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  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by BChydro86 View Post
    Should. Key word. He doesnt
    Based on what? One season game? Did we watch the same playoffs last year? That being said, he did look passive Wednesday night. But again its one game. I saw enough last season that tells me he does have a mentality to get to the paint when things are flowing

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Answerback03 View Post
    Based on what? One season game? Did we watch the same playoffs last year? That being said, he did look passive Wednesday night. But again its one game. I saw enough last season that tells me he does have a mentality to get to the paint when things are flowing
    Averaging 2.1 FGA/G isn't enough. That's what he did last season when the league average for swingmen was 1.9 per. For starters however the league average goes up to over 2.5. Hydro had me in saying that Evan should and he doesn't.

  3. #123
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    Jrue Holiday signed 4 year 41 million dollar contract ext.

    I think he has the skills too, i just saw him give away the ball for no reason waaaay too many times in game 1


    gotta pay the troll toll

  4. #124
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    For you guys using the stat-based arguments that Jrue hasn't shown he can do anything better than Lawson and Curry other than defend, please check his crunch time stats from last season, and what he did through two rounds of the playoffs last season. Then look at game 1 last night where in crunch time Jrue was our primary playmaker. He has the ability (and has shown it now repeatedly) to raise his game to a higher level on both ends of the floor than Curry or Lawson when it matters most. And he can usually defend two positions in the playoffs, where Curry and Lawson will both struggle defending one. When a 7 game series is so much about matchups, this fact cannot be just glossed over.

    Jrue had a late game turnover issue that he didn't fix until during last season. And he also had to watch the Lou/Iggy horror show in crunchtime for two seasons because the head coach was consistently a lunatic with less than 8 minutes left in the game. If it wasn't for these truths, the fact that Jrue is a more valuable crunch time player than Curry or Lawson would be more obvious to the masses by now.

    The Sixers and this forum have both consistently overrated and overpaid into mediocrity it's home grown talent. This time, the Sixers have finally got it right, and this forum is actually undervaluing it's young talent. The contract is a huge win for the organization and us as fans compared to what we've had to deal with in the past.
    Last edited by wannabGM; 11-03-2012 at 01:00 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by RickyPrior View Post
    When you go out of the way just to hate...no one takes you seriously.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by wannabGM View Post
    For you guys using the stat-based arguments that Jrue hasn't shown he can do anything better than Lawson and Curry other than defend, please check his crunch time stats from last season, and what he did through two rounds of the playoffs last season. Then look at game 1 last night where in crunch time Jrue was our primary playmaker. He has the ability (and has shown it now repeatedly) to raise his game to a higher level on both ends of the floor than Curry or Lawson when it matters most. And he can usually defend two positions in the playoffs, where Curry and Lawson will both struggle defending one. When a 7 game series is so much about matchups, this fact cannot be just glossed over.

    Jrue had a late game turnover issue that he didn't fix until during last season. And he also had to watch the Lou/Iggy horror show in crunchtime for two seasons because the head coach was consistently a lunatic with less than 8 minutes left in the game. If it wasn't for these truths, the fact that Jrue is a more valuable crunch time player than Curry or Lawson would be more obvious to the masses by now.

    The Sixers and this forum have both consistently overrated and overpaid into mediocrity it's home grown talent. This time, the Sixers have finally got it right, and this forum is actually undervaluing it's young talent. The contract is a huge win for the organization and us as fans compared to what we've had to deal with in the past.


    This man watches basketball. He doesn't read it.
    Pay attention. You might learn something.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by wannabGM View Post
    For you guys using the stat-based arguments that Jrue hasn't shown he can do anything better than Lawson and Curry other than defend, please check his crunch time stats from last season, and what he did through two rounds of the playoffs last season. Then look at game 1 last night where in crunch time Jrue was our primary playmaker. He has the ability (and has shown it now repeatedly) to raise his game to a higher level on both ends of the floor than Curry or Lawson when it matters most. And he can usually defend two positions in the playoffs, where Curry and Lawson will both struggle defending one. When a 7 game series is so much about matchups, this fact cannot be just glossed over.

    Jrue had a late game turnover issue that he didn't fix until during last season. And he also had to watch the Lou/Iggy horror show in crunchtime for two seasons because the head coach was consistently a lunatic with less than 8 minutes left in the game. If it wasn't for these truths, the fact that Jrue is a more valuable crunch time player than Curry or Lawson would be more obvious to the masses by now.

    The Sixers and this forum have both consistently overrated and overpaid into mediocrity it's home grown talent. This time, the Sixers have finally got it right, and this forum is actually undervaluing it's young talent. The contract is a huge win for the organization and us as fans compared to what we've had to deal with in the past.
    Thank you

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by wannabGM View Post
    For you guys using the stat-based arguments that Jrue hasn't shown he can do anything better than Lawson and Curry other than defend, please check his crunch time stats from last season, and what he did through two rounds of the playoffs last season. Then look at game 1 last night where in crunch time Jrue was our primary playmaker. He has the ability (and has shown it now repeatedly) to raise his game to a higher level on both ends of the floor than Curry or Lawson when it matters most. And he can usually defend two positions in the playoffs, where Curry and Lawson will both struggle defending one. When a 7 game series is so much about matchups, this fact cannot be just glossed over.

    Jrue had a late game turnover issue that he didn't fix until during last season. And he also had to watch the Lou/Iggy horror show in crunchtime for two seasons because the head coach was consistently a lunatic with less than 8 minutes left in the game. If it wasn't for these truths, the fact that Jrue is a more valuable crunch time player than Curry or Lawson would be more obvious to the masses by now.

    The Sixers and this forum have both consistently overrated and overpaid into mediocrity it's home grown talent. This time, the Sixers have finally got it right, and this forum is actually undervaluing it's young talent. The contract is a huge win for the organization and us as fans compared to what we've had to deal with in the past.
    BAWSE

  8. #128
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    Im kind of smack dab in the middle of this Jrue argument some of you are overrating him like hes the 2nd coming and others are not giving him quite enough credit
    I personally take Jrue over lawson
    But i take Curry (when healthy) over both
    also Curry is really more of a 2

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by wannabGM View Post
    For you guys using the stat-based arguments that Jrue hasn't shown he can do anything better than Lawson and Curry other than defend, please check his crunch time stats from last season,
    The only player he can accurately be compared to in the clutch last season is against Lawson well since Lawson actually played enough games to make a statistical argument.

    Jrue was indeed better than Lawson in the clutch last season but how substantial was the difference. Was it a noticeable difference where one can use it as a reason to state that Jrue was better. No it wasn't. If it is I'd like to hear your argument.

    and what he did through two rounds of the playoffs last season.
    What do you mean get completely outplayed in every single regard by Lawson? Nah doesn't cut it. Sure Jrue was solid in the post season and yeah he upped his game compared to the regular season but even so he still wasn't on par with Lawson. The same Lawson who was almost singe handidly responsible for pushing the Nuggets over the Lakers.

    You can slice it anyway you want Lawson was better than Jrue last post season.

    Then look at game 1 last night where in crunch time Jrue was our primary playmaker. He has the ability (and has shown it now repeatedly) to raise his game to a higher level on both ends of the floor than Curry or Lawson when it matters most.
    Wait he can raise his game when it matters more more so than they can? Hold up. Lawson was hands down the Nuggets best player last post season and put down some of the most impressive #s of any PG in the post season and Jrue is better. Doesn't that statement sound biased to you?

    You want to hear about playing at a high level?

    In Stephen Curry's career he has had 47 games with a game score of 20 ore more. That's 47 out of 182 which basically leaves you with 25.8% of his games being what we would consider high quality games at least according to the box score.

    In Ty Lawson's career 27 such games. 27 out of 208 which is good for 12.9% of his games.

    Jrue has had 18 such games in his career. 18 of his 221 which is good for just 8.1%.

    But yeah those other players aren't capable of playing at the same level as Jrue.

    And he can usually defend two positions in the playoffs, where Curry and Lawson will both struggle defending one. When a 7 game series is so much about matchups, this fact cannot be just glossed over.
    I already said on numerous occasions that Jrue has the potential to be the best defensive PG in the entire NBA and not only that but at the age of 21 he was already in the top 5.

    Jrue had a late game turnover issue that he didn't fix until during last season. And he also had to watch the Lou/Iggy horror show in crunchtime for two seasons because the head coach was consistently a lunatic with less than 8 minutes left in the game. If it wasn't for these truths, the fact that Jrue is a more valuable crunch time player than Curry or Lawson would be more obvious to the masses by now.
    That is in your opinion as a 76ers fans. When Curry was healthy he was 5th in the league among PG in crunch time scoring being Billups, Rose, Nash and Paul. Jrue, well lets say he didn't crack the top 20. Who is to say that once Curry is on the floor that he isn't going to do the very same?

    The Sixers and this forum have both consistently overrated and overpaid into mediocrity it's home grown talent. This time, the Sixers have finally got it right, and this forum is actually undervaluing it's young talent. The contract is a huge win for the organization and us as fans compared to what we've had to deal with in the past.
    Right now as it relates to Jrue I say basically everyone outside of guys like SixerLover, Sixer04fan, Bholly and a handful of others who know how to accurately assess Jrue. There really hasn't been much of a change.

    As it stands from what I can tell a lot of posters are content with mediocrity and aren't willing to be open, fair and critical of a player like Jrue.

    I love Jrue more than the other dude and THAT is why I can be fair and critical of his game. All I see from other posters is plain homerism.

  10. #130
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    Hahaha. That was funny. The way you pulled up the scoring numbers and all. And just dismissed points with no support. Didn't the Sixers have 6 guys averaging over 10 points? And Evan just under? There are other clutch numbers that matter other than fgs.

    I'm on another level though. So...
    Pay attention. You might learn something.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by wannabGM View Post
    For you guys using the stat-based arguments that Jrue hasn't shown he can do anything better than Lawson and Curry other than defend, please check his crunch time stats from last season, and what he did through two rounds of the playoffs last season. Then look at game 1 last night where in crunch time Jrue was our primary playmaker. He has the ability (and has shown it now repeatedly) to raise his game to a higher level on both ends of the floor than Curry or Lawson when it matters most. And he can usually defend two positions in the playoffs, where Curry and Lawson will both struggle defending one. When a 7 game series is so much about matchups, this fact cannot be just glossed over.

    Jrue had a late game turnover issue that he didn't fix until during last season. And he also had to watch the Lou/Iggy horror show in crunchtime for two seasons because the head coach was consistently a lunatic with less than 8 minutes left in the game. If it wasn't for these truths, the fact that Jrue is a more valuable crunch time player than Curry or Lawson would be more obvious to the masses by now.

    The Sixers and this forum have both consistently overrated and overpaid into mediocrity it's home grown talent. This time, the Sixers have finally got it right, and this forum is actually undervaluing it's young talent. The contract is a huge win for the organization and us as fans compared to what we've had to deal with in the past.
    So we shouldn't use stats, but we should check the crunch time stats? Could you post these "crunch time" stats you speak of.

    Also didn't you say ET was clutch too? What is your definition of clutch?

    I don't think many were arguing against paying Jrue. People just want to be judicious when you are working with a salary cap. The deal was pretty fair, but most saw that we had all the leverage in the world, and were in no hurry to give that up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Hinkie
    "I'm probably pretty boring to watch a game with because I''m all about expected values. I don''t even care if it goes in or not, I'm all about, '‘Should it go in?'' I can live with randomness. I mean, if it''s a close game in the end, yeah, I''m just like anyone else. But I just want us to play the odds all the time."
    TerminH1NK13


  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by MylesKong View Post
    Hahaha. That was funny. The way you pulled up the scoring numbers and all. And just dismissed points with no support. Didn't the Sixers have 6 guys averaging over 10 points? And Evan just under? There are other clutch numbers that matter other than fgs.

    I'm on another level though. So...
    I truly pity you.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by MylesKong View Post
    Hahaha. That was funny. The way you pulled up the scoring numbers and all. And just dismissed points with no support. Didn't the Sixers have 6 guys averaging over 10 points? And Evan just under? There are other clutch numbers that matter other than fgs.

    I'm on another level though. So...
    Name one. Because I hope you don't want to refer to Jrue's turnovers in clutch situations or his A / TO ratio in those same situations.

    For the millionth time, Jrue is good, this contract is fair. But lets not make him out to be more than he is at this point. He's been the starter for 2 seasons now, we have a pretty accurate assessment of who he is to this point. If he continues to develop, wonderful all of us as Sixers fans will be very excited.

    But as of right now I wouldn't take him over Lawson, and the only reason I'd take him over Curry is because Steph's ankle is made out of glass. It's not a diss to Jrue, he's my favorite Sixer, but I hate when people overrate expectations of players, then years later criticize a guy because he didn't reach those inflated expectations. It happens a lot in Philly sports.

  14. #134
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    Jrue Holiday signed 4 year 41 million dollar contract ext.

    Jrue, defensively and based on size, ill take over lawson.

    The offensive give and take isnt enough, in my opinion, to warrant me taking lawson over holiday.

    I believe that if u cloned a sg with off the ball skills (say ray allen, reggie miller, rip hamilton, or really any good scoring 2guard) and gave this player to both lawson and holiday.... Holiday becomes the more productive player.


    gotta pay the troll toll

  15. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sixerlover View Post
    Name one. Because I hope you don't want to refer to Jrue's turnovers in clutch situations or his A / TO ratio in those same situations.

    For the millionth time, Jrue is good, this contract is fair. But lets not make him out to be more than he is at this point. He's been the starter for 2 seasons now, we have a pretty accurate assessment of who he is to this point. If he continues to develop, wonderful all of us as Sixers fans will be very excited.

    But as of right now I wouldn't take him over Lawson, and the only reason I'd take him over Curry is because Steph's ankle is made out of glass. It's not a diss to Jrue, he's my favorite Sixer, but I hate when people overrate expectations of players, then years later criticize a guy because he didn't reach those inflated expectations. It happens a lot in Philly sports.
    I'd take him over Lawson right now. I know several other better basketball people than myself that would too. He's big, strong, and can defend and shoot. Lawson is a more mature basketball player. He was the better player at the time of the draft. Jrues upside is way higher and he produces pretty well in the meantime. Lawson and curry have better jump shots and are more experienced because they are older.

    I would have drafted curry over jrue. But he is a disinterested defender and has bad wheels. And he's physically weaker. So no thanks.
    Pay attention. You might learn something.

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