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  1. #1
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    Will Repubs extend an Olive Branch to Minorities or Backlash even more??

    Listening to Hannity and Limbaugh it's interesting split in the far right. Seems like Hannity has "evolved" on immigration reform not sure about things like welfare, women's rights while Limbaugh seems to take the "Eff Them" stance. He almost sounds of on the verge of calling for a rich white man revolution. Where do you see them going? Hannity or Limbaugh's route?

  2. #2
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    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    They don't have to be a diet version of anything. Their economic/fiscal issues are what really separate them. They just are horrible at relaying their message to anyone who isn't running a business. Issues like immigration, Abortion, contraception, energry, creationism, war on academia are what paint them in such a bad light.
    Last edited by waveycrockett; 11-09-2012 at 11:45 AM.

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    As the minority population grows into a majority its inevitable that at least some will be more conservative than others. It might not be the same brand of conservative, but its not like there are no anti-abortion, pro-gun, etc. Mexicans in the south. Republicans have had Hispanic representation in Texas and elsewhere.

    They'll get support, but without an overall policy change its hard for them to be appealing to minorities. Gotta remember, "republican", right or wrong, is now synonymous with "conservative". In the history of our country, whether it was civil rights, women's right to vote, welfare, unions, etc. it's the conservative side that has opposed these movements, while the liberal or progressives fight for them.

    So now that "liberal" is synonymous with "democrat" (unfairly in my mind since most of these Dems in Congress are more moderate than liberal), they'll always get most of the minority votes and soon enough they'll be the majority. What's funny is that the republicans use of the word "liberals" or "those libs" as a disparaging term, is actually working against them.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    I see your point and agree. However, with something like immigration the easiest thing they could do is reference Reagan granting amnesty, and possibly even admit that their stance had been wrong.

    There are ways they can adapt without compromising their entire platform/strategy.

  6. #6
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    The Republican agenda will conform to the realities of the demographic or wither away.
    It has only been till recently with Grover N. tax pledge and other fringe elements driveing the party far rt. on every issue that has taken them towards irrelevancy.

    By pointing to wins in 2010 and 2012 as a Marker, what people fail to realize is that by winning by default is not a action plan for the future(lol).

    The REAL problem with Rs is that to much of their Dark Money is coming from the Sheldon Addelsons of the world , so when people plead with them to take a less rigid stance ,they are alrady bought and sold,lock,stock and barrel.

    They cant move RT. on social issues becasue they NEED the religious RT. even if they are just pandering to them for support.
    They cant Move away from the Immigration issue because they NEED it as a wedge iisue to scare whites that the minorities are coming for your jobs and want a free ride.

    In essence they have become a victim of their own political strategy.
    The idea that other demographics will adopt Conservative values will have a limited
    impact becasue they will not support all the extreme fringe ideals of the party.

    Most hispanic americans are catholic historically, but coming from situations of extereme poverty, you will never convince a large portion of them not to practice preventive measures, or abortions. If the Church couldnt stop them why would they listen to a political party?
    The ones who agree not to use contraceptions/abortions are going to want all the governmental support they can get.

    the platforms of the party do not mesh into a cohesive framework for building a future America, they focus on trying to get in a time machine back to the 1940s and 50s
    when this country was 80% white,christian and conservative.

    thats over and done with.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    Republicans have spent decades demonizing and marginalizing vast racial and gender sectors of the US population. They now really wish they hadn't done that, but it appealed to the angry, white male vote so well that they won a few elections that way. Republicans aren't angry because Democrats play the identity politics game; they're angry because both parties play the game and they're losing it.

    Btw, the Republican "philosophy" is what lost them this race, when a few candidates became a little too candid about what exactly that philosophy entails. Sharon Angle, Dick Mourdock and Todd Akin were not put up for office by some evil lefty trick. The GOP base did that, and I thank them for it. I hope the GOP continues to try to sell the same insanity for another few cycles, in fact. I hope they continue to misdiagnose the problem and misapply the "solution" of moving ever further right. Apparently it will take a few more losses for that strategy to be abandoned. So be it.

    *edit - it does look like some Republicans get it:

    "The demographics race we're losing badly," Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC) told the Washington Post. "We're not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term."
    Last edited by Labgrownmangoat; 11-09-2012 at 12:58 PM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    The Republicans absolutely play identity politics. Don't pretend that they don't do the exact same thing just on the opposite spectrum. Demonizing an entire segment of the population to scare your base into voting because the "other" people are coming for your stuff. This nonsense about makers and takers with the implication that all minorities want to just be takers and leech off the white working class citizens debunks your case entirely.
    Member of the Owlluminati!

  9. #9
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    Here is the take of one black GOP convention attendee:

    Raynard Jackson, a black GOP political consultant, wrote Tuesday on the RootDC Live blog that he is “embarrassed by the lack of diversity” at the convention and frustrated by his party’s empty promises.

    “The Republican line is that the overwhelming majority of blacks will vote for Obama because he is African American,” Jackson wrote. “I find this thinking extremely insulting as a black Republican. The reason the majority of blacks will vote for Obama is because Republicans have not given African Americans a reason to vote for Republicans or Romney.”

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by waveycrockett View Post
    They don't have to be a diet version of anything. Their economic/fiscal issues are what really separate them. They just are horrible at relaying their message to anyone who isn't running a business. Issues like immigration, Abortion, contraception, energry, creationism, war on academia are what paint them in such a bad light.
    I like that. They don't have a diet version of anything..

    This is somewhat true and I have a feeling the GOP will change its tune on some things to include a broader base.

    Bottom line once Obama care is put in place I can tell you that some people in the middle class (white, black, latino) will go over to the GOP due to their individual policies going up 50% in price.

    Again I have a brother who works with individual policies and this is what will be the hurdle for the Democrats to overcome after 2014. I still believe its the right thing to do but its going to piss a lot of people off IMO.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbroncos78087 View Post
    The Republicans absolutely play identity politics. Don't pretend that they don't do the exact same thing just on the opposite spectrum. Demonizing an entire segment of the population to scare your base into voting because the "other" people are coming for your stuff. This nonsense about makers and takers with the implication that all minorities want to just be takers and leech off the white working class citizens debunks your case entirely.
    Yeah I read gcoll's statement and forgot the whole "food stamp president" and english only, the anti affirmative action, war on Christmas. The republicans have successfully played identity politics for years, it's just the identity they have played to is now shrinking.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  12. #12
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    Points well taken on the "identity politics" stuff.

    Republicans do do that. My overall point would be that they shouldn't, and should attempt to sell the philosophy. They can't just switch from "the moocher class wants food stamps" to "let's give those poor unfortunate souls more food stamps."

    They gotta sell the ideas, and not worry about the demographics. Because you can't tailor the overall ideology to individual focus groups. It's one of the reasons I'm a right wing guy. I've always found the right wing ideas to be so much bigger than the left. The left will argue about student loan debt; the right will argue about the proper role of government. The right argues on principle, the left argues on particulars (this is coming from a right wing guy, so take it with a grain of salt.)

    But again; all of this talk really ignores how close the election was. It's tough to talk about "is the Republican party dead?" when they picked up seats in the House.

  13. #13
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    I don't think argument is that its dead but thats its dying slowly simply because the population is becoming browner or more diverse.

    The proof positive is the increase in a diverse republic and how they are voting. The election being close is funny argument to me. This was a very winnable election for the republicans even with Obama's poor performance in the first debate. One would expect this given the lack of progress in last 3 years in passing bills and the economic down turn during the entire presidency.

    Not to capitalize on all this shows you that the philosophy that your selling isn't working.

    Philosophy is expensive thing to sell. It either puts bread on the table or it doesn't. The idea of smaller government is good for the poor is a tough sell in this country.
    Last edited by Pacerlive; 11-09-2012 at 02:23 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    Points well taken on the "identity politics" stuff.

    Republicans do do that. My overall point would be that they shouldn't, and should attempt to sell the philosophy. They can't just switch from "the moocher class wants food stamps" to "let's give those poor unfortunate souls more food stamps."

    They gotta sell the ideas, and not worry about the demographics. Because you can't tailor the overall ideology to individual focus groups. It's one of the reasons I'm a right wing guy. I've always found the right wing ideas to be so much bigger than the left. The left will argue about student loan debt; the right will argue about the proper role of government. The right argues on principle, the left argues on particulars (this is coming from a right wing guy, so take it with a grain of salt.)

    But again; all of this talk really ignores how close the election was. It's tough to talk about "is the Republican party dead?" when they picked up seats in the House.
    You can't ignore the role redistricting played in that though. And according to my count they had 242 after 2010... and there are 233 GOP elected with 8 still outstanding. So at best they will lose one seat. Claiming the GOP is dead is clearly wrong, but if they rely upon their current policies and constituents they are slipping.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    You can't ignore the role redistricting played in that though. And according to my count they had 242 after 2010... and there are 233 GOP elected with 8 still outstanding. So at best they will lose one seat. Claiming the GOP is dead is clearly wrong, but if they rely upon their current policies and constituents they are slipping.
    hey, if I thought libertarianism could win the next election, nobody would be happier than me. I think libertarianism is still a few years off.

    It's sort of like gay marriage. It's going to happen, but being anti gay marriage is still really viable.

    I mean, you can't win an election unless you believe in God. That should be a sign that social conservatism is still alive and well.

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