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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Realistik84 View Post
    So trade the arguable best CB to play the game next to Deion who is still in his prime for a measly 1st round? Are you serious? WOW!

    For Jarvis Jones...who never played a snap? Glen Dorsey was expected to be dominant as a Rookie...how is he doing? (1 of 1,000,000 examples).
    Agreed. Revis is historically good. But as I have said I have moved off my stance of untradable, and moved him to highly improbable. But if a team was working from a trade that in principle traded Holmes for a number 1 receiver and a pick that allowed us along with our pick to take 2 of Manti, Jones, and Mingo, and a good player for Revis I am listening.

    The two examples I used were Vincent Jackson and Doug Martin, or Heyward-Bay and DMC. Revis changes a whole defense and means more then that to us. So thats where you have to start to get him in my opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    I don't have a problem with Holmes as much as I have a problem with the GM thinking he has a #1 wide receiver.

    I think Holmes is a good player, but how much attention does he get from the other team's game plan? I think hes the type of guy that could be a #2 and put up better numbers than the #1.
    He was drawing some attention, but more importantly is he could be one on one coverage. That matters. Still an expensive jerk.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    I don't have a problem with Holmes as much as I have a problem with the GM thinking he has a #1 wide receiver.

    I think Holmes is a good player, but how much attention does he get from the other team's game plan? I think hes the type of guy that could be a #2 and put up better numbers than the #1.
    Holmes is more of an intermediate field threat which is why the team complemented him with speed opposite his side in Schilens and Hill. Holmes was our best WR and he had tons of production. Lining him up opposite Burress last year was a mistake as Holmes wound up getting safety attention. Holmes had a huge day following Hill's week one performance.

    You've been here a long time and I don't recall your having issue with signing Holmes. Maybe I'm wrong with you but I do remember everyone being on board. Way too many revisionists here who are no different from flat-out liars. Don't know if that applies to you but it does so many here. Two-faced liars who change their stance due to circumstances. Poor values reflected. Teams were heavily after Holmes and there was outright fear on numerous threads that the Redskins or someone else would sign him. And now all this convenient rhetoric about the GM making the wrong call. Ridiculous.

  3. #63
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    ^^ Shut up. You're annoying. ^^
    Yankees - Jets - Rockets

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyyfan4life View Post
    ^^ Shut up. You're annoying. ^^
    agreed....


    #Hernandezing


    Quote Originally Posted by bwallstreet View Post
    haha delusional
    Someone underestimated the jets!

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by John X Doe View Post
    Holmes is more of an intermediate field threat which is why the team complemented him with speed opposite his side in Schilens and Hill. Holmes was our best WR and he had tons of production. Lining him up opposite Burress last year was a mistake as Holmes wound up getting safety attention. Holmes had a huge day following Hill's week one performance.

    You've been here a long time and I don't recall your having issue with signing Holmes. Maybe I'm wrong with you but I do remember everyone being on board. Way too many revisionists here who are no different from flat-out liars. Don't know if that applies to you but it does so many here. Two-faced liars who change their stance due to circumstances. Poor values reflected. Teams were heavily after Holmes and there was outright fear on numerous threads that the Redskins or someone else would sign him. And now all this convenient rhetoric about the GM making the wrong call. Ridiculous.
    I actually agree with this, Everyone latley wants Holmes gone but I think it would be a mistake at this point.Holmes has made alot of big plays for us in the past and he would be that much better with a real number 1 reciver like a Steve Smith or someone like that on the other side

  6. #66
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    I too remember back when Jet fans fellated Holmes with their words on the regular. Now that he's Derek rather than Hansel everyone is off the wagon.

  7. #67
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    Holmes was a great value for a 5th round draft pick - even though everybody should have known that he is a pathologically self-centered person, and he came with a 4 week drug suspension - and he was playing out his "contract year," for his next contract, and that is when selfish, self-centered (although a survivor) type players play there best.

    The trouble is with the contract he got. I wasn't one of those people that were saying we should have kept B. Edwards over Holmes because Holmes is clearly the more talented WR, BUT I also never thought that he was the type of #1 WR that could carry a team for more than just the odd game when he was totally motivated (the 1st Miami game to make up for last year), but not consistently, and not against double coverage because he stops running almost every time he sees tight/good coverage, double coverage, when he doesn't have position. In the final analysis, I think we would have been better off paying B. Edwards (if he took it) a much smaller, less guaranteed contract - and gone out and got another potent offensive weapon - but hindsight is BULL-oney anyway, besides Braylon Edwards is no Boy Scout either - but he had found some success with a winning team, and after a mediocre 2009 season when he had 35 catches in 12 games, in 2010, he was 2nd on the team with 53 catches - 7 TDs (Keller - 55-5TD; Holmes - 52-6TD in 12 games), he felt like he belonged, and he blocked his butt off, but Holmes played so well that year, and kept his destructive personality at bay.

    Here's a question that I think I know the answer to - if Holme's contract was NOT guaranteed, and cap unfriendly, would he have been cut after 2011? Answer - no (I don't think TREX would've done the "right thing") - because we had no talent @ WR - as we clearly see this year.

    Holmes is the kind of player that has to have an incentive laden contract, because once he got the money - look what happened - and I'm still angry that he got off scott free from last year's destruction - and they made Sanchez go kiss and make up with him. The reason? They know Holmes would never do it - and Sanchez is a team guy that swallowed his pride for the good of the team because he knew that he needed him. They put Sanchez in a no win scenario. How can he be the unquestioned leader when he has to go suck up to Holmes. Once again - this illustrates how Sanchez's development has never been given the proper priority - DARN!

    We are stuck with Holmes again next year, and my only hope is that he realizes he has to work his butt off to get healthy, and play his butt off for his next contract (although he made so much money that if he were smart with it - he could live large for the rest of his life, and have something to pass on - oh wait - that would be totally out of character-none), and then let some other team pick up this head ache.

    GO JETS!!!

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetsfansince'67 View Post
    Holmes was a great value for a 5th round draft pick - even though everybody should have known that he is a pathologically self-centered person, and he came with a 4 week drug suspension - and he was playing out his "contract year," for his next contract, and that is when selfish, self-centered (although a survivor) type players play there best
    I still think the biggest problem is roster strategy. They picked up/re-signed Holmes and thought they were set and neglected the WR position. What if the Jets didn't great value with another 5th round pick - Jeremy Kerley?

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    I still think the biggest problem is roster strategy. They picked up/re-signed Holmes and thought they were set and neglected the WR position. What if the Jets didn't great value with another 5th round pick - Jeremy Kerley?
    Kerley is going to be very good, but he's a work in progress. He's not even close to stepping into a #1 WR position.

    The same goes with guys like Gates and Hill. Works in progress who are being asked to step into roles they're not ready for.

    They replaced Edwards with Plax, then replaced Plax with Schillens. Bad talent management.
    Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.
    -Sun Tzu

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Magoo View Post
    Kerley is going to be very good, but he's a work in progress. He's not even close to stepping into a #1 WR position.

    The same goes with guys like Gates and Hill. Works in progress who are being asked to step into roles they're not ready for.

    They replaced Edwards with Plax, then replaced Plax with Schillens. Bad talent management.
    Schilens wasn't brought in to start. Bad interpretation of the truth.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by John X Doe View Post
    Schilens wasn't brought in to start. Bad interpretation of the truth.
    Correct. It went-> Edwards to Plax to Stephen Hill. Even worse talent management.
    Yankees - Jets - Rockets

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by nyyfan4life View Post
    Correct. It went-> Edwards to Plax to Stephen Hill. Even worse talent management.
    Don't bother. Reality doesn't matter to him. Technically Schillens was signed to be the #2, but he got hurt (as usual) in training camp, so Hill moved up on the chart. Remember how mad Chaz was that Cro declared himself the second best WR on the team?

    He's trying so hard to bait me by attacking my posts after I told him that I was done with him. I guess some people can't take rejection. It's actually sad how desperate some people are for someone to talk to them.

    Kind of like his new girlfriend (Beetlejuice) who popped in here a couple of weeks ago because he hates the fact I told the truth about him months ago.
    Last edited by Mr. Magoo; 12-02-2012 at 01:41 AM.
    Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.
    -Sun Tzu

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by John X Doe View Post
    Schilens wasn't brought in to start. Bad interpretation of the truth.
    Thats my problem in a nutshell.

    They went into the season with one starter, Santonio Holmes. Even if he doesn't go down, the Jets had to know what they were dealing with.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    I still think the biggest problem is roster strategy. They picked up/re-signed Holmes and thought they were set and neglected the WR position. What if the Jets didn't great value with another 5th round pick - Jeremy Kerley?
    Actually, they went out and signed a guy a lot of teams were after, Plaxico. He just didn't turn out. Had he been close to his previously seen level of play, you'd be calling the front office genuises. This team is not adverse to taking risk and as with all risk, you are rewarded or you're not. In a division with Tom Bady, you have to take some chances to even the playing field. They also got Mason to help develop Kerley. Again, this could've worked out great but it didn't and a year removed, some of you have forgotten how we got here.

    And they did move up to get a guy many thought might go in the first round - Hill. Everyone was on board with that pick but alas, when things aren't going as expected, everyone points fingers and claims that better foresight should've been executed. Classic armchair QBing. And everyone gets mad at me for poiting this out but it happens to be the truth for most here. I can only recall a precious few who were against many of the moves made the last several years.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman View Post
    Thats my problem in a nutshell.

    They went into the season with one starter, Santonio Holmes. Even if he doesn't go down, the Jets had to know what they were dealing with.
    How many starters could you have foreseen acquiring? What WR's were out there? At what cost? Who would we have not gone after to get another insurance WR after drafting one high? Should we have not gone after Laron Landry?

    I don't know. I felt a platoon of Schilens and hill was adequate opposite our #1. I don't know many teams who could thrive after losing their best WR. It's just unfortunate.
    Last edited by John X Doe; 12-03-2012 at 11:34 AM.

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