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  1. #811
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mell413 View Post
    I guess. It might be in a funk now, but I don't expect it to stay that way for long. Even though the position is down I just can't get that excited over that kind of bat. I guess I don't see the appeal in wasting a season to see if he can reach that kind of upside
    It's not "wasting a season" to play a kid who has under 500 career MLB ab's and who was considered one of the Indians best prospects recently. That's part of the problem I'm seeing, I think some people have gone so far the other way that now playing a prospect who isn't a consensus top 20 guy is considered a waste. That's not the case here. Chisenhall has already seen some modicum of success in the MLB. While Bill James projections tend to be optimistic, he's got him as a .322 wOBA kid next season. Thats good enough for mediocre 3b production. And all of that, at a free salary. If you want the Cubs to flex financial muscle, they still need cheap players at some positions - this team cannot field a $200m payroll. It's why Darwin Barney is nice. He's a 2-3 win 2b for free. Hell, his wOBA is below .300.

    I'm not saying Chisenhall is the solution and the only solution, but he's got some upside, is free salary wise, is under control for a while, and I think he's better than any other 3b prospect we have in the system right now (outside of Baez, but he's still a SS prospect until we hear otherwise). He'd be a super solid addition. Just because he's not a stud, doesn't make him solid.

    Lastly, on the topic of 3b....it's not getting any better. You've got some young kids coming up, like Moose, Pacheco, Alvarez, Lawrie, Olt....but some of them will fail, and the ones who are left are really only going to be able to replace those on the list who are old and getting older. 3b is going to stick this way, probably, for a while. Offense has shifted to other positions.
    #WhyNot?

    People ask me, "Why here? Why Kentucky?", I said "Why not"? It can be done here. It will be done here. Lay the foundation. Recruit and develop. Prepare to win. Day by day. Play by play. A new era of high performance. Why Kentucky? Why not? -Mark Stoops

  2. #812
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedHeadsRule View Post
    According to chicagocubsonline, Levine mentioned Lonnie Chisenhall again as a possibility and that the Indians do have interest in some players in our system. Levine's been mentioning him a lot lately.

    ABTY also posted about him recently I believe.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yagyu+ View Post
    That's probably worth paying attention to. There's this from October 11:



    I don't know if it would place any urgency on getting a deal done, but 40-man rosters have to be set this Tuesday, November 20, for the Rule 5 Draft.
    That was what perked my ears. There usually is a lot of activity right before Thanksgiving anyway and with the deadline for rosters being set, I'm very curious to see what we get done before then.

  3. #813
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    Quote Originally Posted by davell View Post
    That was what perked my ears. There usually is a lot of activity right before Thanksgiving anyway and with the deadline for rosters being set, I'm very curious to see what we get done before then.
    Here is what the Cubs did around this time last year in preparation for the Rule 5 Draft:


    • Outrighted Lou Montanez to Iowa Cubs.
    • Outrighted RHP Esmailin Caridad to Iowa Cubs.
    • Outrighted Kyle Smit to Iowa Cubs.
    • Selected the contract of Junior Lake from Tennessee Smokies.
    • Selected the contract of Matt Szczur from Daytona Cubs.
    • Called up LHP Jeff Beliveau from Tennessee Smokies.
    • Called up 3B Josh Vitters from Tennessee Smokies.

  4. #814
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    I can't believe people are poo-pooing above league average offense from a 24 year old 3b.


  5. #815
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jilly Bohnson View Post
    I can't believe people are poo-pooing above league average offense from a 24 year old 3b.
    I just don't think his ceiling is that high. I just think we have to aim higher at some point. I think we have enough guys that can give us 2 wins at 1 win prices. When Theo was brought here the bar was raised on the types of players that we would be bringing in. I mean he's an upgrade over what we have, but I wouldn't be really excited about him either. I realize you can't have 4-5 win guys at every spot, but I'd like to see this team get some elite players at a position. Also where can you find average stats for position?
    Last edited by Mell413; 11-18-2012 at 12:23 PM.

  6. #816
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mell413 View Post
    I just don't think his ceiling is that high. I just think we have to aim higher at some point. I think we have enough guys that can give us 2 wins at 1 win prices. When Theo was brought here the bar was raised on the types of players that we would be bringing in. I mean he's an upgrade over what we have, but I wouldn't be really excited about him either. Also where can you find average stats for position?
    This is you still really wanting Chase Headley isnt' it? Because realistically I'm not sure where you're seeing an available 3b option other than him better than a 24 year old putting up a .335 wOBA.

    If you just didn't have a lot of faith in Chisenhall I'd understand(and agree), but I'm not seeing many higher places to aim than those numbers 1908 laid out. Your options at 3b are Youkilis, Headley, Wright, or a kid in the vein of Chisenhall. It's bad out there.

    Positional numbers you can find on ESPN's player stats page. You can sort by position and batting order.


  7. #817
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    If the Chisenhall can put up a .335 wOBA he's a very nice player to slot in a 3B. Not to mention coming over to the NL and playing at Wrigley might help him.

    Chisenhall doesn't block anyone, is young and cheap, and if he tears it up he could become a long term piece or trade bait when Baez is ready if he moves off SS to 3B (could move to 2B as well).

    I really like trying to get him as part of a trade package for Justin Masterson.

  8. #818
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mell413 View Post
    I just don't think his ceiling is that high. I just think we have to aim higher at some point. I think we have enough guys that can give us 2 wins at 1 win prices. When Theo was brought here the bar was raised on the types of players that we would be bringing in. I mean he's an upgrade over what we have, but I wouldn't be really excited about him either. I realize you can't have 4-5 win guys at every spot, but I'd like to see this team get some elite players at a position. Also where can you find average stats for position?
    I agree at somepoint we will need to aim higher, but realistically who out there is obtainable? If Wright becomes available I think we could get him but Headley seems to be out of the question, and there really isn't anyone else out there on the market.

    Chisenhall would be a solid player to add at 3B for cheap until an elite talent or better player becomes available through trade or prospects (Baez, Villanueva, etc.). A Chisenhall/Chavez platoon would be pretty nice for next season.

  9. #819
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jilly Bohnson View Post
    This is you still really wanting Chase Headley isnt' it? Because realistically I'm not sure where you're seeing an available 3b option other than him better than a 24 year old putting up a .335 wOBA.

    If you just didn't have a lot of faith in Chisenhall I'd understand(and agree), but I'm not seeing many higher places to aim than those numbers 1908 laid out. Your options at 3b are Youkilis, Headley, Wright, or a kid in the vein of Chisenhall. It's bad out there.

    Positional numbers you can find on ESPN's player stats page. You can sort by position and batting order.
    I've been over Headley since we got Stewart last off season. No sense dwelling on what we don't have. I'm just not as high on Chisenhall as I was in past years. Although I'd rather take a chance on him than Youk. I want(ed) this team to get better so assuming we gave up something like Vitters and a little extra I probably wouldn't complain, but I don't think he's someone worth getting excited over either. I do like Wright though so if he ever did become available I'd like this team to be all over it. Part of it could be my frustration over how this past year or so has gone
    Last edited by Mell413; 11-18-2012 at 12:42 PM.

  10. #820
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    I'm not big on Chisenhall either, so agreed with Mel there. I think I say all the time that I want the name brand, and I definitely agree his upside isn't huge. He is an option THO...and he's done better than what the Cubs have.

  11. #821
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    If it's a choice between Chisenhall and Stewart, I'll take Chisenhall. But otherwise, there's not much to like there. There's a serious OBP problem there and I don't think his defense is all that impressive. I saw all this talk about ".335 wOBA" and wondered if he was way better than I remembered or something.

  12. #822
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    Quote Originally Posted by KyleJRM View Post
    If it's a choice between Chisenhall and Stewart, I'll take Chisenhall. But otherwise, there's not much to like there. There's a serious OBP problem there and I don't think his defense is all that impressive. I saw all this talk about ".335 wOBA" and wondered if he was way better than I remembered or something.
    I gave him a ceiling of .335 and a possible range of .325-.335, is all. Mell mentioned a .335 3b wouldn't excite him. Kind of took off from there.

    He's probably lower then that, realistically, but I did use it as a ceiling number.

    I'm not huge on Chisenhall either, but I think there's some medium upside, and he's better than what we have. If it's a Vitters + a little for Chisenhall, I have no problem with swapping 3b prospects.
    #WhyNot?

    People ask me, "Why here? Why Kentucky?", I said "Why not"? It can be done here. It will be done here. Lay the foundation. Recruit and develop. Prepare to win. Day by day. Play by play. A new era of high performance. Why Kentucky? Why not? -Mark Stoops

  13. #823
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1908_Cubs View Post
    I gave him a ceiling of .335 and a possible range of .325-.335, is all. Mell mentioned a .335 3b wouldn't excite him. Kind of took off from there.

    He's probably lower then that, realistically, but I did use it as a ceiling number.

    I'm not huge on Chisenhall either, but I think there's some medium upside, and he's better than what we have. If it's a Vitters + a little for Chisenhall, I have no problem with swapping 3b prospects.
    Fangraphs has him as a .322 wOBA with 18 HR's 73 RBI's a .262 BA. Not too bad if those pan out.

  14. #824
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    Don't you just love how many mediocre players can slip through the cracks on the basis that they are "better than what the Cubs currently have?" I really hope the FO is picky about who gets to come here and be apart of these teams.

  15. #825
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    I'm not going to complain *too* much about mediocre players when we still have so many awful ones. If we'd had mediocrity at C, CF, 3b, 5th starter and the bullpen last season, we might have been a. 500 team.

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