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  1. #1
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    Predict the offseason

    What moves do you predict we make? Here's some ideas i have.. We have some money to be spent, my predictions are based on us actually spending it so well see.

    Trades: I'd personally like to see us trade Chris Perez for Peter Bourjous CF of the Angels or Brandon Belt 1B of the Giants. This would allow us to let Pestano take over as our closer. I think Bourjos can become a very good leadoff hitter, and belt can become a good 1B.. let's say we get Bourjos.

    FA: Mike Napoli 1B/C, Dan Haren SP, OF Melky Cabrera.. our low risk high reward moves are SP Shawn Marcum and SP Brandon McCarthy and relief pitcher.. Bobby Jenks. he could be had for the minimum with the way he pitched in boston, but we know how effective he can be from the white sox. I also personally believe we bring back sizemore as well for the vet min as a 4th OF and DH possibility.

    My reasoning is because Napoli and Haren haven't produced as well this year, lowering their cost this offseason and melky cabrera... well the steroid thing really messed him up, but boy was he having a heck of a year. marcum is cheap because of injury history and mccarthy threw very well this year, but that shot he took in the head is going to hurt him this season. truthfully we have the money to make this happen. Hafner's 13mil off the books, Sizemore's 5mil, Kotchman's 3mil, Carmona's 6mil. also loosing the likes of shelley duncan and lowe(5mill).. that is roughly 33mil.. I precict Napoli 4yrs/40mil, Haren 4yrs/38, Cabrera 2/10.. and then other guys 1yr deals, except id go 3 on mccarthy personally.

    If this were to happen, and hypothetically it can, we'd look like this:

    RF-Shin Soo Choo
    LF-Melky Cabrera
    SS-Asdrubal Cabrera
    C- Carlos Santana
    1B-Mike Napoli
    CF-Michael Brantley
    2B-Jason Kipnis
    3B-Lonnie Chisenhall
    DH-Grady Sizemore(this could be napoli,santana,any of our OF'ers on any given day)

    Rotation:
    1. Dan Haren
    2. Justin Masterson
    3. Shaun Marcum
    4. Brandon McCarthy
    5. Ubaldo Jimenez(could save 6mil by cutting him, but i dont see it happening)

    on the bench we have: CF Peter Bourjos(speed), INF Jason Donald, C Lou Marson, 1B/OF Russ Canzler or Matt Laporta

    Pen:
    Closer-Vinnie Pestano
    LHP-Rafael Perez
    LHP-Nick Hagadone
    RHP-Esmil Rogers
    RHP-Cody Allen
    RHP-Joe Smith
    RHP-Zach McCalister

    i know ima get a lot of pessimistic crap from ya'll but be open minded, hiring Francona could be a beginning to something. We could spend, we have the money right now so well see.. but who do yall want if we do have 33mil to spend? and what do you think of mine?

    The start of something great to come in Carolina, bring on the haters!

  2. #2
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    I heard a report from somewhere that Sizemore was expected to miss all of 2013, so I would hope the FO wouldn't be dumb enough to invest anything in him. Although we don't need to resign Pronk at 13 million, but we would still owe him 2.5 million.
    I think Francona definitely helps with maybe motivating players like Santana, and Cabrera. But they still need an ace pitcher (Haren would be nice but he's a California guy and we'd probably overpay), and at last two power bats. How about Hamilton?

  3. #3
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    Honestly Hamilton could be an option, but i could see him going somewhere like the Braves on a 4yr 80mil deal. i don't see us paying him that much annually. Napoli would bring some pop to the lineup, i didn't hear that about Sizemore(my bad).. Lance Berkman at DH? personally im just ready to see what the offseason brings. Ready for the entire staff to be named.

    Looks like were gonna have Sandy Alomar back to go with Francona which is a good start, but im ready for 2013. Go Tribe!

    The start of something great to come in Carolina, bring on the haters!

  4. #4
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    Are we talking about the Yankees or the Indians. where are you guys getting all this money from. Dolan is not going to sign 3 Free agents at any where near the money you are talking about. If we spend $10-15 million I will be surprised.

  5. #5
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    you have to look at the logic, if our payroll stays the same thats the money that we have to spend. not 10-15.

    The start of something great to come in Carolina, bring on the haters!

  6. #6
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    Absolutely ludicrous predictions.

    I don't know what makes you think we're gonna turn into the LA Dodgers this offseason but we're not. Francona has already said that he took this job with the intention of coaching the team we have now, he didn't take it because he promised we'd spend $100M this offseason. There is 0% chance we sign any of the guys you listed, and besides that all of them seem like pretty awful signings. Melky, another left-handed hitter with no power whose production seems to be the result of juicing. Dan Haren who's coming off the worst year of his career on the wrong side of 30 (also has a team option that the Angels will likely exercise, no guarantee he'll even be a FA) and Mike Napoli who had one good year, mostly led by inflated numbers due to an insanely unsustainable BABIP, and who defensively is identical to Santana as a butcher behind the plate that doubles as a below average first-basemen. Why do you want to sign these players? None of them make any sense on this team, nor are they realistic in any way. Your trades are silly too. No way do the Giants, who have a stacked bullpen, trade Belt, one of their most promising young players, for Chris Perez. Doubtful the Angels give up Bourjos for him either, and trading him for someone who basically amounts to a pinch runner just so Pestano can assume the closers role doesn't make much sense to me.

    Likely the biggest move the Tribe will make will be signing a right-handed bat like Cody Ross or Delmon Young. Not sexy names by any means but they fit perfectly on the team, cheap, right-handed, middle of the order bats with pretty good pop who have been consistent in their production and provide an immediate upgrade over whoever we currently plan on trotting out in LF next season. Best case scenario I see is grabbing BJ Upton to play CF and hit at the top of order and moving Brantley back to LF.

    If we do sign a pitcher, it will likely be a veteran southpaw like Joe Saunders. They could go the Joe Blanton route, but I doubt they want another Derek Lowe repeat. Best-case scenario would be someone like Edwin Jackson with Shaun Marcum being an unlikely reach, but realistically I think you go into next season with Masterson, Ubaldo, Carrasco and two of Huff, McAllister, Tomlin, Gomez or Carmona/Hernandez.


    I think the team looks something like this next year-

    1. S. Choo - RF
    2. A. Cabrera - SS
    3. J. Kipnis - 2B
    4. C. Santana - C
    5. C. Ross - LF
    6. M. Brantley - CF
    7. J. Gomes - DH
    8. R. Canzler - 1B
    9. L. Chisenhall - 3B

    SP - J. Masterson
    SP - U. Jimenez
    SP - J. Saunders
    SP - C. Carrasco
    SP - Z. McAllister/Huff/Tomlin
    Last edited by iAugust; 10-15-2012 at 12:49 AM.

  7. #7
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    mike napoli brings right handed pop, who can hit in the middle of the order for us.. he's hit .270 a few years and last season .320, but he will hit you at least 20hr's

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/...44/mike-napoli

    melky cabrera is a switch hitter, must not watch a lot of tribe games since he used to play for KC.. anyways, he's a career .285 hitter. which means his career line is better than any of our guys season line this year except brantley at .288. with KC he hit 18.

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/.../melky-cabrera

    last year wasn't Haren's finest year, but a positive is it's lowered his price tag. his ERA was still almost a full run better than any of our starters. none the less he's still a top of the rotation arm, and he's one season removed from a 3.17 ERA.

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/stats/_/id/5565/dan-haren

    in regards to declining his option,

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/dan_haren/

    also a heads up the giants are worried brian wilson won't bounce back from tommy john surgery, perez would be a good insurance.. and they weren't very high on belt in july so im just putting pieces together

    The start of something great to come in Carolina, bring on the haters!

  8. #8
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    You don't have to link me to their ESPN stat pages, I know who these guys are and what they've done (although I will admit my error on somehow forgetting that Melky is a switch hitter). The point is, these are all big name guys who will be looking for multiyear, decent-to-big money deals this year, and they ALL have serious question marks.

    Napoli, outside of the 1 season where he had an insanely inflated .AVG due to a lucky unsustainable .344 BABIP, is a career .246 hitter. In addition his HR total last year was pretty inflated by the bandbox that is Arlington Park, couple that will the wall we have in left-field and it is a pretty serious difference, although I can't deny he has some serious pop. He hit .227 this year, he is much closer to a .227 hitter than he is a .320 hitter.

    Melky's last two seasons carry an absurd jump in batting numbers across the board, most noticicebly in the slugging/power department. Assuming he started juicing when he joined Kansas City last year, let's compare his numbers pre-PEDs and post-PEDs:

    .267/.328/.379 (.707 OPS, terribad), averaging about 8 HRs per season
    .322/.360/.489 (.849 OPS), averaging 15 HRs per season

    Again, I think it's a lot more likely that we get the .260 AVG and laughably weak .379 SLG% Melky than the PED version we've seen the last two years.

    All that needs to be said about Haren is that he is 32 years old and he just posted the worst season of his career, by far. He is not going to get any younger.


    These are not the kind of players that you want to give long-term, big money contracts to. Especially when you're a team like the Indians with a restricted payroll. Besides this very obvious logic, when have the Indians ever done anything like this in FA that leads you to believe they might make these type of signings?

    They're going to do what they do every year (and what makes sense for our organization), sign short term, low-dollar deals to safer players who could still put up production similar to the guys you're suggesting. The name of the game is VALUE. No point risking tons of money locked up over many years to guys with huge question marks like you mentioned. It's just not gonna happen

  9. #9
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    listen i completely understand your logic of when have we ever done anything like this in FA, but when was the last time we hired a manager like Terry Francona? a 2 time world series champion? not in my lifetime.. the last manager we hired with substantial managerial experience was John McNamara before the 1990 season. We ended up signing Eddie Murray and Dennis Martinez to go along with our young nucleus.. im not saying its going to happen, but its a possibility we bring in a few legit players.

    The start of something great to come in Carolina, bring on the haters!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panthers4life View Post
    listen i completely understand your logic of when have we ever done anything like this in FA, but when was the last time we hired a manager like Terry Francona? a 2 time world series champion? not in my lifetime.. the last manager we hired with substantial managerial experience was John McNamara before the 1990 season. We ended up signing Eddie Murray and Dennis Martinez to go along with our young nucleus.. im not saying its going to happen, but its a possibility we bring in a few legit players.
    We signed Eddie Murray and Dennis Martinez while Mike Hargrove was managing the Tribe, not McNamara!

    I am all for making a splash this offseason...but the odds of them doing anything major are slim. If they don't do anything to address the abysmal offense that this team put on the field this year...next year will be more of the same. It doesn't matter who the manager is if the players he has to choose from are borderline big leaguers.

    I am worried about Terry Francona being the manager. He is used to playing with Boston talent, not Major League fringe players. This line-up has Choo, Cabrera, Santana, Kipnis, and Brantley as legitimate big leaguers. Other than them, we have Casey Kotchman as our 1B, Jack Hanahan/Lonnie Chisenhall at 3B, ?? at LF, and ?? at DH. In Boston, he was used to there being MAYBE one starting position that went into camp undecided.

    I hope that bringing in Francona is the start of things being done the right way...including opening the check book, but I will believe it when I see it. I am done getting my hopes up with Cleveland sports teams...they need to prove something to me before I get excited!

  11. #11
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    Predicting what we're going to do is boring because it's probably not much but I would if I had two players the Indians could go out and sign it'd be Greinke and Hamilton. That would be awesome. Realistically? BJ Upton, Carl Pavano? lol

  12. #12
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    I'm so ready for the offseason to actually begin.. meaning FA

    The start of something great to come in Carolina, bring on the haters!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panthers4life View Post
    I'm so ready for the offseason to actually begin.. meaning FA
    What I wouldn't give to see this lineup

    LF- Brantley
    SS- Cabrera
    CF- Hamilton
    RF- Choo
    C- Santana
    DH- ???? Ortiz maybe for cheap to reunite with Francona
    2B- Kipnis
    1B- Canzler/Laporta/Kotchman
    3B- Chisenhall

    SP- Greinke
    SP- Masterson
    SP- Ubaldo
    SP- Carmona er, Hernandez lol
    SP- ?????

    I know this won't happen but I think Cleveland would be pumped if it did. One great hitter and one great pitcher drastically changes how you look at a lineup. Guys like Kipnis and Chisenhall don't have to be near All Star level for us to be successful in that lineup just be solid and if they do reach potential. That lineup is sick or can withstand an injury or two.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustinLafferty View Post
    What I wouldn't give to see this lineup

    LF- Brantley
    SS- Cabrera
    CF- Hamilton
    RF- Choo
    C- Santana
    DH- ???? Ortiz maybe for cheap to reunite with Francona
    2B- Kipnis
    1B- Canzler/Laporta/Kotchman
    3B- Chisenhall

    SP- Greinke
    SP- Masterson
    SP- Ubaldo
    SP- Carmona er, Hernandez lol
    SP- ?????

    I know this won't happen but I think Cleveland would be pumped if it did. One great hitter and one great pitcher drastically changes how you look at a lineup. Guys like Kipnis and Chisenhall don't have to be near All Star level for us to be successful in that lineup just be solid and if they do reach potential. That lineup is sick or can withstand an injury or two.
    Why would you have Carmona in the rotation? lmao!!
    For not honoring a sig bet I now own YEDB90

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by prodigy View Post
    Why would you have Carmona in the rotation? lmao!!
    After Greinke that rotation gets ugly.

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