year, but you would be hard pressed to call our secondary ballin unless its free ballin.

    Analysis: 2 years too early to talk about whos better than who or what who can and cant do...coo coo ca choo

    I think you are missreading what I am saying. By no means would I go out and say that any player is better then anyother player after 10 games. My point is that through 10 games, Martin and David have played better then Barron. I will stick by that opinion hard, so it's not even worth debating. That does not mean I am chalking Barron down as the 3rd best pick of the 2012 draft long term. That is simply the 10 games in observation that I am making.

    The face guard technique will get called for pass interference 50% of the time, so regardless of whether or not he is good at it, he still needs to learn to turn around towards the ball, or he will end up having a lot of PI calls in his career.

  5. #5
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    It's unfair because he has zero help back there
    and with the 12th pick, The New York Football Giants select ......Odell Beckham Jr, Wide Reciever from Louisana State University

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by aecon13 View Post
    I don't think he has hit a wall, I just think a lot of our fans have overated him! He is terrific against the run, but a liability in coverage. That has been the critisism against him since he was in college, and it looks tio be accurate. He can, and probably will improve, but it will take some time. So far, he is the 3rd best rookie on our team, and I think people are afriad to admit that because he was the first round pick. I look at him a lot like I look at M. Foster. I think once we get some more help in the secondary, it will open up Mark Barron to shine!
    This exactly, I like mark a lot with his big hits and all but the lack of coverage from his supporting cast is really showing his own weakness in coverage.

  7. #7
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    They have him at ss but playing him as a fs because ronde can't cover in the deep zone mark should be able to roam in the box like ronde does but because we lack a true fs mark had to play both positions.

  8. #8
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    This seems to have been brought up a couple of times in a few different threads so, a little education for you guys; "face guarding" is not a penalty. The act of throwing your hands up in a receivers face to block their vision of the ball is 100% legal. What makes these plays a penalty is contact and contact alone. 90% of these types of plays, contact is made because the defender did not turn his head to play the ball prior to contact placing him in a position to allow the receiver to stop and force the defender to make contact. That call made on Mark against the Panthers was BS, there was no contact. Though I can see why the refs made the call. Its a 90/10 call. Per below, there is no such rule referring to hindering a players ability to see the ball. Homework. Dont criticize a player or cite this play when doing so to point out any shortcomings.

    Per NFL rules

    Actions that constitute defensive pass interference include but are not limited to:

    (a) Contact by a defender who is not playing the ball and such contact restricts the receiver’s opportunity to make the catch.

    Actions that do not constitute pass interference include but are not limited to:

    (a) Incidental contact by a defender’s hands, arms, or body when both players are competing for the ball, or neither player is looking for the ball. If there is any question whether contact is incidental, the ruling shall be no interference.
    I am a member of the BUC NATION


  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrews1469 View Post
    This seems to have been brought up a couple of times in a few different threads so, a little education for you guys; "face guarding" is not a penalty. The act of throwing your hands up in a receivers face to block their vision of the ball is 100% legal. What makes these plays a penalty is contact and contact alone. 90% of these types of plays, contact is made because the defender did not turn his head to play the ball prior to contact placing him in a position to allow the receiver to stop and force the defender to make contact. That call made on Mark against the Panthers was BS, there was no contact. Though I can see why the refs made the call. Its a 90/10 call. Per below, there is no such rule referring to hindering a players ability to see the ball. Homework. Dont criticize a player or cite this play when doing so to point out any shortcomings.

    Per NFL rules
    I'm not criticizing him for face guarding. I'm criticizing him for not turning around. He has done this often, and it is going to get called at least half the time. Barron will be fine, but he has things to work on.

  10. #10
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    What your calling not turning around, is proper by the book hardcore face guarding. He isnt playing the ball as much as he is playing the reciever. His technique is really sharp and he really doesn't commit PI. He has this uncanny ability to leap and get his hands on the ball at the point of contact and break it up. Its what hes done and will continue to do.

    As someone mentioned he shouldnt be in coverage nearly as much as he is. Rondes always been good in the box, so when Barber is in the box, Barron is almost playing FS. Get a Jairus Byrd back there and let Barron do more of what he's good at.

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  11. #11
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    This can all be chalked up to D-play calling... We play the run 9o% of the time when will we atleast try to rely on the front to do there thing and play coverage harder, this Is our biggest need, not really even the pass rush suffer as much as our coverage unit! We gotta figure something out soon or we can kiss this season good bye early!
    Last edited by Capital T; 11-20-2012 at 08:54 PM.
    "In dieing need of a rebound season, 2o14 Leggo"



  12. #12
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    He'll get better as the years progress cause trust me it is not easy playing CB/S,In football because I experience myself for 2 years and I think that's one of the hardest position in football.That play barron did towards the red zone against oslen was almost perfect, shoot I surprise they'd threw a flag howver I already know wassup just because he didn't get his head around.All he was missing was turning that head around if he did I'm for sure he would of got that pick cause of his ball skills.But in other cases if that was biggers that would of been a TD All day lol..L.Johnson dude impress the last couple games,he coming out to be a stud.That was a nice solid tackle against steve smith to make it 3rd & 2.


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  13. #13
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    John Lynch on Mark Barron:
    “I think early on he was exactly what I thought he would be: a difference-making player. This was early on in the season and I think he has a hit a little bit of that rookie wall, not so much physically but mentally,” Lynch said. “You aren’t seeing him make that many impact plays. But I think Tampa fans can rest assured the Bucs have a special player on their hands. This is just a natural process that players go through in this league. He has all the physical tools. I think when they learn how to learn how to use him more effectively, and he continues to grow in his understanding of the game, this guy is a difference-making safety. He has everything you would want in the safety position and safeties are hard to find. A lot of people thought it was a reach taking him that high but I would say finding a safety is hard to find, especially a safety who can do all of those things and they have one in Mark Barron. I think he is going to be a very good football player for a long, long time.”
    Very high praise from one of the all-time great Bucs.

  14. #14
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    If he's good enough for John.

    Forgive my lack of knowledge of the College game which I know little about. Would I be right in saying though, that the step up to pro Football has to be the biggest that a player will ever make in his entire career and, with a few glorious exceptions, if the talent is there it takes a season or two for a young player to really shine through?

  15. #15
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    Yeah, I would agree with that. I've seen Barron compared to Cardinal's safety Adrian Wilson, and it took him a few years until he really started playing at a high level. I can see the same kind of thing happening to Barron. He'll get there eventually.

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