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  1. #76
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    Yeah. Just ask Mark Prior and Kerry Wood how great of a manager Dusty Baker was. LOL
    I'm In.



  2. #77
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    Yeah Baker is terrible. He wrecked Prior and Wood, i cant beleive he doesnt get more crap for that

  3. #78
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    Man, Swishers splits are lovely.
    His wOBA this year is 1 point higher at home, and his wRC+ are exactly the same.

    For his career, his home wOBA is 3 points higher, wRC+ is 2 higher.

    Id go 6/100.
    You have no idea how excited I am right now.


  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by jej View Post
    Man, Swishers splits are lovely.
    His wOBA this year is 1 point higher at home, and his wRC+ are exactly the same.

    For his career, his home wOBA is 3 points higher, wRC+ is 2 higher.

    Id go 6/100.
    i looked at his stats and was pretty surprised myself. with his consistency too, i seem to remember too clearly that .219 year, his low point, but that was still a productive .219, not a smoak .219...

    6/100 to a borderline AS entering his decline is a little too aggressive for me. hes 32, he clogs the bases, turning into a terrible OFer.

    he just doesnt seem like a fit... hes perfect in NY... bat in the 2 or 6 hole in a HR ballpark i think if we bat him 3 or 4, we stay a 4th place team.

    might as well pay hamilton 140mil and get a guy that will hit 3 or 4 in any lineup. hamiltons production 3 years from now are likely better than you will get next year from swisher.
    Last edited by Rain City; 10-16-2012 at 05:03 PM.

  5. #80
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    I don't see how adding a 4 WAR player doesn't help us. I mean, there are people that don't want us to spend for a bat. That won't help much either.
    You have no idea how excited I am right now.


  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rain City View Post
    i looked at his stats and was pretty surprised myself. with his consistency too, i seem to remember too clearly that .219 year, his low point, but that was still a productive .219, not a smoak .219...

    6/100 to a borderline AS entering his decline is a little too aggressive for me. hes 32, he clogs the bases, turning into a terrible OFer.

    he just doesnt seem like a fit... hes perfect in NY... bat in the 2 or 6 hole in a HR ballpark i think if we bat him 3 or 4, we stay a 4th place team.

    might as well pay hamilton 140mil and get a guy that will hit 3 or 4 in any lineup. hamiltons production 3 years from now are likely better than you will get next year from swisher.
    6/100 for Swisher is absurd. I really do think he'd be a fantastic fit for 3 years, but I wouldn't come close to those numbers for the reasons you mentioned. Swish making $20 million at age 36-38? F that noise.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattColby View Post
    I'm so past Mike Carp.

    Sign Swisher or Hamilton and trade for J.Up
    Boom, do it.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by jej View Post
    I don't see how adding a 4 WAR player doesn't help us. I mean, there are people that don't want us to spend for a bat. That won't help much either.
    do u think he can maintain that in a pitcher friendly park while entering his mid 30s? in a lineup that wont do him any favors?

    i def think we should spend on a bat, in the name of josh hamilton!

  9. #84
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    I got in an interesting debate in the comments of my article
    He said this:
    This translates to an average of 4.45 WAR/ per 162. However he hasn't been a model of durability and as such we can't assume he will be going forward. So if we assume his true talent is a little bit better than his WAR/162 (excluding his 2010) than we can settle of a 5 WAR/162. However, given his durability issues we can't assume he will play 162 games a year. If we assume he can play 85% of a full season over the life of the contract (that would be 138 games a year) then we can calculate how much value he will provide given a .5 WAR per year decline. This would equate to roughly 19 WAR over a six year period. The going rate is around 5M/WAR on the free agent market but taking into account inflation this winter we can go with 5.5M/WAR. Hamilton would project to provide 105M worth of value over the course of this contract.
    Some of it makes sense, and Hamilton may get a little more than he is ACTUALLY worth, but I think some of his assumptions are unfair. I dont see him losing .5 WAR every year.

    He also told me I think like Bavasi, when he is the one who wants to trade all these prospects for overrated players (J-Up).

    I am more for a trade, but I dont think that option is there like one of these signings is. If someone can give me a realistic trade option that will help the team as much as Hamilton, or even Swisher, I will listen. But Walker, Franklin and VCat for Upton is too much. Allen Craig would cost too much. Choo would be a good idea, but he may not resign after his one year.

    We can sign Hamilton and still lower payroll from last year.

    Anyway, who do you want us to trade for (realistically)?
    You have no idea how excited I am right now.


  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by jej View Post
    I got in an interesting debate in the comments of my article
    He said this:


    Some of it makes sense, and Hamilton may get a little more than he is ACTUALLY worth, but I think some of his assumptions are unfair. I dont see him losing .5 WAR every year.

    He also told me I think like Bavasi, when he is the one who wants to trade all these prospects for overrated players (J-Up).

    I am more for a trade, but I dont think that option is there like one of these signings is. If someone can give me a realistic trade option that will help the team as much as Hamilton, or even Swisher, I will listen. But Walker, Franklin and VCat for Upton is too much. Allen Craig would cost too much. Choo would be a good idea, but he may not resign after his one year.

    We can sign Hamilton and still lower payroll from last year.

    Anyway, who do you want us to trade for (realistically)?
    i just dreamed this up..dont know how realistic... figgy, ack, smoak to minny for morneau and doumit. or for choo...

    ive talked to JAC, he thinks smoak and ackley are buy low (meaning not get a starter back), but id like to think we can find a sucker who sees upside.... if we can find that sucker and get a MOTO bat and keep our pitching that is in the farm loaded i think would be fantastic.

    guys id like to trade for, choo, corey hart, morales (could be had but would cost us more), francouer, doumit, morneau, tyler moore, tyler colvin, michael morse, garrett jones, jason kubel, adam lind. id love to get quentin but prolly not realistic or safe at all.

    johnny peralta, chris nelson, kevin youkilis, daniel murphy, lahair, travis snyder.


    i think these teams would listen to offers for these guys and would like to think as far as pitching prospects (which GMZ and I love), dont think we'd have to go higher than paxton, some of these guys not even that much...not that all are excellent MOTO bats but are upgrades ya know....guys to dangle, vargas, beavan, ackley, smoak, guti(:cry, V-Cat, triunfel, kinney, capps, pryor, luetge, noesi.

    guys with higher value id spend more on (hultzen prolly)headley, ike davis

    id pursue rizzo, lawrie on maybe a hultzen ++, or walker deal....

    of course these guys all have reasons that stand in the way of making sense for both parties but i think its realistic enough, and good names to start a conversation.
    Last edited by Rain City; 10-16-2012 at 10:07 PM.

  11. #86
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    Why would we trade Ackley and Smoak for a year of Morneau and Doumit? Don't see the point of that at all

    Problem with the others is their contracts. We need someone with some years left. Over half of them are on one year deals.

    Francouer didn't hit at all this year.

    I like Morse, but once again, only one year left. If we can guarantee a re-up with us, Id go Paxton and Miller/VCat.
    You have no idea how excited I am right now.


  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by jej View Post
    Why would we trade Ackley and Smoak for a year of Morneau and Doumit? Don't see the point of that at all

    Problem with the others is their contracts. We need someone with some years left. Over half of them are on one year deals.

    Francouer didn't hit at all this year.

    I like Morse, but once again, only one year left. If we can guarantee a re-up with us, Id go Paxton and Miller/VCat.
    did u miss we unload figgy, and obviously i dont like ackley or smoak.... the universe seems to really want us to stay a 4th place team at least 1 more year... next year's FA class has much more hitters for us...

    why cant we go the NBA route with trades, offer a trade contingent on an extension. is that allowed? than these deals will start making better sense.

    but if we get hamilton... i know big iff.... why not deal one of these bumbs for 1 year of a much better, albeit older and expensive player... all in baby!!

  13. #88
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    Because we arent going to contend next year anyway. You dont give up someone who could help in your future when you will compete for someone that will help you in a season where you cant win anyway.

    Ackley and Smoak for Morneau would be us getting fleeced. Cant believe you are that done with Ack after one bad season. Good thing you werent in charge of handling Saunders.

    Just cut Figgins if the other alternative is a ****** trade. Get him off the payroll. He wants out anyway. Tell him we will pay you half to get the **** outta town.
    You have no idea how excited I am right now.


  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by jej View Post
    Because we arent going to contend next year anyway. You dont give up someone who could help in your future when you will compete for someone that will help you in a season where you cant win anyway.

    Ackley and Smoak for Morneau would be us getting fleeced. Cant believe you are that done with Ack after one bad season. Good thing you werent in charge of handling Saunders.

    Just cut Figgins if the other alternative is a ****** trade. Get him off the payroll. He wants out anyway. Tell him we will pay you half to get the **** outta town.
    i was half talkin out my ace regarding the minny trade idea... u are forgetting that the minny fanbase would start a revolution over that deal. trading a 5 and 6 hitter for shitonastick and 2 failing not prospects anymore. morneau is a former MVP legend there... a fantasy would be finding a taker for figgy and seeing morneau in Ms uni, but this kinda deal is unrealistic.

    coming off this year, the way i see it with ackley, optimistically we are lookin at .255 15hrs, 15sbs, .315OB%, maybe + D.... u can find close to that in FA.

    i think ack's 2nd half was sub .280 OB% and this was supposed to be his strength.... all this adds up to he has no trade value anyways so we just cross our fingers, but i hope we have the balls to bench him after 40 games if there isnt improvement.

    good point about saunders, he was garbage for a loooong time, i thought we were overly patient.... he had a rebound year and his career avg is still .220... but saunders is a superior athlete, better 4 out of 5 tools (if not all 5). i love saunders now.

    lets talk trades that actually could make sense and benefit us.

    and we are one FA sig away from being able to contend this year
    Last edited by Rain City; 10-17-2012 at 01:16 AM.

  15. #90
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    Ackley still has some value. But neither team would or Gould do that trade. This was Monrneaus first full year in a couple years. He hasn't been great since 2010. He is 31 and would be a rental. He doesn't help us at all.

    I don't buy that one bat gets us to contention yet. Close, but not there yet. If all the young guys play like they can, then maybe. But the chances of that are slim. I think we still got another year of being in 4th before we start moving up.
    You have no idea how excited I am right now.


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