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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by jay87shot View Post
    Im going to have to disagree on the proven bullpen arm theory. Relievers can have bad years but if you look at a guy who has a bad inning and works 60 innings in a year his era can go up a half run. Also there are plenty of proven relievers on the market in my opinion. There is no such thing as a sure thing but I think there are a lot of guys who can be solid over a 2 year contract. In my opinion no reliever sould be giving more than 2 years at a time. Here's some guys I would be confident in signing to reasonable deals as relievers.

    Johnathan Broxton, Joakim Soria, Brett Myers, Ryan Madsen, Mike Adams, Juan Carlos Aviedo, Koji Uehera, Kyuji Fukikawa (probably), Sean Burnett, Joel Peralta, Jeremy Affeldt, and there are probably a couple starters that could move to the pen and do a good job.(I left Soriano becuase he will cost to much for sure)Jason Grilli, Matt Lindstrom, and Juan Cruz could potentially be added

    If it were me I would spend around 10-12 million on the list above hopefully get 2 guys. Then look at some guys who could potentially battle for a spot and would come cheap. Guys like
    Kyle Farnsworth, Joey Devine, Brad Penny, and a couple other starters
    I guess I'll take my shot at refuting this statement. First off, I'm going to remove Broxton and Soria from my argument. Although closers can be very fickle, I will say that if there is any sort of somewhat proven arm, it usually isn't a closer. I still view those two as closers, or of closer quality if that makes sense.

    So onto the next couple dudes, Myers has mainly been a reliever for 2 years in his career, one of which was a 3.31 ERA, the other a 4.33. I will give you that Mike Adams has been consistently good as a reliever throughout his post-Brewers career (although his numbers aren't trending in the right direction.) Jaun Carlos Oviedo has been upper 3s and lower 4s for his last couple year ERAs, which isn't that spectacular. I look at Juan Cruz's career numbers and see enough 7s and 5s sprinkled in to not at all be surprised if he finished next year in the 5s as well. Joel Peralta's recent career ERAs are 6, 6, 2, 3, 3.5. Those really aren't super consistent, and he's no spring chicken. And is his .5 WAR worth the almost 3 million he made last season?

    I just kind of picked a couple dudes out of that list because I didn't want to look them all up. I appreciate the list, and some of those guys are more consistent than I gave them credit for, but I still am not sold on them really being proven. I don't think there's any way to sign a couple of these guys to probably semi-inflated salaries and say that we'll for sure have a top 5-10 bullpen. There's just too much volatility in my mind.

  2. #47
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    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDCballa View Post
    We'll out score em then.
    Yes because that worked so well for Texas and Detroit over the past few years. Worked well for Milwaukee too in '09 right? We were already the number 1 offense in the NL last year...

    Quote Originally Posted by jay87shot View Post
    If we sign Hamilton we will be looking at a drought less playoff streak that last a while you can say goodbye to all our young talent. Off course there is a chance we could sign him but there is a chance every team could sign him. There will be 5 or 6 teams that have the money that will make him good offers.

    From what I read writers have said that if Hamilton doesn't get any thing longer than 4 years or 100 million the brewers have a shot. 4 yrs 90 mil might get the brewers in on him but that will also get a bunch of other teams that he would probably prefer to go to. No doubt our offense would be B.A. but our pen would be worst than this year if that is imaginable (on paper at least).

    I like our young pitchers but I don't have a ton of faith in Rogers, Estrada,and Fiers to be better than last year. We really need a reliable arm at the top of the rotation. Also there is room for the offense to improve if Weeks is more consistent, LuCroy stays healthy, and Segura lives up to his potential.
    I know I'm not ownership or management, but I would be straight up pissed if we gave Hamilton 22.5 per year over the next 4 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by MU and UW Fan View Post
    Didn't we learn from 2009, that all offense is just not going to work. Is our starting pitching better than 2009, of course. But I'm not willing to bet it all on all these young guys. Are guys like Peralta, Fiers, Rogers, etc just a flash in the pan, how many innings can they pitch, are they for real or just having success when they first get up there and then when hitters figure them out how good will they be, happens all the time. Remember in 2008 when Parra was doing good as a starter, then looked what happened after he had been in the majors for a while. You just never know. Sign 1, maybe 2 starters. Definitely get a few arms in the bullpen, and a few bench guys. Thats where the money should be going, not Josh Hamilton.
    Good post.
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dcup View Post
    Yes because that worked so well for Texas and Detroit over the past few years. Worked well for Milwaukee too in '09 right? We were already the number 1 offense in the NL last year...



    I know I'm not ownership or management, but I would be straight up pissed if we gave Hamilton 22.5 per year over the next 4 years.



    Good post.
    At least Texas and Detroit got to the World Series. We haven't been there in quite some time. Would I rather spend on pitching than offense? Yes I would. But do I think the Anibal Sanchez types of the world are going to make us a World Series team? Probably not.

  4. #49
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    Man I would be irate if I was a Miami fan. They could have at least traded those guys out in pieces and got more back. I would have loved to see Buerhle or Bonifacio on the brewers. We could have parted with a couple good prospects to get either one.

    About the reliever stuff, I dont think that a 4 era is a down year. It depends when those runs are given up. Most relievers have some issues but I would rather spend the cash on a couple guys who have had a couple good years in a row (recently).

    Agreed that Anibel Sanchez or any of the starters make us contenders. But one of those guys a improved pen and the young arms contributing will.
    Last edited by jay87shot; 11-15-2012 at 04:08 PM.

  5. #50
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    That Marlins trade was probably for the best. They were terrible with those players. They shed some salary and got some good young players.

    I think it was a smart move by the Marlins. If I was a fan of the team I'd be super pissed, but the decisions they made last offseason when they signed those guys were bad decisions to begin with.

  6. #51
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    3 yrs 21 million to Jon Broxton and Madson signed a 1 yr deal with the angels. I think the Broxton deal is ok at least it is reasonable, back loaded. If Broxton is 7 million that kind of sets the market in my mind and there should be enough guys at the 4ish range that could make a difference in the pen.

  7. #52
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    The orioles reportedly have interest in kameron loe.

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    Good

  9. #54
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    I think we can finally put an end to the Hamilton speculation. 5yrs 75 for Upton is ridiculous, the guy hasn't hit .250 in four years. There is no doubting that he is talented but in my opinion Hamilton is worth at least twice as much as Upton. I think this guarantees that Hamilton will get about 25 million for at least 5 years. I would rank Shane Victorino and Michael Bourne as better center fielders. I think Upton is about on the Carlos Gomez level.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by jay87shot View Post
    I think we can finally put an end to the Hamilton speculation. 5yrs 75 for Upton is ridiculous, the guy hasn't hit .250 in four years. There is no doubting that he is talented but in my opinion Hamilton is worth at least twice as much as Upton. I think this guarantees that Hamilton will get about 25 million for at least 5 years. I would rank Shane Victorino and Michael Bourne as better center fielders. I think Upton is about on the Carlos Gomez level.
    I was thinking the same thing today. It there's a team out there willing to give Upton that kind of money, I would guess there's a team out there that will give Hamilton big money.

  11. #56
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    Two teams are not out of the bidding in the Braves and the Nationals as the Nationals have traded for Span. The Brewers may end up being the only ones there to offer him, as a place that he would want to go to.

  12. #57
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    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/1...rade+Rumors%29

    just to clear up any speculation as to weather or not we actually have interest in him.
    Milwaukee Brewers
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  13. #58
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    Parra has been non tendered. Probably were trying to trade him and couldn't get a bite.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDCballa View Post
    Two teams are not out of the bidding in the Braves and the Nationals as the Nationals have traded for Span. The Brewers may end up being the only ones there to offer him, as a place that he would want to go to.
    I think the Rangers will still bid on him at the very least. I know that dont' want to super break the bank for him, but I would guess whatever we offer wouldn't really be considered breaking the bank for him. I've heard rumors that the Phillies may be considering him too.

  15. #60
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    Dcup is offline In loving memory..Hawkeye
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    Raul Mondesi Jr. for Burke Badenhop...via Twitter...

    30 year old right handed reliever. Nice start.
    If I facepalmed any harder I would have cracked my own skull.

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