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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by lucastai View Post
    You were basically writing him off as a SS. hence the tone. however, you can clean yourself up a bit as well buddy. By the way, having a picture of a girl on your profile doesn't make you seem "cool" or "in" like you may think. It makes you look like a 14 year old boy. Wouldn't be surprised if you are. I think its bedtime.
    Hey pal, you've got only 13 freakin' posts. So unless you're actually some previously banned poster under a new name, stop acting line you know people around here!!!

  2. #77
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    stop acting like you have friends?! please.

  3. #78
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    This is getting ridiculous. Ignored.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by lucastai View Post
    You were basically writing him off as a SS.
    Yeah I am basically writing him off as a SS, because scouts that know more about him than either of us, say he's not going to be a SS. Go on and find what position MLB players were playing at age 18 (whatever level) - SS will be the easy #1 since prime athletes are put at SS (and Coaches that have sons put them there as well in earlier years). Most of them do not play serious time or any time at SS in MLB.
    Last edited by bagwell368; 09-25-2012 at 08:15 AM.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  5. #80
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    Why don't they just make Lavernway the 1b? He has been playing 1st/dh/C in AAA. He can concentrate on hitting and not worry about the play calling as a catcher (which he is horrible at). Plus we can actually get a FA catcher to help Salty or trade Salty + Aceves for a P or OF.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolf82 View Post
    Why don't they just make Lavernway the 1b? He has been playing 1st/dh/C in AAA. He can concentrate on hitting and not worry about the play calling as a catcher (which he is horrible at). Plus we can actually get a FA catcher to help Salty or trade Salty + Aceves for a P or OF.
    Lavarnway is liable not to be a special hitter at 1B. He is likely to be at C. His arm is already a plus. His play calling can be controlled by the bench - although he doesn't seem incurable in the least at this point.

    I understand the concept of keeping Salty and signing a FA. But if Salty is traded and Lavarnway goes to 1B, we now need two catchers.

    I expect Lavarnway to get at least another 120 games at catcher before he's labeled a failure, maybe a good deal more.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Lavarnway is liable not to be a special hitter at 1B. He is likely to be at C. His arm is already a plus. His play calling can be controlled by the bench - although he doesn't seem incurable in the least at this point.

    I understand the concept of keeping Salty and signing a FA. But if Salty is traded and Lavarnway goes to 1B, we now need two catchers.

    I expect Lavarnway to get at least another 120 games at catcher before he's labeled a failure, maybe a good deal more.

    I don't see Lavernway as our future catcher. They been working with him in AAA for a couple of years, but he still hasn't made the leap they have been expecting. They even had him play DH/1b in AAA as a back up if he doesn't make that step soon. Maybe they are just trying to give him experience/boost in confidence playing him now. But, I see him as a DH or a 1B.

    I understand he has a strong arm, but if he can't call a game and don't have the confidence from the pitching staff, he won't be a good catcher.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolf82 View Post
    I don't see Lavernway as our future catcher. They been working with him in AAA for a couple of years, but he still hasn't made the leap they have been expecting. They even had him play DH/1b in AAA as a back up if he doesn't make that step soon. Maybe they are just trying to give him experience/boost in confidence playing him now. But, I see him as a DH or a 1B.

    I understand he has a strong arm, but if he can't call a game and don't have the confidence from the pitching staff, he won't be a good catcher.
    Maybe you don't know Lavarnway's backround. When he was at Yale leading D1 NCAA in BA and SLG a couple of years he played RF. He didn't play any catcher at any level until a few games his last year in Yale in 2008.

    Lavarnway was in AAA parts of two years totaling 144 games - "working with him in AAA" seems to be a bit of an over statement.

    Perhaps your data is old?

    Red Sox’ Ryan Lavarnway learns art of catching - by Abraham (about 10 days ago)

    ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. — Ryan Lavarnway was hitless in four at-bats against the Tampa Bay Rays Monday night, striking out twice. Yet it was one of the more satisfying games of his career.
    Related

    Righthander Aaron Cook had his best start in weeks, holding the Rays to one run over six innings. Lavarnway took more pride in that than he would have in hitting a home run.

    “That was a fun game,” said the Red Sox rookie catcher. “Aaron was really pitching. We had it going pretty well there.”

    At 25, Lavarnway is at that stage in his career where the art of calling a game is less of a mystery and more of a science. With each inning behind the plate, Lavarnway’s confidence grows, and the idea that he could become the team’s everyday catcher becomes more viable.

    It was not a natural evolution. Lavarnway was drafted as a catcher in 2008 after playing several positions at Yale, and it wasn’t until this season that he became a full-time catcher.

    For four years, Lavarnway split time with other catchers while working his way through the minor leagues. Many of his at-bats came as a designated hitter.

    But Lavarnway caught 80 games for Triple A Pawtucket and has started behind the plate 20 times for the Red Sox with 13 left to play. For the first time, he knows the physical rigors of a full season behind the plate and the mental test of working with a pitching staff.

    “I learned how to call a game from Kevin Millwood last year in Triple A,” Lavarnway said. “Him and Brandon Duckworth. I was like a young deer in the woods and they knew what they were doing.

    “Millwood really took me under his wing and we spent a lot of time together off the field. That was the first time I really was taught an advanced approach to calling a game.”

    For a developing catcher, those were good teachers. Millwood, 37, has spent 19 seasons in professional baseball with nine organizations and won 169 games in the majors. He started 13 games for Pawtucket in 2011.

    Duckworth, 36, was with Pawtucket for two seasons and pitched in 39 games before signing with the Tohoku Rakuten Golden Eagles in the Japanese Pacific League.

    “Millwood is a guy with 16 years in the big leagues,” said Lavarnway. “He’s thrown so many pitches. I had a lot to learn from him. He’s not going to out-stuff hitters, he’s going to out-locate and outsmart them.

    “A lot of it has to do with how a hitter reacts to a previous pitch, how your pitcher is reacting, what his intentions are. There’s a lot that goes into game-calling when a guy doesn’t have unbelievable stuff.”

    With the Red Sox, Lavarnway has dealt with a variety of pitchers. Cook, who throws predominately sinkers with an occasional cutter, is at one end of the spectrum. He rarely records a strikeout.

    Cook has to be handled differently than somebody like Jon Lester, whose velocity and movement can overmatch any hitter.

    “Ryan takes a lot of pride in it and I feel like he’s picked it up quicker than some young catchers I’ve seen in the past,” Cook said. “I think he’s handled the pitching staff pretty well.

    “He’s good at talking to us and asking us what we want to do on a certain day and incorporating that into the scouting report. I think he has a pretty good feel for what is going on during the game, too.”

    Said Lavarnway, “A guy who throws 97 and has a crazy curve*ball doesn’t have to pitch. He can throw. It’s great when you get both. A guy like Jon Lester has great stuff and he can really pitch.

    “But you don’t see both too often. That’s why you have to learn how to call a game and give your pitcher the best chance to succeed.”

    As the Red Sox play out the remaining games in a losing season, one of the few positives is giving a player such as Lavarnway more experience with the major league staff.

    “That relationship takes time,” said manager Bobby Valentine. “I don’t think it’s magical. For [Lavarnway], it’s very good working with the different pitchers that we have.”

    Jarrod Saltalamacchia, the regular catcher for most of this season, said John Smoltz was a great influence on him during his rookie year with the Atlanta Braves in 2007. When Saltalamacchia was traded to Texas, it was Millwood, coincidentally, who took on a mentor’s role.

    “It’s different once you get to the majors, because the pitchers are better and you have a lot of information to process,” Saltalamacchia said. “For a young catcher, having a veteran pitcher teach you is incredibly valuable.”

    Lavarnway was the DH against the Rays Tuesday. He went into the game hitting .155 with two home runs and seven RBIs in 103 at-bats. But those statistics do not concern him.

    “I’ve always hit,” he said. “My focus this season was to take my defense to the next level. I put a lot of time and effort into that.”

    Lavarnway, who had two hits and two RBIs in Tuesday night’s 7-5 win, is a career .286 hitter in the minors with an .882 OPS. His future in the organization will be more tied to whether he is a capable catcher. That Lavarnway was selected as the best defensive catcher in the International League was a good sign. So are the games he has been catching in recent weeks.

    “I’m comfortable with Ryan behind the plate,” Cook said. “That’s probably the best compliment I can give him.”


    He might end up being a back-up catcher with time at 1B or DH, but over the next 5 years I doubt he becomes a full time DH and/or Catcher.
    Last edited by bagwell368; 09-25-2012 at 09:28 PM.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    Maybe you don't know Lavarnway's backround. When he was at Yale leading D1 NCAA in BA and SLG a couple of years he played RF. He didn't play any catcher at any level until a few games his last year in Yale in 2008.

    Lavarnway was in AAA parts of two years totaling 144 games - "working with him in AAA" seems to be a bit of an over statement.

    Perhaps your data is old?

    Red Sox’ Ryan Lavarnway learns art of catching - by Abraham (about 10 days ago)

    ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. — Ryan Lavarnway was hitless in four at-bats against the Tampa Bay Rays Monday night, striking out twice. Yet it was one of the more satisfying games of his career.
    Related

    Righthander Aaron Cook had his best start in weeks, holding the Rays to one run over six innings. Lavarnway took more pride in that than he would have in hitting a home run.

    “That was a fun game,” said the Red Sox rookie catcher. “Aaron was really pitching. We had it going pretty well there.”

    At 25, Lavarnway is at that stage in his career where the art of calling a game is less of a mystery and more of a science. With each inning behind the plate, Lavarnway’s confidence grows, and the idea that he could become the team’s everyday catcher becomes more viable.

    It was not a natural evolution. Lavarnway was drafted as a catcher in 2008 after playing several positions at Yale, and it wasn’t until this season that he became a full-time catcher.

    For four years, Lavarnway split time with other catchers while working his way through the minor leagues. Many of his at-bats came as a designated hitter.

    But Lavarnway caught 80 games for Triple A Pawtucket and has started behind the plate 20 times for the Red Sox with 13 left to play. For the first time, he knows the physical rigors of a full season behind the plate and the mental test of working with a pitching staff.

    “I learned how to call a game from Kevin Millwood last year in Triple A,” Lavarnway said. “Him and Brandon Duckworth. I was like a young deer in the woods and they knew what they were doing.

    “Millwood really took me under his wing and we spent a lot of time together off the field. That was the first time I really was taught an advanced approach to calling a game.”

    For a developing catcher, those were good teachers. Millwood, 37, has spent 19 seasons in professional baseball with nine organizations and won 169 games in the majors. He started 13 games for Pawtucket in 2011.

    Duckworth, 36, was with Pawtucket for two seasons and pitched in 39 games before signing with the Tohoku Rakuten Golden Eagles in the Japanese Pacific League.

    “Millwood is a guy with 16 years in the big leagues,” said Lavarnway. “He’s thrown so many pitches. I had a lot to learn from him. He’s not going to out-stuff hitters, he’s going to out-locate and outsmart them.

    “A lot of it has to do with how a hitter reacts to a previous pitch, how your pitcher is reacting, what his intentions are. There’s a lot that goes into game-calling when a guy doesn’t have unbelievable stuff.”

    With the Red Sox, Lavarnway has dealt with a variety of pitchers. Cook, who throws predominately sinkers with an occasional cutter, is at one end of the spectrum. He rarely records a strikeout.

    Cook has to be handled differently than somebody like Jon Lester, whose velocity and movement can overmatch any hitter.

    “Ryan takes a lot of pride in it and I feel like he’s picked it up quicker than some young catchers I’ve seen in the past,” Cook said. “I think he’s handled the pitching staff pretty well.

    “He’s good at talking to us and asking us what we want to do on a certain day and incorporating that into the scouting report. I think he has a pretty good feel for what is going on during the game, too.”

    Said Lavarnway, “A guy who throws 97 and has a crazy curve*ball doesn’t have to pitch. He can throw. It’s great when you get both. A guy like Jon Lester has great stuff and he can really pitch.

    “But you don’t see both too often. That’s why you have to learn how to call a game and give your pitcher the best chance to succeed.”

    As the Red Sox play out the remaining games in a losing season, one of the few positives is giving a player such as Lavarnway more experience with the major league staff.

    “That relationship takes time,” said manager Bobby Valentine. “I don’t think it’s magical. For [Lavarnway], it’s very good working with the different pitchers that we have.”

    Jarrod Saltalamacchia, the regular catcher for most of this season, said John Smoltz was a great influence on him during his rookie year with the Atlanta Braves in 2007. When Saltalamacchia was traded to Texas, it was Millwood, coincidentally, who took on a mentor’s role.

    “It’s different once you get to the majors, because the pitchers are better and you have a lot of information to process,” Saltalamacchia said. “For a young catcher, having a veteran pitcher teach you is incredibly valuable.”

    Lavarnway was the DH against the Rays Tuesday. He went into the game hitting .155 with two home runs and seven RBIs in 103 at-bats. But those statistics do not concern him.

    “I’ve always hit,” he said. “My focus this season was to take my defense to the next level. I put a lot of time and effort into that.”

    Lavarnway, who had two hits and two RBIs in Tuesday night’s 7-5 win, is a career .286 hitter in the minors with an .882 OPS. His future in the organization will be more tied to whether he is a capable catcher. That Lavarnway was selected as the best defensive catcher in the International League was a good sign. So are the games he has been catching in recent weeks.

    “I’m comfortable with Ryan behind the plate,” Cook said. “That’s probably the best compliment I can give him.”


    He might end up being a back-up catcher with time at 1B or DH, but over the next 5 years I doubt he becomes a full time DH and/or Catcher.

    Wow.....I feel like bagwell is the bus.....and I just got taken to school. lol

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post

    He might end up being a back-up catcher with time at 1B or DH, but over the next 5 years I doubt he becomes a full time DH and/or Catcher.
    This wont happen next year, but could you see him becoming our 1B going forward?

    A lot is tied to his bat, but if he can hit 280 and walk 10%+ of the time like he did in the minors, then he will be a very productive player regardless of position. I would also think he would be a good fielding 1B since his is able to at least handle playing catcher. I could see him having something like a .280/.360/.500 line playing a less stressful defensive position.

  11. #86
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    Bagwell you seriously have too much time on your hands to be getting things wrong.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nomar_RA View Post
    This wont happen next year, but could you see him becoming our 1B going forward?

    A lot is tied to his bat, but if he can hit 280 and walk 10%+ of the time like he did in the minors, then he will be a very productive player regardless of position. I would also think he would be a good fielding 1B since his is able to at least handle playing catcher. I could see him having something like a .280/.360/.500 line playing a less stressful defensive position.
    After he gets his 1500 pro PA's, I'd expect a .265/.335/.485 hitter. That's very nice for a catcher, meh for a 1B. Funny... I wrote that before getting to your slash. In the AL my slash would be maybe a 102 OPS+ at 1B or a 127 at catcher.

    He's got meH foot speed, so he's never going to be good range wise - at any position.

    He's going to get every chance to make it as a catcher. If he fails, we'll see.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by lucastai View Post
    Bagwell you seriously have too much time on your hands to be getting things wrong.
    I'm that rare retired 14 year old. I'll put the correctness of my posts up vs yours any day of the week - so far you have screwed up the meaning of the term "up the middle" and have lost control while you rant about XB staying at SS - even though it is universally believed that he will.

    Great start...
    Last edited by bagwell368; 09-25-2012 at 10:02 PM.


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagwell368 View Post
    After he gets his 1500 pro PA's, I'd expect a .265/.335/.485 hitter. That's very nice for a catcher, meh for a 1B. Funny... I wrote that before getting to your slash. In the AL my slash would be maybe a 102 OPS+ at 1B or a 127 at catcher.

    He's got meH foot speed, so he's never going to be good range wise - at any position.

    He's going to get every chance to make it as a catcher. If he fails, we'll see.
    Yeah, i was banking on a bit better of a slash in a less physically taxing position. The main difference in our slashes was that i thought he would walk a bit more than you do (i would edit my post to a .270 BA, don't know what i was thinking there). Thats hard to project anyways though.

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nomar_RA View Post
    Yeah, i was banking on a bit better of a slash in a less physically taxing position. The main difference in our slashes was that i thought he would walk a bit more than you do (i would edit my post to a .270 BA, don't know what i was thinking there). Thats hard to project anyways though.
    If Lavarnway didn't catch at all, then I'd be higher on the slash, something like: .270/.340/.510 - which is right were you are.

    Lavarnway has too many holes in his swing for a high BA, and still can't seem to see the difference (until it's too late) between a 2 seam, cutter, and split; he's also fishes outside too much. He needs to calm down and start picking out his areas, and be content to take strikes on balls he can't reach/hit.

    He'll probably end up as a powerful mistake hitter, that sees mostly breaking balls away - which is why his outside pitch/oppo double about 8 days ago was so nice to see. Don't have to pull everything.

    He's never going to hop out of a crouch and catch a pop at the fence half way to 1B, he's not going be good fetching passed balls/WP's in a place like MFY Stadium. But if he can catch the ball, frame the ball, call the game, and throw that ball (all things he can do or learn - his throwing is already good BTW), then what you have here is a plus catcher. If he turns out to be a wizard with the bat you get him to DH or 1B before 900 games caught so he doesn't get used up. What's the problem with that? (rhetorical).


    6/27/09: “We expect [Rondo] to play by the rules and be a leader as a point guard. We need him to be more of a leader,” Ainge said. “There were just a couple situations where he was late this year, I don’t know if he was sitting in his car, but showed up late and the rest of the team was there. We have team rules and you have to be on time. He was fined for being late, he said he was stuck in traffic, and it’s just unacceptable.”

    Some jerks never learn.....

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