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  1. #16
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    Why does everyone want Webb in at wide receiver, when its obvious he belongs at quarterback? Is there a lot of fans of Troy Williamson on this thread? Because that's what Webb is, fast but can't catch. Oh wait, Troy could actually run routes at the NFL level. In college (UAB) they became enamored with Webb's speed. Webb was tried at WR. He was horrible. UAB determined that quarterback was his best position. Webb was returned to his natural position of QB. In High School (Wenonah, Webb was lighting it up with his arm. Webb had a game where he threw for 415 yards andy 4 touchdowns. Al Bundy would be proud. At UAB, Webb set an NCAA record for THROWING for 2,000 yards running for 1,000 yards in consecutive seasons. In the pros Webb has had 2 NFL administrations determine that his best position is quarterback . Webb has only started 2 games yet some have determined that is enough to know that he will never be an NFL QB, yet turn around and declare Ponder just needs more time. Ponder, after being the most NFL ready QB, has only started 19 games. It seems like Webb only gets the tough defenses. Philly, the Bears twice, Detroit twice. Why do I think that Webb will get thrown out against the Bears a third time? Jan 1, 2012 Webb came in relief, and passed for 200 yards. No Kalil blocking, no Jenkins or Simpson catching passes, and no Adrian Peterson rushing for 180 yards. As for the Vikings having no faith in Webb, is that fact, or just one writers speculation? This year Webb has been converted to a more conventional pro style offense, running the same plays that Ponder runs. No gimmicks, no spread. It's all new, and he still looked good in the preseason. Bench Ponder, it's Webb time.

  2. #17
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    They believed in Webb enough to release a proven back up QB at the start of the season in order to give Webb that spot.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple crush View Post
    Why does everyone want Webb in at wide receiver, when its obvious he belongs at quarterback? Is there a lot of fans of Troy Williamson on this thread? Because that's what Webb is, fast but can't catch. Oh wait, Troy could actually run routes at the NFL level. In college (UAB) they became enamored with Webb's speed. Webb was tried at WR. He was horrible. UAB determined that quarterback was his best position. Webb was returned to his natural position of QB. In High School (Wenonah, Webb was lighting it up with his arm. Webb had a game where he threw for 415 yards andy 4 touchdowns. Al Bundy would be proud. At UAB, Webb set an NCAA record for THROWING for 2,000 yards running for 1,000 yards in consecutive seasons. In the pros Webb has had 2 NFL administrations determine that his best position is quarterback . Webb has only started 2 games yet some have determined that is enough to know that he will never be an NFL QB, yet turn around and declare Ponder just needs more time. Ponder, after being the most NFL ready QB, has only started 19 games. It seems like Webb only gets the tough defenses. Philly, the Bears twice, Detroit twice. Why do I think that Webb will get thrown out against the Bears a third time? Jan 1, 2012 Webb came in relief, and passed for 200 yards. No Kalil blocking, no Jenkins or Simpson catching passes, and no Adrian Peterson rushing for 180 yards. As for the Vikings having no faith in Webb, is that fact, or just one writers speculation? This year Webb has been converted to a more conventional pro style offense, running the same plays that Ponder runs. No gimmicks, no spread. It's all new, and he still looked good in the preseason. Bench Ponder, it's Webb time.
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple crush View Post
    Why does everyone want Webb in at wide receiver, when its obvious he belongs at quarterback? Is there a lot of fans of Troy Williamson on this thread? Because that's what Webb is, fast but can't catch. Oh wait, Troy could actually run routes at the NFL level. In college (UAB) they became enamored with Webb's speed. Webb was tried at WR. He was horrible. UAB determined that quarterback was his best position. Webb was returned to his natural position of QB. In High School (Wenonah, Webb was lighting it up with his arm. Webb had a game where he threw for 415 yards andy 4 touchdowns. Al Bundy would be proud. At UAB, Webb set an NCAA record for THROWING for 2,000 yards running for 1,000 yards in consecutive seasons. In the pros Webb has had 2 NFL administrations determine that his best position is quarterback . Webb has only started 2 games yet some have determined that is enough to know that he will never be an NFL QB, yet turn around and declare Ponder just needs more time. Ponder, after being the most NFL ready QB, has only started 19 games. It seems like Webb only gets the tough defenses. Philly, the Bears twice, Detroit twice. Why do I think that Webb will get thrown out against the Bears a third time? Jan 1, 2012 Webb came in relief, and passed for 200 yards. No Kalil blocking, no Jenkins or Simpson catching passes, and no Adrian Peterson rushing for 180 yards. As for the Vikings having no faith in Webb, is that fact, or just one writers speculation? This year Webb has been converted to a more conventional pro style offense, running the same plays that Ponder runs. No gimmicks, no spread. It's all new, and he still looked good in the preseason. Bench Ponder, it's Webb time.
    I really don't know what pre-season you were whatching but no, its not Joe Webb time. This was the year that all kinds of people were pissed off that Webb didn't get a chance to compete to be a starter. Well even if they gave him the chance it would not have been a contest. After three years on our team and two years in the Musgrave system (over which time he has gotten the majority of the 2nd team snaps) Webb was a horrible disappointment this year in the pre-season. He struggled to complete even simple passes and wanted to take off and run too much.

    I agree with your reasons for why we don't have him at WR for now, in 2010 and 2011 they thought that his best chance to be a good player was at QB, however he showed this year in the pre-season that he is no where close to being a good QB, really all he can do is run and avoid tackles. He has a strong arm but can't really do anything good short-medium and can't read defenses either. Moving forward I think that the only way we can see any useful production from him is as a gimmick player. They tried to make him a decent QB, they failed.

    Quote Originally Posted by dimgim View Post
    They believed in Webb enough to release a proven back up QB at the start of the season in order to give Webb that spot.
    This was a mistake because right now, when it comes to actually PASSING the ball, Rosenfels is a better QB than Webb. Webb has a stronger arm, Rosenfels has a stronger brain and he has shown it time and again in the pre-season. I'm not going to say that the guy should be a starter or anything, but consistently when I've seen him in the pre-season all he does is make the right decisions, find the weaknesses in coverage and find the open man. This is in the same situation where Joe Webb can't complete a pass.

    Suffice it to say, the level of quarterback play dropped off glaringly after Ponder. Joe Webb was next up in the rotation and he was flat-out brutal. Reports on Webb from training camp have not been positive and last night’s performance showed us why. Webb seemed completely lost in the offense, spraying throws all over the place and basically looking like a guy who doesn’t belong on a football field as a professional quarterback. Obviously, Webb needs a gimmick offense designed specifically for him if he is going to succeed (much like Tim Tebow). Trying to run the Vikings’ basic offense, even in its vanilla preseason form, he just looks helpless and confused.
    Webb’s only highlights were the usual Webb highlights: he scrambles, you think he’s going to go down, he somehow gets away, he manages to get the ball off before losing yardage. If Webb occasionally completed a big play down the field after one of his crazy scrambles, he’d be the stuff of legend. But running all over the place just to throw it out of bounds will not make you Fran Tarkenton. It won’t even make you Christian Ponder. On the basis of last night, Webb isn’t even the #3 QB on this squad, much less the #2.
    .....................
    Between MBT and Webb, at this point I’d take MBT only because he looks more like a real QB, though he still has a long way to go in his development. On the basis of the evidence put forth so far this preseason, Joe Webb is ready for the scrap heap. Unless you plan on putting in a whole read-option offense for him. But that’s not really worth the effort.
    http://thevikingage.com/2012/08/11/v...thel-thompson/

    Webb's pre-season stats

    Week 1
    4/11 completions/attempts
    36.4% completion rate
    20 yards passing
    QB rating 44.9
    10 yards lost on 2 sacks
    2 rushing attempts for 9 yards

    Week 2
    7/15 completion/attempts
    46.7% completion rate
    73 yards passing
    QB rating 61.2
    1 sack, 0 yards lost (tackled at the line)
    2 rushing attempts for 64 yards

    Week 3
    6/8 completion/attempts
    75% completion rate
    QB rating 95.3
    0 sacks
    0 rushing attempts

    Week 4
    4/7 completions/attempts
    57.1 % completion rate
    QB rating 77.7
    2 sacks, 18 yards lost
    2 rushing attempts for 22 yards

    Totals for the pre-season
    21/41 completion/ attemps
    51.2% completion rate
    199 passing yards, 0 TDs, 0 INTs
    5 sacks for a loss of 28 yards
    6 rushing attempts for 95 yards

    Joe Webb is not a QB that we should be hoping to see on the field. He's not anything close to being a good QB and the way things are going, three years into his pro career he probably never will be.

    Vikings Roster thread
    http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...d.php?t=718220

    WE TRUST V4LB!!! HE IS THE GREATEST GUY IN OUR FOURM.
    WITHOUT HIM OUR FOURM WOULDNT BE EXCITING.
    HE GETS ALL THE WOMEN!!!!
    HE IS NEVER WRONG!!!
    WE TRIED TO VOTE FOR HIM FOR PRESIDENT BUT HE IS SO GREAT THAT HE WOULDNT RUN FOR OFFICE

  5. #20
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    The stats don't tell the entire story...

    First off, the SF game was Webb's first game in a more conventional pro style offense. Ponder raved about the protection he received in that game. He claimed it was the best he ever had. When Webb was in, not so much. Webb had a lot of scab offensive lineman trying to block, and failing immensely. Most of them are gone. Ponder was handing off to Toby Gerhardt. Toby was rumbling along for about twenty yards a carry. When Webb handed off, his running back was stuffed at the line of scrimmage. Ponder was flipping passes to a possible league MVP in Percy Harvin. Then Percy would rip off 30 yards. When Webb went back to throw, he would... uh...actually Webb didn't have time to throw. You can argue back up verses backup, but when your offensive line gets beat like that, it doesn't really matter.

    Webb's best game was probably his third game. He started 6-6, and his seventh throw was on target, but the receiver dropped it. For a guy with only two starts under his belt, no not too bad. That said, great to see Ponder turn it around today.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple crush View Post
    First off, the SF game was Webb's first game in a more conventional pro style offense. Ponder raved about the protection he received in that game. He claimed it was the best he ever had. When Webb was in, not so much. Webb had a lot of scab offensive lineman trying to block, and failing immensely. Most of them are gone. Ponder was handing off to Toby Gerhardt. Toby was rumbling along for about twenty yards a carry. When Webb handed off, his running back was stuffed at the line of scrimmage. Ponder was flipping passes to a possible league MVP in Percy Harvin. Then Percy would rip off 30 yards. When Webb went back to throw, he would... uh...actually Webb didn't have time to throw. You can argue back up verses backup, but when your offensive line gets beat like that, it doesn't really matter.

    Webb's best game was probably his third game. He started 6-6, and his seventh throw was on target, but the receiver dropped it. For a guy with only two starts under his belt, no not too bad. That said, great to see Ponder turn it around today.
    Ok, assuming this is true, that it was the fault of the talent around Webb and not Webb's own fault that he massively under-performed in the pre-season, how do you explain Rosenfels (who is far less mobile) consistently outperforming him while strapped with even worse talent since he was working with 3rd stringers?

    Sage Rosenfels' 2012 stats

    17/25 completions/attempts
    68% completion rate
    225 yards and 2 TDs
    122.9 QB rating
    2 sacks for a loss of 8 yards total
    http://www.nfl.com/player/sagerosenf...04729/gamelogs

    Also, I hate to break it to you but no, this was not Webb's first game in a conventional offense at all. While its true that they did have the blazer package wildcat nonsense last year, ever since 2010 (when they stopped putting him in at WR and on kick returns, I think after the Giants game where he went in for a hurt T-Jack) Webb has been drilled to be the backup QB and should be capable of most any play in the book. Not only that, for the early part of camp in 2011 they had Webb running the first team offense because Ponder was a rookie and McNabb was not allowed to practice due to league rules and probably ended up with more first team reps than Ponder had in his rookie camp. All of Webb's 2011 action (excluding the moronic implementation of the Blazer package) was in the exact same offense, which he went into camp this year as the 2nd string guy and they were't feeding him trick plays late in 2010 either, he was starting and he had at least a shot at becoming our QB of the future (this would have been a possibility had he defeated the Lions in week 16 of 2010). By this point in his career, Webb should be more developed as a QB, the fact that he isn't speaks volumes about his total long-term potential. As well as he's done making plays with his feet in the past, he's always going to be a run-first QB with limited capability as a passer.

    I agree with you that he's not going to ever be a good WR, but at this point Webb really should be a 3rd stringer and be used for gadget trick plays like Brad Smith (and I don't mean the highly unimaginative Blazer package) we should do stuff where he's handed the ball in the backfield or use him as part of a double reverse or something like that. I wouldn't even mind having a trick play like a flea flicker where someone laterals him the ball in the back field and he hurls it deep, this plays on his arm strength.

    I agreed with the call of keeping Webb at QB in 2010 (especially after the pre-season) and was supportive of developing him into a QB, I think he's more athletic than both RG*** and Cam Newton, and had he have panned out he could have been better than both of them. However if we need to judge him now, I would have to say that he has not beaten the long odds that were against him and has not progressed. At this point would be best used as a gimmick player because at least then we'd get some production out of him.

    Vikings Roster thread
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    WE TRUST V4LB!!! HE IS THE GREATEST GUY IN OUR FOURM.
    WITHOUT HIM OUR FOURM WOULDNT BE EXCITING.
    HE GETS ALL THE WOMEN!!!!
    HE IS NEVER WRONG!!!
    WE TRIED TO VOTE FOR HIM FOR PRESIDENT BUT HE IS SO GREAT THAT HE WOULDNT RUN FOR OFFICE

  7. #22
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    Why all this joe webb bs Ponder will be fin....he's just gotta let the game come to him instead of trying to force it

  8. #23
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    Purple crush is Joe Webb


    23 TACKLES/2 SACKS
    (Season Stats)

  9. #24
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    Last year...

    Webb was operating out of the spread, not a conventional pro style offense. The sportswriter s talked about the conversion in the preseason.

  10. #25
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    Why Webb at WR we haven't seen in at WR enough to say he sucks at it aswell if you want to use that logic to say that about his QB play,,,,it cuts both ways. I am saying that because he is one of the most athletic players on our team, and his body fits the WR mold perfectly...Sorry but you wouldn't put Percy on the Line would you.....And he can still be our No 2 QB but get him on the field...I just strongly believe that if we throw to him a couple of times his pure athleticism is going to take over and we will not be looking for another Wr we will be looking for another backup QB. Dont waste talent and athleticism like that,,,is all I am saying and his QB play that I have seen,,,which was every pro snap he has taken proves to me that we shouldn't just freeze him on the QB circuit.

  11. #26
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    Were you a fan of Troy Williamson??

    He was really fast, and could run routes. Maybe the Vikings could bring in some track stars, they're really fast. Bottom line, Webb was a quarterback in high school. In college UAB was infatuated with Webb's speed. They tried him there--they weren't impressed. The experts who said John Randle wasn't big enough to play DT in the NFL, thought the leap to QB from UAB to the pros was too large. Webb has already proved that wrong. With all Webb's speed and athleticism, he was only projected as a sixth round pick as a receiver. Webb is not a receiver. Two different coaching administrations for the Vikings tried to take advantage of Joe's speed. Both came to the conclusion that Webb is a QB.
    To recap, college (UAB), two different Vikings coaching staffs, and all tried Webb at receiver. Its been tried to death. Troy Williamson was a better receiver. Webb is a QB.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coenthar View Post
    Why Webb at WR we haven't seen in at WR enough to say he sucks at it aswell if you want to use that logic to say that about his QB play,,,,it cuts both ways. I am saying that because he is one of the most athletic players on our team, and his body fits the WR mold perfectly...Sorry but you wouldn't put Percy on the Line would you.....And he can still be our No 2 QB but get him on the field...I just strongly believe that if we throw to him a couple of times his pure athleticism is going to take over and we will not be looking for another Wr we will be looking for another backup QB. Dont waste talent and athleticism like that,,,is all I am saying and his QB play that I have seen,,,which was every pro snap he has taken proves to me that we shouldn't just freeze him on the QB circuit.
    Pure Athleticism isn't going to help him know what route to run though, and I'm still very skeptical of his catching ability. I don't really care about how big his hands are, if the coaching staff though he'd be a better WR than a QB, they would have moved him.

    Vikings Roster thread
    http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...d.php?t=718220

    WE TRUST V4LB!!! HE IS THE GREATEST GUY IN OUR FOURM.
    WITHOUT HIM OUR FOURM WOULDNT BE EXCITING.
    HE GETS ALL THE WOMEN!!!!
    HE IS NEVER WRONG!!!
    WE TRIED TO VOTE FOR HIM FOR PRESIDENT BUT HE IS SO GREAT THAT HE WOULDNT RUN FOR OFFICE

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by purple crush View Post
    Webb was operating out of the spread, not a conventional pro style offense. The sportswriter s talked about the conversion in the preseason.
    Lets see some links on that. Sure Webb's background at UAB was in the spread, and at some point they probably did have a special package for him, however I'm going over film right now from 2010 (I have the NFL Game Pass which goes back to games from 2009-present) and while they did run a lot of shotgun stuff in his first real game action against the Bears and Giants in 2010, the majority of the snaps he took when he defeated the Eagles were from under center (I especially remember the awesome play where he drew them offside using the hard count), running a conventional west coast offense under Darrel Bevel.

    Moving into 2011 with Musgrave, the first Vikings pre-season game Webb took almost everything from under-center and most plays he only had two WRs on the field, this isn't a spread offense. While you could also see clear use of the spread against the Lions in 2011, when he was subbed in against the Redskins and the Bears, most of his snaps were under center as well. Its incorrect to say that Webb had not played in a pro style offense until this pre-season and was unfamiliar with it.

    Vikings Roster thread
    http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...d.php?t=718220

    WE TRUST V4LB!!! HE IS THE GREATEST GUY IN OUR FOURM.
    WITHOUT HIM OUR FOURM WOULDNT BE EXCITING.
    HE GETS ALL THE WOMEN!!!!
    HE IS NEVER WRONG!!!
    WE TRIED TO VOTE FOR HIM FOR PRESIDENT BUT HE IS SO GREAT THAT HE WOULDNT RUN FOR OFFICE

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by dimgim View Post
    They believed in Webb enough to release a proven back up QB at the start of the season in order to give Webb that spot.
    God aweful decision by the way.

  15. #30
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    The best and only way to use Joe Webb is how the Jets used Brad Smith. Reverses and trick plays. Possibly some kick returns.


    “I can’t wait to stand on the podium with Zygi and Mark and Jonathan, and we’re standing on the podium, and we look up and the confetti is falling down on top of us, and we’re all hand in hand, and Commissioner Goodell comes over and hands the Super Bowl trophy to Mr. Wilf and tells him he’s world champion, that is my goal and that is my drive.”
    - Mike Zimmer

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