Ryan Kesler singled out as diver in NHL’s crackdown on embellishment

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But if he's healthy, why would you want to trade him? If he's healthy, he's presumably a 25+ goal scorer, 60ish points, and is one of the best defensive players in the league. I guess that would depend on what you mean by "healthy enough".

Because the team we have now simply isn't good enough to win and badly needs a shakeup. I've used this example before: if you have ever followed the Blue Jays or MLB of the 90s, they traded quality to get quality by turning Fred McGriff and Tony Fernandez into Joe Carter and Robbie Alomar, two guys that ended up pushing the Jays over the hump to win two World Series. Today's Canucks are like the late 80s-early 90s Jays; they have been at the top of the league for a while and completely unable to seal the deal and win a Cup. With a gutsy, smart trade they could turn this team into a champion. What they lack is scoring and leadership; Kesler provides neither really, but is still highly regarded as an effective two-way forward. IMO it's easier to replace a guy like him than it is to replace a highly skilled scorer. Lots of people will say that toughness is the Canucks' issue and that may be partly true, but the biggest problem is that they VASTLY over-rate their talent once you get past the Sedins.

Trade quality (Kesler) for quality and this team could be turned into a champion. It's not that far off.

Don't they say that a sign of insanity is repeating the same mistakes over and over without learning anything from them? Well, staying at status quo with this roster is my idea of insanity. Unless of course you don't really care about winning a Stanley Cup during your best window of opportunity.

[CubbieKid17]

Because the team we have now simply isn't good enough to win and badly needs a shakeup. I've used this example before: if you have ever followed the Blue Jays or MLB of the 90s, they traded quality to get quality by turning Fred McGriff and Tony Fernandez into Joe Carter and Robbie Alomar, two guys that ended up pushing the Jays over the hump to win two World Series. Today's Canucks are like the late 80s-early 90s Jays; they have been at the top of the league for a while and completely unable to seal the deal and win a Cup. With a gutsy, smart trade they could turn this team into a champion. What they lack is scoring and leadership; Kesler provides neither really, but is still highly regarded as an effective two-way forward. IMO it's easier to replace a guy like him than it is to replace a highly skilled scorer. Lots of people will say that toughness is the Canucks' issue and that may be partly true, but the biggest problem is that they VASTLY over-rate their talent once you get past the Sedins.

Trade quality (Kesler) for quality and this team could be turned into a champion. It's not that far off.

Don't they say that a sign of insanity is repeating the same mistakes over and over without learning anything from them? Well, staying at status quo with this roster is my idea of insanity. Unless of course you don't really care about winning a Stanley Cup during your best window of opportunity.

I don't think holding onto Kesler is insanity. There's other ways to improve the team without having to trade him. Like I've said already, if you guys got Doan, I think that would've been you over the hump. I guess it does make sense to trade him if you can get a player that puts you over the hump. But you don't trade him just for the sake of change.

Who do you trade him for? What kind of player(s) do you look for in return? Also, who takes over as the 2nd line C? These are questions that need to be answered if you want any kind of chance at winning a Cup. The year the Hawks won the Cup, they had depth, they had big bodies in front of the net, they had bottom line players with lots of heart, they had a solid goalie, and they had effective PP and PK units.

I'm interested to see what teams and what kind of players you'd be looking at in a possible Kesler trade.

Edit: I realize you're not saying to trade him just to trade him.

[carson005]

I'll jump in and say that Kesler used to be one of my favorite players (him being American meant more to me than him being a Canuck). That has changed over the last 2 years.

I used to have him in a category of guys like Toews, D. Brown, M. Richards, and others who just flat out played the game right and never took a shift off. They played the game right offensively and defensively. They were leaders and they did everything they could to win. I still think that Kesler's empty net goal against Canada a couple years ago was one of the best goals I have ever seen...yes, an empty netter. He scored it because of hard work and just complete determination and will.

I really hope that Kesler figures it out and gets back to form. He used to be one of those players that you would tell an up and coming player (whether it be a mite, major mite, squirt, etc) that they should watch on the ice. No more.

Dustin Brown was diving during the whole cup run...it was pathetic

[CubbieKid17]

Dustin Brown was diving during the whole cup run...it was pathetic

And he got called for it on a play where he didn't dive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaFNN...feature=fvwrel

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I don't think holding onto Kesler is insanity.

Remember, I didn't say holding onto Kesler is insanity; I said that staying with the status quo in Vancouver is insane. My point was that you give up quality (Kesler) to get quality, and I gave the example of how a two-time World Series champ was created when a GM had the chutzpah to trade two all-stars for two DIFFERENT all-stars. A trade is not always just to get rid of someone; a trade is about improving your team no matter what. It's a moot point now though unless Kesler is healthy and productive.

[CubbieKid17]

Remember, I didn't say holding onto Kesler is insanity; I said that staying with the status quo in Vancouver is insane. My point was that you give up quality (Kesler) to get quality, and I gave the example of how a two-time World Series champ was created when a GM had the chutzpah to trade two all-stars for two DIFFERENT all-stars. A trade is not always just to get rid of someone; a trade is about improving your team no matter what. It's a moot point now though unless Kesler is healthy and productive.

I get that. If Kesler is healthy and productive, what do you guys think the return would be like in a trade? I'd have to imagine a team like the Maple Leafs that could use a big-time C would be interested. Several other teams would be interested as well. He's still decently young at 28, so plenty of time to get healthy and put up a big year to regain his trade value.

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I get that. If Kesler is healthy and productive, what do you guys think the return would be like in a trade? I'd have to imagine a team like the Maple Leafs that could use a big-time C would be interested. Several other teams would be interested as well. He's still decently young at 28, so plenty of time to get healthy and put up a big year to regain his trade value.

tbh he would be hard to replace but sometimes a player just needs a change of scenery. Until Hodgson was traded last year we had the heir apparent for the 2nd line C position, but he would have been a completely different type of player. I don't think Kesler's D is irreplaceable btw, it's a trait that others bring to the table. I liked the second line playmaking potential of Hodgson. A couple of years ago when Gillis was going hard after Backes I liked the potential there too. We don't have the depth at centre any longer to have the luxury to move Kesler. If Anaheim has a fire sale and Getzlaf somehow becomes available, or Gillis somehow steals Huberdeau from FLA for Luongo we would be in business.

[CubbieKid17]

tbh he would be hard to replace but sometimes a player just needs a change of scenery. Until Hodgson was traded last year we had the heir apparent for the 2nd line C position, but he would have been a completely different type of player. I don't think Kesler's D is irreplaceable btw, it's a trait that others bring to the table. I liked the second line playmaking potential of Hodgson. A couple of years ago when Gillis was going hard after Backes I liked the potential there too. We don't have the depth at centre any longer to have the luxury to move Kesler. If Anaheim has a fire sale and Getzlaf somehow becomes available, or Gillis somehow steals Huberdeau from FLA for Luongo we would be in business.

He'd be a great fit for you guys. I love the way he plays the game. He's a guy I'd like the Hawks to go after if he becomes available. Right now, the best move I think you guys could make (while keeping Kesler because of his D) would be for either a top-4 defenseman or a guy like a Shane Doan, who's got good size, hits, and is a leader. Also, I highly doubt Huberdeau would be involved in any Luongo trade. The Panthers have Jacob Markstrom in the AHL who I think can be their goalie for the next 5-10 years. Tbh, I'm kind of surprised that they want him to play in the AHL for another year. I think he's close to ready, provided he can stay healthy.