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  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    The Cubs are actually rebuilding, the Mets are not, and the Cubs will have money to spend, as will the Red Sox who are also CLEARLY rebuilding, the comparisons do not work.
    I disagree, the Mets are in rebuild mode. And it is foolish to think otherwise.


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    Well, their argument is that after the Mets trim the fat, they'll resume spending again. They think if the Mets lose cheaply today, they'll win more expensively "tomorrow."

    And after making that argument myself, I now have come to the conclusion that there is no reason to believe "tomorrow" will ever come.
    That is not their argument.

    Try again.


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by clayamtion View Post
    I disagree, the Mets are in rebuild mode. And it is foolish to think otherwise.

    It's foolish to mistake slashing payroll every year for rebuilding, but you're entitled to your opinion.

  4. #154
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    Mets are in cheap mode once again, the high spending did not work out for them, so now like a scared turtle they hid their heads.

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by clayamtion View Post
    That is not their argument.

    Try again.
    Why don't you make it for me then?
    "Mr. Martin Tanner, Baritone, of Dayton, Ohio made his Town Hall debut last night. He came well prepared, but unfortunately his presentation was not up to contemporary professional standards. His voice lacks the range of tonal color necessary to make it consistently interesting. Full time consideration of another endeavor might be in order."

  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sick Of It All View Post
    Mets are in cheap mode once again, the high spending did not work out for them, so now like a scared turtle they hid their heads.
    i don't think they'll ever have the ability to spend like they once did without having Madoff as a resource.
    "Mr. Martin Tanner, Baritone, of Dayton, Ohio made his Town Hall debut last night. He came well prepared, but unfortunately his presentation was not up to contemporary professional standards. His voice lacks the range of tonal color necessary to make it consistently interesting. Full time consideration of another endeavor might be in order."

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    i don't think they'll ever have the ability to spend like they once did without having Madoff as a resource.

    Not with the debts they have to service and poor attendance, their model was 'lower capacity but more expensive tix' - they need to sell out, and they have no hope of doing that without a consistent winner, and they have next to no chance of getting that without spending serious $$$$.

    The Coupons totally screwed the pooch with ****** field.

    What a surprise...

  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    Not with the debts they have to service and poor attendance, their model was 'lower capacity but more expensive tix' - they need to sell out, and they have no hope of doing that without a consistent winner, and they have next to no chance of getting that without spending serious $$$$.

    The Coupons totally screwed the pooch with ****** field.

    What a surprise...
    i really think its less about the debts than it is the loss of a huge revenue stream
    "Mr. Martin Tanner, Baritone, of Dayton, Ohio made his Town Hall debut last night. He came well prepared, but unfortunately his presentation was not up to contemporary professional standards. His voice lacks the range of tonal color necessary to make it consistently interesting. Full time consideration of another endeavor might be in order."

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    i really think its less about the debts than it is the loss of a huge revenue stream
    You might be right, but we can only speculate on how much money was siphoned off from Madoff accounts into the team each year, we know what the debts are, and they're pretty huge. Well over 1BN in total.

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    You might be right, but we can only speculate on how much money was siphoned off from Madoff accounts into the team each year, we know what the debts are, and they're pretty huge. Well over 1BN in total.
    It;s not a matter of how much they siphoned off. They were investing a ton of money with him to get consistent returns of 18 percent, an unheard of rate without any losses.

    These returns are what made them think they were coming out ahead on the Bobby Bonilla deferral even though they were paying him 20 million instead of 4 or 5 (or whatever he was owed).

    No doubt those fictitious returns made them more aggressive and competitive in buying players than they otherwise would have been.
    "Mr. Martin Tanner, Baritone, of Dayton, Ohio made his Town Hall debut last night. He came well prepared, but unfortunately his presentation was not up to contemporary professional standards. His voice lacks the range of tonal color necessary to make it consistently interesting. Full time consideration of another endeavor might be in order."

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by clayamtion View Post
    I disagree, the Mets are in rebuild mode. And it is foolish to think otherwise.
    They are too big of cowards to actually come out and admit they are rebuilding because of the negative feedback they might get from season ticket holders. They feel if they sprinkle in a few hasbeen free agents to the mix that it will give the illusion to the fans that they are still in a win now mode which couldn't be further from the truth.

  12. #162
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    I just love watching Pagan contribute to a real franchise on the verge of winning their second championship in three years. To see Pagan point up to the heavens as the last out is made and run to the pitchers mound to celebrate with the rest of his teammates will bring a smile to my face because that means these lame brains who traded him away because he had cramps or a negative attitude or whatever bullcrap they told everyone will just have to eat crow because their opinion of Pagan was obviously wrong because he was a key component in the Giants winning it all in 2012. What Wright must be thinking when he sees Beltran go off and help the Cardinals reach the NLCS and Pagan win a world championship. Let's not assume Wright will just resign if the Mets throw money at him.

  13. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by fanofclendennon View Post
    It;s not a matter of how much they siphoned off. They were investing a ton of money with him to get consistent returns of 18 percent, an unheard of rate without any losses.

    These returns are what made them think they were coming out ahead on the Bobby Bonilla deferral even though they were paying him 20 million instead of 4 or 5 (or whatever he was owed).

    No doubt those fictitious returns made them more aggressive and competitive in buying players than they otherwise would have been.

    Yet still we don't know how much the team was funded by Madoff but we do what debts they have, and they're huge. Things are so bad they can only afford a $70M payroll.

  14. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by SILVER SEAVER View Post
    They are too big of cowards to actually come out and admit they are rebuilding because of the negative feedback they might get from season ticket holders. They feel if they sprinkle in a few hasbeen free agents to the mix that it will give the illusion to the fans that they are still in a win now mode which couldn't be further from the truth.

    But they're not rebuilding, they're slashing payroll whilst trying to maintain the illusion of competition, a rebuilding team would be trading away its older stars, they Mets apart from Beltran have not done that.

    The idiots who are still buying season tix now are idiots who would buy season tix irrespective of product.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    But they're not rebuilding, they're slashing payroll whilst trying to maintain the illusion of competition, a rebuilding team would be trading away its older stars, they Mets apart from Beltran have not done that.

    The idiots who are still buying season tix now are idiots who would buy season tix irrespective of product.
    I understand that you and many other members of this board like the George Allen way of building a team. It doesn't mean it's the right way to approach building a team. But I'm sure it's exciting for you to read about the acquisition on the back page of the newspaper.

    And yes they are rebuilding, they are investing in the draft and the IFA. They are either trading or let letting contracts of old expensive player expire. They are building the future around young pitching and a wile-grizzlied knuckleball pitcher. And infusing youth that fit their style of play into their lineup.


    "You don't know how to drink. Your whole generation, you drink for the wrong reasons. My generation, we drink because it's good, because it feels better than unbuttoning your collar, because we deserve it. We drink because it's what men do."

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