Wow. This is an excellent example of how we, as educated persons who believe in science, end up shooting ourselves in the foot in this argument by looking like complete *******s. And forcing retrenched positions. Can we talk about that?
Dear lord I wish I had the time to do a PSD lecture series. It could be a big teleconference. I will call it "How all us educated *******s actually help ignorant people believe what they do."
(at times this is especially true for you Nate... I remember arguing with you about the subject that shall not be named just because someone needed to for a different angle. though this set of threads is an excellent example of your trying to understand and discuss in a way that doesn't just make you sound like a tool...it makes you sound open for change and eager for viewpoints. In order to actually change minds that's exactly what you have to do. Come to hard and you just entrench views. I don't do this often but an emoticon for you:

)