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View Poll Results: What route should we take if we replace Christian Ponder at QB?

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58. You may not vote on this poll
  • Who said anything about replacing Christian Ponder?

    16 27.59%
  • Draft the best QB available in the 2013 draft even if we need to trade up to #1 to get him.

    9 15.52%
  • Draft a 1st round QB but don't trade up.

    3 5.17%
  • Draft a QB somewhere after the 1st round.

    8 13.79%
  • Trade for a QB.

    9 15.52%
  • Sign someone in free agency.

    10 17.24%
  • Joe Webb can start because he's better anyways.

    3 5.17%
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Results 211 to 225 of 260
  1. #211
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    I would give Ponder one more season, or at least bring in some competition. Get him some help at WR, new interior line, and new OC. If we can't make it work. Move on from Ponder.

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by 100%CHEESE FREE View Post
    You admit our WRs are bad but you then say its not valid to exclude Harvin to talk about our other starters. Harvin rarely lines up on the outside and is also rarely used for anything down the field. Just recently the cumulative yardage of all the other WRs put together surpassed Harvin's yardage. That's right Harvin (who hasn't played in the last two games) had more yards than every other WR combined up until last week and was responsible for 30% of our total offense, but our other WRs underperformance has nothing to do with this. Ponder just threw to Percy all the time because he liked him better, not because he was not just the only play maker among them but the only one who could RELIABLY CATCH THE F*&%ING FOOTBALL! Our WR situation is a lot worse than bad.

    -You go on and compare our 2nd year QB who is still trying to learn and develop to Tom Brady, the best guy to play the position since Joe Montana. That's fair, by this point in his career Ponder should be able to do all of the same things that Tom Brady can.

    -What you're saying about Curtis Painter makes no sense at all, unless you're claiming that our WRs are better than Pierre Garcon and Reggie Wayne, in which case I award you no points and may god have mercy on your soul.

    -As for the Carolina Panthers, Newton has Brandon LaFell and Louis Murphy, both are guys who would be an upgrade on this roster. Smith, LaFell, Murphy > Harvin, Jenkins and Simpson (not to mention that Steve Smith is more of a down-field presence than Percy)

    -Please don't presume to tell me what I think about Colt McCoy. There's reports now that the franchise isn't happy with Brandon Weeden either so its quite possible that the Browns could have been better off sticking with McCoy. This is one of the reason I want to see the Vikings stick to their guns and stay behind Ponder, at least they have the balls to see it through.

    -Gabbert didn't play well with WRs better than ours so Ponder won't either, so that's why we should go out and get a QB who can make our WRs great, Got it.

    -Last but not least, T-Jack. First I want to say that I did not want to see Ponder on the field in 2011 after he didn't win the starting job. The offense was just too much of a mess for me to be confident about what Ponder could learn and accomplish. It turns out he did better than a lot of us though, however it was a far from opportune setting for him to start playing. T-Jack had hardships too but lets not forget that he'd spent the past 5 years in pretty much the exact same system, which followed him to Seattle in the form of OC Darrel Bevell. He didn't have no weapons either, he had a gimpy Rice for the first 9 games, which is still an upgrade on Michael Jenkins.

    What really gets to me after being on here for so long is the bias that people have had against Ponder from day 1. What I want to see is what will happen next year if we have Ponder lined up to throw to a Z WR who isn't slow as **** (molases mike) or an X that can consistently catch the ball, and not just let it hit him in the numbers and bounce off his hands all stupid like(jerome simpson). Devin Aromashadon't is far from perfect himself but at this point he really should be seeing more play-time just because he's faster than Jenkins. Last but not lest we can't forget Stephen Burton, and his phobia of football shaped objects.

    I think under these improved conditions Christian Ponder will be able to play BETTER football than he has been lately. I know this is a remarkably bold assumption to make on my part but I will make it nonetheless. The cherry on top is that you want new WRs for Palmer too.

    Lastly I will leave you with this. I've also never said that Ponder NEEDS STUD WRs to make him look good. There is a very wide gulf between who we're putting out there on the field now and a Stud WR. We need to get better WRs if we expect our passing game to get better because what we're fielding now is substandard.
    I don't know where to start. First off I realized I made a mistake with Painter, my memory told me collie, garcon and Wayne missed that season. I should have done my homework

    Let me clarify my opinion of this offense. We have 2 elite playmakers, Harvin and Peterson. And 1 TE who you can throw open. Outside of that we have 0 playmakers. Yes our WR's are bad outside Harvin, but to me Harvin and Rudolph bring 2 weapons with Peterson to make the playmaking talent way above average. I've seen QB's been deemed bust's with much less talent around them, McCoy, Gabbert, Henne, Weeden, Sanchez. And it's like your saying I can't call Ponder a bust because outside Harvin, there is no other WR to get the ball to....So you cast aside our best WR, don't take the above average TE's into consideration, and don't include the best running game in football. Your just not looking at the whole picture. Under these conditions we've seen A. Smith flourish.

    Do I want 3 different WR's on the roster next year, yes. But to say that Ponder can't be evaluated this year based on the talent outside our 3 best guys to me is ridiculous.

    You say Harvin isn't a deep threat, but I strongly disagree. We saw this preseason Harvin beating guys deep down the field. We are not calling deep throws this year because Ponder can't throw them. Musgrave is wisely just trying to move the chains, which is what Ponder is best at. That's not to say he is good at it, but that is the thing he does best. Last year Musgrave didn't seam to know what he had in Harvin, and I don't think Bevell had any idea on how to use a guy like Harvin correctly. I think Harvin can do the same things vertically as a guy like M. Wallace.

    If we had Carson Palmer this year do I think he'd be doing as good as he is in Oakland....No, he'd be doing better...This year the Raiders are the opposite the Vikings. They have a terrible O line, have had almost no running game outside of M. Reece, but have 3 talented WR's. If Palmer were on this team this year, he'd have a higher QB rating but a lot less pass yds, Int's, TD's and attempts....

    I assumed you don't believe in McCoy much like you assumed the only thing I knew about Palmer was his stat line. It's fair to say nobody likes having assumptions made for them. But you didn't exactly say what you thought of McCoy...

    This last paragraph is exactly my point. Ponder shouldn't need stud WR's to succeed this year. He has the best running game in football, 1 stud WR, and a good TE. To me that should be enough for a NFL QB to succeed. To me we need to replace Simpson, Jenkins, and 19, yes, we agree. But the fact is almost every single good moment Ponder has had has come on a throw less then 10 yards past the line of scrimmage. I don't think even Larry Fitzgerald could change that.

  3. #213
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    It would be GREAT not to read a single thread/reply of someone further defending Ponder, if only for a day or week.
    There is NO defense for the poor on field decisions & play.
    Did he make a couple plays to day, sure he did, not nearly enough to win a game without HUGE help from AP and the D

  4. #214
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    Alternatives to Ponder at QB

    Wonder if that kid from the cam newton play 60 commercial is available? If so we should give him a call

    props to VCU for the sig!

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by jojo30 View Post
    Wonder if that kid from the cam newton play 60 commercial is available? If so we should give him a call
    Hes my moms favorite player....

  6. #216
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    As bad as Ponder looks what the F is up with our pass blocking scheme. He got hit in the back on a play action?.... Every time he tried to step up charlie johnson flew back into him or he got crushed. our interior Pass blocking has serious issues. Almost to the point it's amazing to think they can run block.
    Minnesota Vikings

  7. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by VCU4LIFEGOVIKS View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jojo30 View Post
    Wonder if that kid from the cam newton play 60 commercial is available? If so we should give him a call
    Hes my moms favorite player....
    That commercial is great

    props to VCU for the sig!

  8. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by jojo30 View Post
    That commercial is great
    It definitely is. I laugh every time I see it.

  9. #219
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    Mike Vick will be our starter next year


    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  10. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by boms-4 View Post
    I would give Ponder one more season, or at least bring in some competition. Get him some help at WR, new interior line, and new OC. If we can't make it work. Move on from Ponder.

    Why new interior line? I happen to think we have a very talented Oline and is def one of our bright spots on the team. What we need is a big Wr that can get some damn separation.. Oh and a new qb..

  11. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by blom85 View Post
    Mike Vick will be our starter next year
    I'm honestly kind of hoping this happens.

  12. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by ApolloInfinity View Post
    I don't know where to start. First off I realized I made a mistake with Painter, my memory told me collie, garcon and Wayne missed that season. I should have done my homework

    Let me clarify my opinion of this offense. We have 2 elite playmakers, Harvin and Peterson. And 1 TE who you can throw open. Outside of that we have 0 playmakers. Yes our WR's are bad outside Harvin, but to me Harvin and Rudolph bring 2 weapons with Peterson to make the playmaking talent way above average. I've seen QB's been deemed bust's with much less talent around them, McCoy, Gabbert, Henne, Weeden, Sanchez. And it's like your saying I can't call Ponder a bust because outside Harvin, there is no other WR to get the ball to....So you cast aside our best WR, don't take the above average TE's into consideration, and don't include the best running game in football. Your just not looking at the whole picture. Under these conditions we've seen A. Smith flourish.

    Do I want 3 different WR's on the roster next year, yes. But to say that Ponder can't be evaluated this year based on the talent outside our 3 best guys to me is ridiculous.

    You say Harvin isn't a deep threat, but I strongly disagree. We saw this preseason Harvin beating guys deep down the field. We are not calling deep throws this year because Ponder can't throw them. Musgrave is wisely just trying to move the chains, which is what Ponder is best at. That's not to say he is good at it, but that is the thing he does best. Last year Musgrave didn't seam to know what he had in Harvin, and I don't think Bevell had any idea on how to use a guy like Harvin correctly. I think Harvin can do the same things vertically as a guy like M. Wallace.

    If we had Carson Palmer this year do I think he'd be doing as good as he is in Oakland....No, he'd be doing better...This year the Raiders are the opposite the Vikings. They have a terrible O line, have had almost no running game outside of M. Reece, but have 3 talented WR's. If Palmer were on this team this year, he'd have a higher QB rating but a lot less pass yds, Int's, TD's and attempts....

    I assumed you don't believe in McCoy much like you assumed the only thing I knew about Palmer was his stat line. It's fair to say nobody likes having assumptions made for them. But you didn't exactly say what you thought of McCoy...

    This last paragraph is exactly my point. Ponder shouldn't need stud WR's to succeed this year. He has the best running game in football, 1 stud WR, and a good TE. To me that should be enough for a NFL QB to succeed. To me we need to replace Simpson, Jenkins, and 19, yes, we agree. But the fact is almost every single good moment Ponder has had has come on a throw less then 10 yards past the line of scrimmage. I don't think even Larry Fitzgerald could change that.
    The point of all this is that Ponder has most of his problems getting the ball to the three players you just named. Three players that are not good at the position which they play and have glaring flaws. Its very likely Ponder (or any other QB) would have an easier time getting the ball to WRs who were not (or at the very least not AS) flawed as the ones we have. This is also where most of his would-be yards are at.

    It really doesn't matter weather you think Percy Harvin is a deep threat or not, if our OC doesn't use him that way it makes no difference. I don't think that Michael Jenkins is a deep threat, but judging by the way that he's used and the routes that he often runs, I think that Musgrave would disagree (which makes me think even less of Musgrave who has been around Jenkins for almost his entire professional career, HE SHOULD KNOW BY NOW THE GUY IS SLOW). If you haven't noticed, stopping our short pass game dovetails very nicely with stopping AP by stacking the box, you have a lot of guys in the area anyways and we can make absolutely dick all happen deep on the outside with Simpson, Jenkins and Aromashodu.

    Our "wise" OC has done a very good job this year of demonstrating why he should no longer be on the pay-roll (never run Adrian Peterson inside the 20 yard line, lets run on 3rd and 22, and then do it again on 3rd and 18, need I go on).

    The point of all this is, despite the problems that Ponder is having, if these guys made an acceptable amount of plays, we might not be having this conversation. A LEAGUE AVERAGE WR corp is not a lot to ask for.

    Also, no, Carson Palmer would not be having a better year here than he is having in Oakland, PERIOD. If he was here, he would be dealing with a lot of the same issues that Ponder has to on every snap. The problems with our interior line would actually be worse for Palmer, sure he's better at stepping up in the pocket but is much less mobile, a lot is made of Ponder having happy feet, on quite a few occasions there is no pocket there for him since one of our guards slipped up. VCU already said it earlier, WRs aren't just going to catch balls, run correct routes and not be slow (totally directed at you Michael Jenkins) just because Palmer is playing for us. Don't forget, Palmer could commit a turnover and put us in a hole early just as easy as he does it for the Raiders.

    Would Palmer be playing better than Christian Ponder, sure he would since he is right now in Oakland, but that does not mean that we wouldn't have a dysfunctional passing game just because Ponder's not the one taking the snaps.

    Another thing that really has to be looked at here, is that when you look back at this team over the past two years, it really is a pretty s&^%ty place to learn how to be a QB in the NFL.

    Vikings Roster thread
    http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/sho...d.php?t=718220

    WE TRUST V4LB!!! HE IS THE GREATEST GUY IN OUR FOURM.
    WITHOUT HIM OUR FOURM WOULDNT BE EXCITING.
    HE GETS ALL THE WOMEN!!!!
    HE IS NEVER WRONG!!!
    WE TRIED TO VOTE FOR HIM FOR PRESIDENT BUT HE IS SO GREAT THAT HE WOULDNT RUN FOR OFFICE

  13. #223
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    You can make whatever excuse you want to - none of us know what goes on at Winter Park or what Ponder is being coached to do. All I know is that his arm is okay, not elite, and he was supposed to be a quick study that can make the necessary throws. You would hope that he would be ahead of schedule this time of year and PROgressing not REgressing. Sadly this is not the case.

    No doubt Harvin being out is hurting Ponder. He's had his worst stretch of the year without him. And sure, the cupboard is bare in regards to other options. But he's had stinker games even with Harvin performing. I was at the Zona game and even with a healthy Harvin he was brutal! QB rating 35.5

    The interior offensive line in pass protection has also been shotty at times but the OL as a whole from last year is much improved. I can't blame them for Ponder's performance.

    And you can claim Musgrave isn't the greatest coach even though he groomed Matt Ryan. But even so, Musgrave is not to blame for many of the poor on field decisions Ponder makes or the bad throws.

    If we are truly a rebuilding team, then we wait out Ponder and hope he gets it. But personally I think this team is too good to wait unless we literally find nothing else. I pray we don't put Ponder's development ahead of the rest of the team's talent. A proven QB changes everything so we need to be all in again. If we come up short, Ponder is my guy granted he beats out someone we can bring in (like Matt Moore) for the starting job.

  14. #224
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    One thing I want to point out. The deep ball to the end zone for Armashodu was a perfectly placed ball. Only a Vikings wide receiver would let the ball bounce off of his shoulder pad. That play to me further backed up the notion that the Vikings desperately need play makers at the receiver position more than we need to give up on Ponder right now.


    I cant wait to stand on the podium with Zygi and Mark and Jonathan, and were standing on the podium, and we look up and the confetti is falling down on top of us, and were all hand in hand, and Commissioner Goodell comes over and hands the Super Bowl trophy to Mr. Wilf and tells him hes world champion, that is my goal and that is my drive.
    - Mike Zimmer

  15. #225
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingsfan0845 View Post
    One thing I want to point out. The deep ball to the end zone for Armashodu was a perfectly placed ball. Only a Vikings wide receiver would let the ball bounce off of his shoulder pad. That play to me further backed up the notion that the Vikings desperately need play makers at the receiver position more than we need to give up on Ponder right now.
    I think that is probably the best way to put the situation.

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