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  1. #796
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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleJRM View Post
    And the idea that Almora could hit the big club next year is just silly.
    You never know, Castro did it at 19. I am not saying that he will or that it's likely, i'm just saying it's possible.




    Major props to rdwilliamson

  2. #797
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cubsrule View Post
    You never know, Castro did it at 19. I am not saying that he will or that it's likely, i'm just saying it's possible.
    Castro was 20.

    I'm extremely high on Almora so I leave 2014 open as a possibility, but 2013 just isn't going to happen.

    OTOH, I could totally see him catching up to Baez at the minor league level in 2013. Maybe even LIKE totally.

  3. #798
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    It'd sure be nice if Almora and Baez were knocking at the door in 2014...I think that's about a year too early though, 2015 is more realistic if all things pan out

  4. #799
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    I believe Almora will be ready before Baez, who is all kinds of rough around the edges.

    If those two are on the same team I might make a trip just to see how they interact with each other.

  5. #800
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cubsrule View Post
    You never know, Castro did it at 19. I am not saying that he will or that it's likely, i'm just saying it's possible.
    1) Starlin Castro made his MLB debut at 20
    2) Starlin Castro was an IFA who had been playing professionally since he was 17, a year younger than Almora's debut
    3) Castro played for a much more aggressive organization at the time. This one has constantly preached that they will move prospects slowly.

  6. #801
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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleJRM:24643689
    Quote Originally Posted by Cubsrule View Post
    You never know, Castro did it at 19. I am not saying that he will or that it's likely, i'm just saying it's possible.
    1) Starlin Castro made his MLB debut at 20
    2) Starlin Castro was an IFA who had been playing professionally since he was 17, a year younger than Almora's debut
    3) Castro played for a much more aggressive organization at the time. This one has constantly preached that they will move prospects slowly.
    Yeah they have to achieve certain goals at each level before moving up.

  7. #802
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    Castro was also rushed too much IMHO. He wasn't ready when he came up.

  8. #803
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    Blind support? More like an overwhelming willingness to try something new and take the organization in a new direction. The patchwork free agent route clearly didn't set this team up for prolonged success. They were good for two (2!) years and fell off the table the last few years. Why should they repeat that method again? In a few years, once we have a young group of core players, they'll start spending money again. At this point, paying free agents to play in non-competitive years makes no neither baseball nor business sense. When the team starts competing again, don't worry, you'll be seeing the big-name free agents coming back.
    Losing isn't new.

    Building up the farm system isn't a new, groundbreaking idea either.

    The patchwork FA route started with a 2008 team that won the most games in baseball. The farm failed to supplement that roster.

    A few years? Are you ****ing kidding me? It just gets worse...I've never gotten a straight answer to this question so I ask again: How many players form this almighty Core?

    Paying FAs to be part of that Core that will be the Future makes sense to me.

    When the team starts competing again keeps getting pushed back and I get to hear tales of One Day.

  9. #804
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    If it helps Gato, it's 4 4+WAR guys. Right now we have maybe 1 in Shark. You could stretch it to two with Garza. But both of those are stretches as neither has done it more than once. I think we have one in Castro and Rizzo might be able to pull it off.

    But then I also think Upton at 16 million per year and Greinke at a truckload would have been worth it. I mean, you've got +22WAR combined between the 6 of them right there, which is 10 more than we managed with our entire roster last year.

    And then. He made them pancakes.

  10. #805
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    Quote Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
    Losing isn't new.

    Building up the farm system isn't a new, groundbreaking idea either.

    The patchwork FA route started with a 2008 team that won the most games in baseball. The farm failed to supplement that roster.

    A few years? Are you ****ing kidding me? It just gets worse...I've never gotten a straight answer to this question so I ask again: How many players form this almighty Core?

    Paying FAs to be part of that Core that will be the Future makes sense to me.

    When the team starts competing again keeps getting pushed back and I get to hear tales of One Day.
    +1

    They already have two solid players in the field (Rizzo and Castro), an under the radar aging Soriano, and a defensively sound 2nd baseman with Barney plus two solid pieces in the rotation, Garza and Shark.

    I don't understand why they cannot go out and get Hamilton and an elite pitcher plus a few low cost veterans. This is the Chicago Cubs...not the Royals (or Rays or any other team on a strict budget), they shouldn't be afraid to open the wallet a little bit, especially when they won't lower ticket prices.

    I have zero patience because they're (Epstein and Hoyer) overrated. Neither has built a team from the ground up (which is why I wanted Billy Beane or that guy from the Rays). Epstein arrived in Boston with a stacked team. Hoyer has never done anything worthy of mentioning.

    I am just frustrated because I see a grim future for the Cubs. I don't like the philosophy of accidently on purpose putting together a crap roster to get a bad record and high draft picks. At least in the past it was possible to BS myself into thinking they would be good and get pumped for the season. Now it is indifference because it is common knowledge they are going to be an NL doormat.

  11. #806
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    Wait, so we're sure that Samardzija is a 4+ WAR guy based on peripherals spitting that out for one partial season, but *maybe* Castro and Rizzo might be one between them?

    That's an interesting perspective.

  12. #807
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    Looks like more people are coming to our side. Next years free agent class is worse than this years. People point to 2014 as the year but I'm not sure why. We will basically have soriano, Castro, wood, samardzija, rizzo, Castillo, Barney. That doesn't look all that promising to me. We might have to spend just to fill out the roster

  13. #808
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    The core topic is certainly interesting and since its never been defined by Theo or Jed, I hope someone asks THEM that question at the Convention. For myself(not trying to put words in their mouths) I'd say a major league core of a good to excellent team would include 2-3 All Star position player types, 3 more guys that are better than leahue average and 2 guys that basically are league average. Pitching? I'd want a legit ace(top 10 pitcher in baseball), another SP thats an AS as often as not, 2 solid workhorse types that slot in as 3's on the BA pitching scale, and a league average 5th, with a decent depth guy at 6, and a rookie that you don't think gets shelled at 7, if he gets thrown into the mix. Hard throwing bullpen arms throughout. With a system that sits in the top 10-12, thats neither top or bottom heavy, where each affiliate has solid prospects at it. Age-wise? The average age of yhe major league squad is 27.

  14. #809
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    The entire concept of a "core" is lame in my opinion.

    The Chicago Cubs have roughly 80-90 baseball players of note under their team control. Partitioning off a few and calling them a "core" doesn't aid our understanding of that group of players or the franchise's fortunes.

  15. #810
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mell413 View Post
    Looks like more people are coming to our side. Next years free agent class is worse than this years. People point to 2014 as the year but I'm not sure why. We will basically have soriano, Castro, wood, samardzija, rizzo, Castillo, Barney. That doesn't look all that promising to me. We might have to spend just to fill out the roster
    I don't think anyone is looking at 2014 as a playoff season. Nor do I see why FA has to be where positive additions have to come from. Personally, I think we'll make a trade or two that bring in good, young major leaguers next offseason. We're not going to see some bigtime splurge in FA like 2006 ever out of this group. One big signing? Sure. Maybe instead of that, 2 guys like Edwin Jackson, Nick Swisher?(not them, but guys that project that way in 2014 or 15).

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