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  1. #1
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    Will Repubs extend an Olive Branch to Minorities or Backlash even more??

    Listening to Hannity and Limbaugh it's interesting split in the far right. Seems like Hannity has "evolved" on immigration reform not sure about things like welfare, women's rights while Limbaugh seems to take the "Eff Them" stance. He almost sounds of on the verge of calling for a rich white man revolution. Where do you see them going? Hannity or Limbaugh's route?

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    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    They don't have to be a diet version of anything. Their economic/fiscal issues are what really separate them. They just are horrible at relaying their message to anyone who isn't running a business. Issues like immigration, Abortion, contraception, energry, creationism, war on academia are what paint them in such a bad light.
    Last edited by waveycrockett; 11-09-2012 at 10:45 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by waveycrockett View Post
    They don't have to be a diet version of anything. Their economic/fiscal issues are what really separate them. They just are horrible at relaying their message to anyone who isn't running a business. Issues like immigration, Abortion, contraception, energry, creationism, war on academia are what paint them in such a bad light.
    I like that. They don't have a diet version of anything..

    This is somewhat true and I have a feeling the GOP will change its tune on some things to include a broader base.

    Bottom line once Obama care is put in place I can tell you that some people in the middle class (white, black, latino) will go over to the GOP due to their individual policies going up 50% in price.

    Again I have a brother who works with individual policies and this is what will be the hurdle for the Democrats to overcome after 2014. I still believe its the right thing to do but its going to piss a lot of people off IMO.

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    As the minority population grows into a majority its inevitable that at least some will be more conservative than others. It might not be the same brand of conservative, but its not like there are no anti-abortion, pro-gun, etc. Mexicans in the south. Republicans have had Hispanic representation in Texas and elsewhere.

    They'll get support, but without an overall policy change its hard for them to be appealing to minorities. Gotta remember, "republican", right or wrong, is now synonymous with "conservative". In the history of our country, whether it was civil rights, women's right to vote, welfare, unions, etc. it's the conservative side that has opposed these movements, while the liberal or progressives fight for them.

    So now that "liberal" is synonymous with "democrat" (unfairly in my mind since most of these Dems in Congress are more moderate than liberal), they'll always get most of the minority votes and soon enough they'll be the majority. What's funny is that the republicans use of the word "liberals" or "those libs" as a disparaging term, is actually working against them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    I see your point and agree. However, with something like immigration the easiest thing they could do is reference Reagan granting amnesty, and possibly even admit that their stance had been wrong.

    There are ways they can adapt without compromising their entire platform/strategy.

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    Points well taken on the "identity politics" stuff.

    Republicans do do that. My overall point would be that they shouldn't, and should attempt to sell the philosophy. They can't just switch from "the moocher class wants food stamps" to "let's give those poor unfortunate souls more food stamps."

    They gotta sell the ideas, and not worry about the demographics. Because you can't tailor the overall ideology to individual focus groups. It's one of the reasons I'm a right wing guy. I've always found the right wing ideas to be so much bigger than the left. The left will argue about student loan debt; the right will argue about the proper role of government. The right argues on principle, the left argues on particulars (this is coming from a right wing guy, so take it with a grain of salt.)

    But again; all of this talk really ignores how close the election was. It's tough to talk about "is the Republican party dead?" when they picked up seats in the House.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    Points well taken on the "identity politics" stuff.

    Republicans do do that. My overall point would be that they shouldn't, and should attempt to sell the philosophy. They can't just switch from "the moocher class wants food stamps" to "let's give those poor unfortunate souls more food stamps."

    They gotta sell the ideas, and not worry about the demographics. Because you can't tailor the overall ideology to individual focus groups. It's one of the reasons I'm a right wing guy. I've always found the right wing ideas to be so much bigger than the left. The left will argue about student loan debt; the right will argue about the proper role of government. The right argues on principle, the left argues on particulars (this is coming from a right wing guy, so take it with a grain of salt.)

    But again; all of this talk really ignores how close the election was. It's tough to talk about "is the Republican party dead?" when they picked up seats in the House.
    You can't ignore the role redistricting played in that though. And according to my count they had 242 after 2010... and there are 233 GOP elected with 8 still outstanding. So at best they will lose one seat. Claiming the GOP is dead is clearly wrong, but if they rely upon their current policies and constituents they are slipping.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    You can't ignore the role redistricting played in that though. And according to my count they had 242 after 2010... and there are 233 GOP elected with 8 still outstanding. So at best they will lose one seat. Claiming the GOP is dead is clearly wrong, but if they rely upon their current policies and constituents they are slipping.
    hey, if I thought libertarianism could win the next election, nobody would be happier than me. I think libertarianism is still a few years off.

    It's sort of like gay marriage. It's going to happen, but being anti gay marriage is still really viable.

    I mean, you can't win an election unless you believe in God. That should be a sign that social conservatism is still alive and well.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    Points well taken on the "identity politics" stuff.

    Republicans do do that. My overall point would be that they shouldn't, and should attempt to sell the philosophy. They can't just switch from "the moocher class wants food stamps" to "let's give those poor unfortunate souls more food stamps."

    They gotta sell the ideas, and not worry about the demographics. Because you can't tailor the overall ideology to individual focus groups. It's one of the reasons I'm a right wing guy. I've always found the right wing ideas to be so much bigger than the left. The left will argue about student loan debt; the right will argue about the proper role of government. The right argues on principle, the left argues on particulars (this is coming from a right wing guy, so take it with a grain of salt.)

    But again; all of this talk really ignores how close the election was. It's tough to talk about "is the Republican party dead?" when they picked up seats in the House.
    Well shouldn't is much more of an idealistic way of phrasing it. In some areas both sides speak to all people and in some other areas they cater their message to a specific focus group audience.

    I think the Democrats pushes to expand food stamps is actually one of those areas that they push it to all people and not a specific audience. Otherwise, we wouldn't see a roughly equal proportion of the white population on food stamps as the white population is as a whole.

    But I think the way you phrased it the first time feeds into the false narrative that the GOP is looking out for everyone and the Democrats are the ones that want to divide and hurt the country. It comes from a false premise and equally false conclusion.
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    The GOP is completely out of touch and it's only going to get worse. I been watch many of there political analyst and most are saying that it's not there " policy's" that Hispanics have a problem with. It's just that they need someone to explain it to them better. So they are basicly saying hispanics dont "understand" and we need to dumb it down. If we talk real slow they will "understand" and they won't want immgration anymore. They are completely out of touch with minorites.


    FYI.....this years was the VERY first where their were more minorities births than whites. An these people vote 70, 80, 90 % dem.....So what does that say about the future of the GOP?
    Last edited by jayjay33; 11-09-2012 at 04:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post

    But again; all of this talk really ignores how close the election was. It's tough to talk about "is the Republican party dead?" when they picked up seats in the House.
    Hi gcoll

    Bloomberg News

    Republicans Keep House Majority While Losing Six Seats

    Republicans retained control of the House of Representatives, losing a half-dozen seats to Democrats even as President Barack Obama won a second term and Senate Democrats expanded their majority.
    Where did this meme come from that they gained seats?

    Following the once a decade gerrymandering that favored the GOP (because of the 2010 elections) the GOP lost seats, and the total could be as much as 8 following contests in CA and Florida getting settled, both of which have GOP incumbents.
    Here is the question of the day, does anyone think that wealthy people should pay a lower percentage of their income to taxes than middle class people? Don't argue tax brackets, just a simple question. Do you think someone earning 46 million dollars should pay a lower percentage of their income than say someone earning sixty thousand?

  13. #13
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    Right. House seats lost to Dems, More Senate seats lost to dems and the Dem won the presidency without even needing the 2 big swing states.


    Honestly their best chance is to continue to not work with the pres and frame the dem party by the next election for not doing anything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cabernetluver View Post
    Hi gcoll

    Bloomberg News



    Where did this meme come from that they gained seats?

    Following the once a decade gerrymandering that favored the GOP (because of the 2010 elections) the GOP lost seats, and the total could be as much as 8 following contests in CA and Florida getting settled, both of which have GOP incumbents.
    Hm. Not sure why I thought they picked up seats. Perhaps my brain conflated "picked up seats" and "retained the majority."

    Hi Cab.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by gcoll View Post
    The Republican philosophy CAN'T extend an olive branch.

    The Democrats play the identity politics game. It is their thing. The Republicans can't win by being a diet version of Democrats on racial pandering.

    The Republicans have to sell a philosophy.
    Republicans have spent decades demonizing and marginalizing vast racial and gender sectors of the US population. They now really wish they hadn't done that, but it appealed to the angry, white male vote so well that they won a few elections that way. Republicans aren't angry because Democrats play the identity politics game; they're angry because both parties play the game and they're losing it.

    Btw, the Republican "philosophy" is what lost them this race, when a few candidates became a little too candid about what exactly that philosophy entails. Sharon Angle, Dick Mourdock and Todd Akin were not put up for office by some evil lefty trick. The GOP base did that, and I thank them for it. I hope the GOP continues to try to sell the same insanity for another few cycles, in fact. I hope they continue to misdiagnose the problem and misapply the "solution" of moving ever further right. Apparently it will take a few more losses for that strategy to be abandoned. So be it.

    *edit - it does look like some Republicans get it:

    "The demographics race we're losing badly," Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC) told the Washington Post. "We're not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term."
    Last edited by Labgrownmangoat; 11-09-2012 at 11:58 AM.

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