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  1. #481
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    Quote Originally Posted by slugger82685 View Post
    i just dont see us signing another bat. I think they are going to go with Martin as an extra OF and Cruz seeing more time at DH, then Moreland/Olt splitting time at 1B. Not sure what they are going to do with Profar, they need to get him some playing time though to see what he can do so that next offseason they either need to trade one of Andrus or Kinsler or extend Andrus and use Profar as a trade piece. What really worries me is the rotation, if our guys dont produce this year, next years free agent pitching crop is very underwhelming so it will be hard to improve it which is another reason why it was important for us to not miss out on Greinke. Unless the guys we have in the rotation now prove to be useful, we will absolutely need to make a trade....but obviously any kind of sacrifice is unacceptable to the Rangers.
    If that holds true, then 2013 would be considered a rebuilding year. I am somewhat fine with seeing all of the kids play. Just wish we could have gotten something in return for all of the talent that we are losing this offseason. Here is a list of the FA pitchers next year:


    Bronson Arroyo (37)
    Scott Baker (32)
    Nick Blackburn (32) - $8MM club option
    A.J. Burnett (37)
    Chris Capuano (35) - $8MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout
    Chris Carpenter (39)
    Bruce Chen (37)
    Bartolo Colon (41)
    Jorge De La Rosa (33)
    R.A. Dickey (39)
    Scott Feldman (30)
    Gavin Floyd (31)
    Jeff Francis (33)
    Matt Garza (30)
    Roy Halladay (37) - $20MM vesting option
    Jason Hammel (31)
    Aaron Harang (36) - $7MM+ mutual option with a $2MM buyout
    Dan Haren (33)
    Tim Hudson (38)
    Phil Hughes (28)
    Ubaldo Jimenez (30) - may void $8MM option for 2014
    Josh Johnson (30)
    Hiroki Kuroda (39)
    John Lannan (29)
    Jon Lester (30) - $13MM club option with a $250K buyout
    Colby Lewis (34)
    Ted Lilly (38)
    Tim Lincecum (30)
    Paul Maholm (32)
    Jason Marquis (35)
    Ricky Nolasco (31)
    Andy Pettitte (42)
    Wandy Rodriguez (35) - $13MM club option with a $2.5MM buyout
    Ervin Santana (31)
    Johan Santana (34) - $25MM club option with a $5.5MM buyout
    James Shields (32) - $12MM club option with a $1MM buyout
    Jason Vargas (31)
    Edinson Volquez (30)
    Tsuyoshi Wada (33) - $5MM club option
    Adam Wainwright (32)
    Barry Zito (36) - $18MM vesting option with a $7MM buyout

    Quest to watch a game in all 30 baseball stadiums, so far I have seen: Arizona, Atlanta, Baltimore, Boston, Chicago Cubs, Chicago White Sox, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Colorado, Detroit, Houston, Kansas City, LA Angels, LA Dodgers, Miami, NY Mets, NY Yankees, Philly, Pittsburgh, San Francisco, St. Louis, San Diego, Seattle, Tampa Bay, Texas, Toronto, Washington

  2. #482
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    yeah I looked at that list before I made that post....I think I would go after Wainwright, he pitched well once he got back into the groove after coming off surgery and has a great track record. JJ and Timmy are obviously big names to possibly target, but JJ needs to prove he can stay healthy and Timmy needs to have a solid bounce back season....but again, my choice would be Wainwright, I dont think he would cost as much as Greinke and a 4-5 year deal would be reasonable. He is an innings eater and shows a ton of consistency. I would do 5 years at $18 mil/year as a starting point at least.

  3. #483
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cursed Rangers View Post
    If that holds true, then 2013 would be considered a rebuilding year. I am somewhat fine with seeing all of the kids play. Just wish we could have gotten something in return for all of the talent that we are losing this offseason. Here is a list of the FA pitchers next year:


    Bronson Arroyo (37)
    Scott Baker (32)
    Nick Blackburn (32) - $8MM club option
    A.J. Burnett (37)
    Chris Capuano (35) - $8MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout
    Chris Carpenter (39)
    Bruce Chen (37)
    Bartolo Colon (41)
    Jorge De La Rosa (33)
    R.A. Dickey (39)
    Scott Feldman (30)
    Gavin Floyd (31)
    Jeff Francis (33)
    Matt Garza (30)
    Roy Halladay (37) - $20MM vesting option
    Jason Hammel (31)
    Aaron Harang (36) - $7MM+ mutual option with a $2MM buyout
    Dan Haren (33)
    Tim Hudson (38)
    Phil Hughes (28)
    Ubaldo Jimenez (30) - may void $8MM option for 2014
    Josh Johnson (30)
    Hiroki Kuroda (39)
    John Lannan (29)
    Jon Lester (30) - $13MM club option with a $250K buyout
    Colby Lewis (34)
    Ted Lilly (38)
    Tim Lincecum (30)
    Paul Maholm (32)
    Jason Marquis (35)
    Ricky Nolasco (31)
    Andy Pettitte (42)
    Wandy Rodriguez (35) - $13MM club option with a $2.5MM buyout
    Ervin Santana (31)
    Johan Santana (34) - $25MM club option with a $5.5MM buyout
    James Shields (32) - $12MM club option with a $1MM buyout
    Jason Vargas (31)
    Edinson Volquez (30)
    Tsuyoshi Wada (33) - $5MM club option
    Adam Wainwright (32)
    Barry Zito (36) - $18MM vesting option with a $7MM buyout
    The only aces I see in there are past their prime or Lincecum...who is simply unpredictable.
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  4. #484
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    Lincecum was JDs pick the year he got drafted until SF decided to take him right before the Rangers had the chance. If he hits the open market, I'd expect JD to do anything and everything he could to sign him. I'd also expect them to make a hard run at Josh Johnson because he's ALWAYS mentioned when it comes to Texas, so obviously they have interest.

    If the Rangers are expecting to make serious runs at these guys, it may make a bit more sense as to why they're not pursuing any other SP options outside of Grienke. They were #1 or bust when it came to the rotation this year. There's certainly a case to be made that both Lincecum and Johnson could be legit #1s. Pairing those two with Darvish and Harrison with perhaps a break out 2013 from Holland could be a plan worth waiting for. Rangers could also have some interest in Dickey (if no extension is reached) and Volquez.

  5. #485
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    I just cant believe this off season it has been the worst i can remember in a long time.We have signed two crappy catchers and a relief pitcher that is coming off Tommy John surgery.We have lost Josh Hamilton,Mike Napoli,Michael Young,Koji Uehara,Mike Adams,Scott Feldman,Mark Lowe,Ryan Dempster and Roy Oswalt.I understand that you have roll over in rosters but this is totally ridiculous.We should have lots of money to spend since the guys that i mentioned above we paid over 65 million in salary last year.I know we are paying 10 million of Young's salary and we have 2 million that we are paying Colby but even counting that that is still 53 million that we are not paying.The best i can tell with the players we have under contracts for next year is 83 million and i know we will give raises to Harrison and Murphy in arbitration so figure another 8 million are so and the other 12 players will be around the 500.000 league minimum maybe a few a little more then that so say another 7 or 8 million so our payroll should be around 98 million.With the front office saying our payroll is going to be around 120 million so i guess we still have around 22 million to spend.Can we get a catcher a bat and a starter with that money i doubt it.You can bet your sweet butt they are not going to take the increases of the ticket prices off so i say we are not getting our money's worth unless they have something up there sleeve that i cant see happening.We better hope that Profar,Olt,Martin and Perez are ready for the bigs because if not we are going to be struggling to be a 500 club again.

  6. #486
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    It's a big gamble going young and cheap this year and hoping to sign something next year.

    First off, if this team doesn't win the division, make the wild card or somehow advance a bit in the playoffs, we're back to where we were some years ago when we had to pay a lot more than other teams just to get players to sign here. It's not as if we play in a pitchers park and we saw that even coming off a good season (sort of), Greinke's decision came down to the type of park he'd be pitching in. If you take away the "winning team" from the Rangers, then Arlington really isn't a draw for free agents.

    Secondly, this isn't a great FA class for pitchers. So you want Wainwright? You really think St. Louis will let him get away that easily? What's next...Lincecum? If he rebounds, then his pricetag skyrockets. If he doesn't, do you really want to take that kind of risk on him after two bad years in a row? Matt Garza anyone? We've been talking about him for the last couple years. He's not a #1 and could be in the same position Greinke was in this year, in that he's not a solid "ace", but could be the best pitcher on the market (Greinke is still better, btw). Yes, that means expect to "overpay" (dreaded word for Ranger homers I know) to get him here.

    Third, if guys like Profar, Olt and Perez don't have great full seasons, then their trade value might go down. That was the complaint on Olt this year, after a mediocre beginning to his MLB career (he'll be fine, I think). So...then you're stuck with these guys because you're not going to get fair trade value for them.

    Finally, what makes any one of you think the Rangers will finally get off their rears and sign someone at full value next year? You know other teams will. The Rangers, however, have a track record of sitting around, watching the top players get "overpaid", then settling for the next tier of players. With a shortage of quality pitchers next year, what makes you think the Rangers will sign anything more than a #2b or #3 type starter after the others have already been signed?

    I'm sorry...I just can't take all the blind optimism anymore. The chances we get any of the top few pitchers off that list is less than me getting a chance to pitch for this team.

    Who needs Josh Hamilton when you can have this for $11m?

  7. #487
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    Quote Originally Posted by stipe1280 View Post
    It's a big gamble going young and cheap this year and hoping to sign something next year.

    First off, if this team doesn't win the division, make the wild card or somehow advance a bit in the playoffs, we're back to where we were some years ago when we had to pay a lot more than other teams just to get players to sign here. It's not as if we play in a pitchers park and we saw that even coming off a good season (sort of), Greinke's decision came down to the type of park he'd be pitching in. If you take away the "winning team" from the Rangers, then Arlington really isn't a draw for free agents.

    Secondly, this isn't a great FA class for pitchers. So you want Wainwright? You really think St. Louis will let him get away that easily? What's next...Lincecum? If he rebounds, then his pricetag skyrockets. If he doesn't, do you really want to take that kind of risk on him after two bad years in a row? Matt Garza anyone? We've been talking about him for the last couple years. He's not a #1 and could be in the same position Greinke was in this year, in that he's not a solid "ace", but could be the best pitcher on the market (Greinke is still better, btw). Yes, that means expect to "overpay" (dreaded word for Ranger homers I know) to get him here.

    Third, if guys like Profar, Olt and Perez don't have great full seasons, then their trade value might go down. That was the complaint on Olt this year, after a mediocre beginning to his MLB career (he'll be fine, I think). So...then you're stuck with these guys because you're not going to get fair trade value for them.

    Finally, what makes any one of you think the Rangers will finally get off their rears and sign someone at full value next year? You know other teams will. The Rangers, however, have a track record of sitting around, watching the top players get "overpaid", then settling for the next tier of players. With a shortage of quality pitchers next year, what makes you think the Rangers will sign anything more than a #2b or #3 type starter after the others have already been signed?

    I'm sorry...I just can't take all the blind optimism anymore. The chances we get any of the top few pitchers off that list is less than me getting a chance to pitch for this team.
    Agree, when it comes to the top tier FA's I'd have to say we're pretenders.

  8. #488
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    Here is what is going through my head (baseball wise) this morning:

    - Thank goodness last week is over! That was a tough week for Rangers fans.

    - The Rangers are still missing one player on offense (who will be the DH), and could use a catcher and a starting pitcher.

    - Right now there are only 2 teams in the AL that are spending money like crazy. The Angels and the Tigers. Boston, the Yankees, and the Phillies (to an extent), have all seemed to learn this lesson on going all out on multiple big name FA's. I don't see how the Angels could get another big name next offseason, but crazier things have happened. I also think the Cubs will start being big spenders in the next year or two. Point is, it only takes a limited number of teams to keep the FA salaries astronomicial.

    - What are the Rangers going to do with all of the tv money?

    - Ownership would earn a lot of respect from me if they lowered the ticket pricing back to what it was last year. Not going to happen, but it should.

    - The Rangers have the talent, the money, and the fan base to afford a big time contract. Yes it might be a bad contract the last year or two of the contract. However, it is clear that players with big time contracts can be traded.

    - I remember years ago when the Rangers were being signed an aging old veteran to a huge annual salary (at that time). The national writers one one hand said this big name was a good way to get fans in the seat and to have a legand on the Rangers. Others were shocked at how much the player was getting annually. This aging, highly-paid veteran (once again, at the time), was none other than Nolan Ryan.

    - I really need Newberg to write one of his insightful articles about the Rangers offseason and our future.

    Quest to watch a game in all 30 baseball stadiums, so far I have seen: Arizona, Atlanta, Baltimore, Boston, Chicago Cubs, Chicago White Sox, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Colorado, Detroit, Houston, Kansas City, LA Angels, LA Dodgers, Miami, NY Mets, NY Yankees, Philly, Pittsburgh, San Francisco, St. Louis, San Diego, Seattle, Tampa Bay, Texas, Toronto, Washington

  9. #489
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    Remember how Smoak was all but certain to be the next Tex

    Remember how Mateo was going to be a super stud

    Remember how Beavan was going to be a #2 or #3 starter

    Remember how Holland had the upside to be a #2 starter

    Remember the highly touted DVD pitching trio of prospects. Danks, Volquez, Diamond

    Remember how Feliz was likely going to be the next Johan Santana

    Remember when the Rangers catching prospects were the envy of all of baseball

    Quest to watch a game in all 30 baseball stadiums, so far I have seen: Arizona, Atlanta, Baltimore, Boston, Chicago Cubs, Chicago White Sox, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Colorado, Detroit, Houston, Kansas City, LA Angels, LA Dodgers, Miami, NY Mets, NY Yankees, Philly, Pittsburgh, San Francisco, St. Louis, San Diego, Seattle, Tampa Bay, Texas, Toronto, Washington

  10. #490
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    http://www.lonestarball.com/2012/12/...ke-napoli-deal

    I think if the Rangers up their offer to 3 years he'll take it.

  11. #491
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    Quote Originally Posted by Young2Kinsler View Post
    It's not even ****ing mid December. Good lord

    The offseason hasn't been played out at all yet, and you are wanting to declare the future of the franchise one way or another.

    A real fan buys his tickets when the last season is over...not waiting to see the names on the back of the jerseys.

    Like it was said on twitter...getting attached to names on the back of the jerseys, instead of the name on the front of the jerseys...that's a slippery slope
    Can we please not turn this is to the stupid crap that happens in the Cowboys forum, where everyone questions everyone's fan-hood?
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  12. #492
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cursed Rangers View Post
    Remember how Smoak was all but certain to be the next Tex

    I'd like to see the Rangers find a way to get Smoak back. He still has immense talent and may just need a little more time to fully develop like Cruz needed. Plus, we don't have a clear-cut answer at 1B.

    Remember how Mateo was going to be a super stud

    Remember how Beavan was going to be a #2 or #3 starter

    Beavan is a pretty good pitcher. Wish we still had him too.

    Remember how Holland had the upside to be a #2 starter

    Holland still has #2 upside. He just doesn't currently possess #2 consistency. He's also only 26 and far from a finished product.

    Remember the highly touted DVD pitching trio of prospects. Danks, Volquez, Diamond

    I'd still like Volquez and Danks on this team. I was good with the Hamilton trade though. Not too happy with the Danks trade, though.

    Remember how Feliz was likely going to be the next Johan Santana

    I think you're thinking of Martin Perez. I never heard and Feliz/Santana comparisons.

    Remember when the Rangers catching prospects were the envy of all of baseball

    Yeah, this sucked.
    I'm glad the Rangers are valuing their prospects a little more than they have in the past. Imagine where this team would be if we had allowed Chris Young, Adrian Gonzalez, John Danks, R.A. Dickey, Blake Beavan, Justin Smoak, and Edinson Volquez to mature in our system. As this team stands, all those players were traded or released and what the Rangers got back in return represent ZERO value. Adam Eaton, Brandon McCarthy, Cliff Lee, and Josh Hamilton are no longer in our organization and we've given up some pretty big pieces that could be playing a big role on this team in order to acquire those guys.

    I think we would be kicking ourselves for the next 15-20 years if we traded Profar for just a 2 year rental or so.

  13. #493
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    I think the Ranger's need to offer Napoli a 3 year 11 million a year because there are no catchers out there better then he is.I keep hearing A.J. he is a clubhouse cancer and Naps is good in the clubhouse and is a fan favorite.Get it done FO

  14. #494
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    Yea I looked at this list before and made comments about it. Next season there really are no legit aces that will be available. If Lincecum has a bounce back year, he will cost more than Greinke this year. Also, you will be fighting teams like the Red Sox and Yankees for him probably who will be back from their luxury tax threshold they were scared of this year.

    If Lincencum bounces back you could easily be looking at a $200 million pitcher. While he had a blow off season last year, he is by far a legitimate ace when he is on. By far the best pitcher on the market, and will only be 29. Even if he halfway bounces back, expect him to beat Greinkes deal. So then we are stuck at the same position we are now, but with more suitors I am guessing in San Fran, NY, Boston and whoever the hell else is a pitcher away from winning it all. So again, we have to overpay to get him completely.

    The remaining? Josh Johnson is not an ace, he is another #2 at best. In our park he would probably get lit up.

    Garza is the same way, he is no ace. May have difficulty here, and will be getting paid like an ace when it all said and done.

    Other than that, there is a bunch of old #3 pitchers on there. Noone you are going to build a team around. Maybe a few guys a team like the Angels could use to get over the hump, but noone that is going to make the serious difference for us.
    2012 Texas Rangers Offseason

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    Texas Rangers 2010-11 American League Champions!

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  15. #495
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    Not to mention, the chances of getting an impactful position player next season are slim to none. There are no Josh Hamiltons or Prince Fielders on the market. Basically the best we can hope for is overpaying for Nelson Cruz and Chase freaking Utley.
    2012 Texas Rangers Offseason

    "I have never used steroids. Period. I don't know how to say it any more clearly than that. Never” -Rafael Palmeiro (4 Months before testing positive for steroids)

    Texas Rangers 2010-11 American League Champions!

    Indianapolis Colts Super Bowl XLI Champions!

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