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Thread: Skinny Swag

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Brink View Post
    People way overrate what Cruz did anyways. He had a 753 OPS. It's not like he was mashing the ball all over the place and his OBP is terrible. He had a solid half season but people acting like he should our long term third basemen on half a season are silly.
    Well it seems you are a Cruz hater and all, I get that...but a .322 OBP is "terrible"? I'm not sure what qualifies as average or good to you then.
    5>2

  2. #17
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    I think we should put gordon at ss, cruz at 2nd with hamram playing third where he has less errors this will bring speed to the lineup like no other.
    Go dodgers!!!!
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    I would give her a ball maybe two!!!!!!!!

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek Brink View Post
    and Cruz was absolutely horrific for most of the last 12 years.

    I agree Cruz will go in to the season a starter but if he regresses(which is likely) I would be very surprised if the more highly touted Gordon didn't take his job.

    People way overrate what Cruz did anyways. He had a 753 OPS. It's not like he was mashing the ball all over the place and his OBP is terrible. He had a solid half season but people acting like he should our long term third basemen on half a season are silly.

    I guess I shouldn't be surprised how awful peoples memories are at this point. It's like they completely forgot Hairston and Herrera doing similar things and then falling off the map.
    Its not likely Cruz falls off as bad as Gordon has played for our club in his time with us this season. You speak about Hairston and Herrera doing similar things and falling off the map, but Gordon is in the same exact boat as they are. Bats .300 for a little less than half a season in meaningless baseball and then bats .229 before getting injured. The dude was completely useless and thats why I think Dee still needs some more tuning in the minors just like Herrera had happen to him after his struggles. Its baffling that you are so against Cruz in favor of a worse player. IDC what Cruz did before in his time before the Dodgers because it had no effect on our club those past number of years he was playing. If Gordon batted .350 for 12 years and then hit .229 with our club like he did nobody would want him to keep playing for us despite his previous stats. Look at Andruw Jones. Same thing. Stats are a crutch when they are overly relied on. Basically also what happened with Carl Crawford on the Redsox though not as bad.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by LAFord View Post
    Well it seems you are a Cruz hater and all, I get that...but a .322 OBP is "terrible"? I'm not sure what qualifies as average or good to you then.
    .322 isn't very good
    #Joc2LA

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by LASportsFan1996 View Post
    .322 isn't very good
    It is far from horrible, it's actually pretty good. Top 50 in the NL.

    It's the same as Hanely Ramirez and Shane Victorino and higher than some good players such as...hunter pence, Garret Jones, Jimmy Rollins, Brandon Philips
    5>2

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by LASportsFan1996 View Post
    .322 isn't very good
    Gordon had a .280 OBP this year and the year before a .325 OBP when he batted .300. He had a total of 17 RBI's this season and 11 RBI the season he batted .300. This Dee Gordon bias over Cruz is a ****ing joke. Cruz had more RBI's in a half a season than Gordon has ever had in any full season in the minors. I am sure the situational stats are lopsided in Cruz's favor as well.

  7. #22
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    as far as SS and 2nd are concerned, i think that Dee can grow into a better SS i know hanley has been crappy there for the last 7 years, every time he makes a throw it is an adventure to say the least, i think he should be moved to 2nd, he wouldn't have to make the same difficult throws and would still be able to use his natural athleticism

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Blue987 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by LASportsFan1996 View Post
    .322 isn't very good
    Gordon had a .280 OBP this year and the year before a .325 OBP when he batted .300. He had a total of 17 RBI's this season and 11 RBI the season he batted .300. This Dee Gordon bias over Cruz is a ****ing joke. Cruz had more RBI's in a half a season than Gordon has ever had in any full season in the minors. I am sure the situational stats are lopsided in Cruz's favor as well.
    Yeah, I don't get the obsession with Dee either. Of course I love his speed, but its the only decent element he has. He's not a great fielder, he doesn't get on base, and even when he hit .300 in the closing months of 2011 I was more on the side of being cautious with him.

    He is Juan Pierre with even less power, no bunting ability that we've seen thus far, and pitchers are even less afraid to throw him strikes. I'd like to see him back in the minors to fine tune his fielding and do two things to better his hitting.

    Firstly - work on bunting. He needs to learn how to bunt like JP and Raffy. If the corners are in, slap a bunt at the shorstop.

    Secondly - lift weights and eat some f'in food. I know it would likely slow him down slightly, but I'd much rather see him with an extra 15lbs of good muscle if it would help him put a little more pop on ball.

    Doing these two things would help him immensely. If he could hit the ball hard enough down the lines, the infield would be less likely to take away bunts or slow rollers. Additionally, pitchers would be less likely to take the "here it is, get yourself out" approach which may result in more walks.

    The hopeful result is an increase to his OBP. He doesn't need to hit homers, but strength and a new tool to reach base will open many more options for getting on board. After all, what good is speed if you can't use it?
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  9. #24
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    ok, some of you thought I was too quick to judge Dee after basically just one half of baseball. Well, let's throw out some numbers, and those of you who disagree with me can tell me what positives you see in these numbers that maybe I am missing:

    These are based on at least 300 PA's

    BA .228-27th in MLB (last in NL)
    OBP .280-26th in MLB (3rd worst in NL)
    OPS .561-30th in MLB (last in NL)
    Walks-Averaged a walk every 15 AB's (as a leadoff hitter no less)
    Strikeouts-Averaged a strikeout once in less than every 5 AB's
    His strikeout to walk ratio was 4:1 THE WRONG WAY
    Caught Stealing one out of every 3 attempts (65% success rate is TERRIBLE for a base stealer)
    12 TOTAL extra base hits in over 300 AB's

    ....not enuff for you, let's see how he did with the glove:

    His 18 errors tied for 4th worst in all of MLB (in half as many games as anyone else)
    His .946 fielding pctg was BY FAR the worst in all of MLB
    He averaged an error every 4 games

    Can anyone please point out some positives, anywhere?
    Last edited by DodgerBlueMike; 10-11-2012 at 02:58 PM.

  10. #25
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    LOL at looking at RBI's for a leadoff hitter
    #Joc2LA

  11. #26
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    Where is there any mention of RBI in those numbers?

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by DodgerBlueMike View Post
    Where is there any mention of RBI in those numbers?
    Not your post, a little further up
    #Joc2LA

  13. #28
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    Like I said when I originally posted this.....maybe some of the blame needs to fall on the shoulders of Dodger management. Maybe they have not demanded that he learns how to bunt....maybe they have not given him the learning tools like a winter with Bret Butler or Maury WIlls, maybe they are not teaching him the strike zone....I dont know.....all I know is what I saw during the first half and he was, in my mind, one of the 3-5 worst SS in all of baseball....and the numbers I posted above show NOTHING positive at all.

  14. #29
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    He was pretty bad this year, I agree, but he's a young kid learning the ropes, Gordon jumped on the scene last year a la Luis Cruz this year, I think Cruz will start the year as our 3B/SS but if he struggles the leash IMO will be short, Cruz hasn't shown anything in the past, so he still has to earn it
    #Joc2LA

  15. #30
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    I totally understand the fact that Dee was/is young and he was learning on the job.....but at the end of the season, was there anything positive that he did that made you say "well he really helped us here or I see alot of upside in this area or that area...."

    For me, I didn't see one thing, literally not one thing offensively, defensively, or on the bases that made me think of how he can help this team next year or in the future.

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