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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna28 View Post
    With Santana and Bay off the books they will spend money, don't worry.

    If they don't spend, they will be forced to sell... Period.

    Sorry, but I don't buy that. I have looked at 2014, and it doesn't look that good either, in terms of what's out there or in $$$ terms.

    Assuming DW and Niese stay then that's $33.5M on two players, assuming DW gets $20M per.

    That's another 23 players to sign ,on a payroll that could be anywhere from $70M to $100M, bear in mind they can only afford a payroll of $70M at this point.

    It's really not going to be the bonanza people think it will be.

    Will they be forced to sell?

    Seems to me Bud is quite happy with the Mets failing to compete year after year and will continually falling att, revenue, interest and hope.

  2. #302
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    They will never have a payroll of $70MM mark my words. That is borderline small market territory and even Selig won't stand for that. The Mets being irrelevant is not good for baseball since NY is the largest market which means more money for the sport.

    He will give the Wilpons time to get themselves out of financial trouble, but he will draw the line at that point imo, because it's not acceptable. This cost cutting has only happened for one off-season so far and will happen for a 2nd time this off-season.

  3. #303
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    And if he doesn't, Bud is out in 2 years, so the nepotism could very well be over.

    Like YS said, this is not good for baseball to continue to allow the Mets to act like a small market franchise going forward.

    Not to mention the Wilpons are doing themselves in by not acquiring players because it's only going to hurt them at the box office if they continue this trend.
    Last edited by metswon69; 10-24-2012 at 01:02 PM.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by YoungStuna28 View Post
    They will never have a payroll of $70MM mark my words. That is borderline small market territory and even Selig won't stand for that. The Mets being irrelevant is not good for baseball since NY is the largest market which means more money for the sport.

    He will give the Wilpons time to get themselves out of financial trouble, but he will draw the line at that point imo, because it's not acceptable. This cost cutting has only happened for one off-season so far and will happen for a 2nd time this off-season.
    How do you know?

    They're losing money on $95M. Their current break-even is around $70M.

    Selig won't stand for what? he's their chief enabler, seems to me he's enjoying standing for it.

    What the Coupons are doing now is not acceptable, yet Bud loves them and gushes about Fredo.

    They've been cutting costs since 2008, by not investing in the team, those high payrolls actually hid what's been going on for years, yes they had a $140M payroll but they had no choice as they had so much committed. As soon as they could they got out from under deals.

    I think you're being a tad naive here, and as you're 18 you will not have spent years watching the Coupons operate, If you think they're in baseball to make the NY Mets a powerhouse you're mistaken, they are not. They are here out of vanity and ego, they will see the Mets run how they wish first and foremost, what actually happens on the diamond is well down their priority list.

    VANITY - EGO - CONTROL - MONEY - WINNING.


    They will never ever put winning first, never.

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    And if he doesn't, Bud is out in 2 years, so the nepotism could very well be over.

    Like YS said, this is not good for baseball to continue to allow the Mets to act like a small market franchise going forward.

    Not to mention the Wilpons are doing themselves in by not acquiring players because it's only going to hurt them at the box office if they continue this trend.

    They seem utterly indifferent to what happens at the box-office in terms of trying to turn it round by acquiring players though. Fredo said that att. will fund acquisitions, not the other way round, att. is falling and will continue to fall, so where are the acquisitions coming from?

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    They seem utterly indifferent to what happens at the box-office in terms of trying to turn it round by acquiring players though. Fredo said that att. will fund acquisitions, not the other way round, att. is falling and will continue to fall, so where are the acquisitions coming from?
    They can't expect 3+ million attendance from a 70 win ball club.

    Eventually, even if this a vicious cycle of revenue in relation to acquiring players, they are going to have to make the first move to get people to come back to the ballpark (because they aren't otherwise)

    Not the Andres Torres's of the world, that won't cut it.

    The excuses are over in 2014, this team will have 40-50 million invested in 3 contracted players and pre arbitration and arbitration eligible players (Wright's contract will be backloaded so you won't be talking 20 million in 2014, and Dickey could be gone)

    Met fans aren't stupid, there is a reason why attendance was barely over 2 million this year and why it will be even less next year if this team continues to flounder.
    Last edited by metswon69; 10-24-2012 at 01:55 PM.

  7. #307
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    Mets really need to stick with the plan. Trades trades and more trades.

    There are teams out there that want a Lucas Duda

    There are teams out there that crave some of our young minor league arms not named Wheeler.

    There are teams out there that like Daniel Murphy.

    We need a change to our lineup. We need RH hitters with above average POP.

    Those guys are out there, we just need to be creative.

  8. #308
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    Our Bullpen is not as awful going forward as some think.

    Parnell has some trade value and I would like to see him moved.
    Rauch I could take or Leave.

    Ramon Ramirez.....Gone

    Young guys like Elvin Ramirez, Josh Edgin and even Robert Carson deserve another look.

    There are alot of journeyman guys that could instantly give the Mets a lot more talent than what we had this year.

    Frankie is not bad as a setup guy, and mayber one of the youngsters could close. Not a perfect plan, but there is not much farther down we could go. If we had the Braves Bullpen, we could have been a playoff team this year.

  9. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by metswon69 View Post
    They can't expect 3+ million attendance from a 70 win ball club.

    Eventually, even if this a vicious cycle of revenue in relation to acquiring players, they are going to have to make the first move to get people to come back to the ballpark (because they aren't otherwise)

    Not the Andres Torres's of the world, that won't cut it.

    The excuses are over in 2014, this team will have 40-50 million invested in 3 contracted players and pre arbitration and arbitration eligible players (Wright's contract will be backloaded so you won't be talking 20 million in 2014, and Dickey could be gone)

    Met fans aren't stupid, there is a reason why attendance was barely over 2 million this year and why it will be even less next year if this team continues to flounder.


    Yeah, they know they're not going to get 3M with this lousy team, do they seem overly concerned about that to you? they just increased tix prices in some cases.

    I will believe it when I see it, the Coupons ran out of excuses years ago in my book, when 2014 rolls round if they don't want to spend, they'll think up some new excuses.

    That's they operate, they will say anything today, and do a 180 on it tommorow. Already they'er beginning to back off signing RA, and not a single one of us is surprised, we can debate the merits of his case, but what's clear is the Mets don't want to pay their best SP.

    It's pretty easy to tell a fan base that's already terrified of FA's that 'We don't want to overpay' etc, that 'we don't want to make the mistakes of the past'. Some fans even believe that bloated contracts are still preventing the team from spending, they're not, not for a credible NY team. They can't afford a NY team, that's why they're not spending, their debts are too huge, that's where revenue is going, they've sold off a huge tranche of the team just to service debts.

    $90M and falling is not a credible NY payroll. Where is the money going to come from when their break even is $70M right now? with falling atts next year and so on...


    It does not add up at all.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    I'd guess most of those guys are/will be over 30 by that time, Gomez won't be.

    I know Morse will be, so will Ellsbury, and Cruz too. The others i'm not so sure.
    If the Mets are waiting for a young big time OF in FA, you are talking Heyward and Upton in 2015 (the latter who i know you don't love), and Giancarlo in 2016 (who the Mets should save every dollar to get i ray

    They are going to have make some moves before then even if they take the inherent risk of signing a 30+ year old OF.

    They'll have to gauge the market, i don't believe any of those guys are going to get 5-6+ years with the exception of maybe Ellsbury (and that's only if he has a huge season next season)
    Last edited by metswon69; 10-24-2012 at 05:25 PM.

  11. #311
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Mcfly View Post
    How do you know?

    They're losing money on $95M. Their current break-even is around $70M.

    Selig won't stand for what? he's their chief enabler, seems to me he's enjoying standing for it.

    What the Coupons are doing now is not acceptable, yet Bud loves them and gushes about Fredo.

    They've been cutting costs since 2008, by not investing in the team, those high payrolls actually hid what's been going on for years, yes they had a $140M payroll but they had no choice as they had so much committed. As soon as they could they got out from under deals.

    I think you're being a tad naive here, and as you're 18 you will not have spent years watching the Coupons operate, If you think they're in baseball to make the NY Mets a powerhouse you're mistaken, they are not. They are here out of vanity and ego, they will see the Mets run how they wish first and foremost, what actually happens on the diamond is well down their priority list.

    VANITY - EGO - CONTROL - MONEY - WINNING.


    They will never ever put winning first, never.
    Because right now they are able to make excuses with Johan and Bay's contracts, after this season, there will be no excuse for not spending money to improve the team.

    Selig won't stand for it because there will be a tremendous amount of criticism and pressure to force ownership to sell, similar with that happened to the Dodgers.

    No they not been cutting costs since 2008, where do you come up with these BS allegations? They traded for an expensive closer to use as their set up man, signed K-Rod to a big deal with Wagner's contract still on the books, how is that cost cutting? Then they signed Bay to a big deal. The cost cutting happened as soon as the Madoff story came up, so logically the payroll has decreased since then.

    Now however, it is settled but they will be using this off season to get themselves back on their feet hopefully.

    You are being way too extreme and illogical with your blind hate for ownership. I don't like them either, but you are just flat-out wrong.

  12. #312
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    They had a 140 million dollar payroll as recently as 2011.

    They didn't carry themselves as a small market franchise, the biggest accusation you can make against the Wilpons was they never made that move to put them over the top.

    But it wasn't like they were pocketing every dime or giving it to their friend Bernie.

    They were spending it on the baseball team but it was spent incorrectly on players that didn't meet their potential like Santana, K-Rod, Bay, etc etc.
    Last edited by metswon69; 10-25-2012 at 09:45 AM.

  13. #313
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    Lmao Jose Reyes is at the Knicks-Nets preseason game. He still loves NY.

  14. #314
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    He still must live in LI.

  15. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sick Of It All View Post
    He still must live in LI.
    Oh yeah.

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