QB controversy thread

[koldjerky]

I would like to see Vick fail in a system/scheme tailored to his strengths, before giving up on him.

Tell me what his strengths are? His strengths are his arm strength and his speed. I'm pretty sure the scheme has been tailored for him the past two seasons and he can't stay healthy and he holds the ball too long. After 2010 teams were able to take away the big play and get to Vick. Knocking him around gets him off his game.

[turk2875]

Are we actually talking about next years draft, when there are 13 games left in the season and our team is 2 and freaking 1. I'm not gonna sit here and pretend that the Eagles have looked good over the first 3 games, but the rest of the division hasn't looked that good either. This division is still out there for the taking and I still believe we'll win it, call me delusional. Eagles still have better records then the Patriots, Steelers, Saints, Broncos, and Lions. I think everybody here would say that those teams have better QB then Vick. So everyone calm down and let's not panic 3 games into the season.

[BDawk4Prez]

Tell me what his strengths are? His strengths are his arm strength and his speed. I'm pretty sure the scheme has been tailored for him the past two seasons and he can't stay healthy and he holds the ball too long. After 2010 teams were able to take away the big play and get to Vick. Knocking him around gets him off his game.

Short passing game. Play action. Rolling to his right. Designed runs. Use McCoy more to set up the pass.

Vick is capable, but not if he is expected to be a pocket passer.

[last stand]

Tell me what his strengths are? His strengths are his arm strength and his speed. I'm pretty sure the scheme has been tailored for him the past two seasons and he can't stay healthy and he holds the ball too long. After 2010 teams were able to take away the big play and get to Vick. Knocking him around gets him off his game.

bronson, nice

[papirico52]

Are we actually talking about next years draft, when there are 13 games left in the season and our team is 2 and freaking 1. I'm not gonna sit here and pretend that the Eagles have looked good over the first 3 games, but the rest of the division hasn't looked that good either. This division is still out there for the taking and I still believe we'll win it, call me delusional. Eagles still have better records then the Patriots, Steelers, Saints, Broncos, and Lions. I think everybody here would say that those teams have better QB then Vick. So everyone calm down and let's not panic 3 games into the season.

Who cares about the division if any other team in the playoffs can kick our ***.

[last stand]

its too early to think about foles, but let me say this, that bye week looms, if things aren't better with vick by then we may not see vick out of the bye

[BrianWestKins]

Short passing game. Play action. Rolling to his right. Designed runs. Use McCoy more to set up the pass.

Vick is capable, but not if he is expected to be a pocket passer.

Short passing game? With Vick? No, you utilize a short passing game with accurate, smart passers like Brees and Brady (and when you have receivers who fit that mold as well). We use a ton of play action already so that wouldn't be a change.. Rolling to his right would be stupid, he has a hard enough time making reads and being accurate from the pocket, rolling out to his non-throwing side would just exacerbate those problems.. Maybe we could run more, but since the beginning of time Andy Reid has passed to set up the run, and that's how this league is played nowadays anyway.

[last stand]

i think we need to put vick in the shotgun. treat him like cam newton and pray he doesn't get injured. also mccoy isn't bad at running out of the shotgun

[petski]

Short passing game? With Vick? No, you utilize a short passing game with accurate, smart passers like Brees and Brady (and when you have receivers who fit that mold as well). We use a ton of play action already so that wouldn't be a change.. Rolling to his right would be stupid, he has a hard enough time making reads and being accurate from the pocket, rolling out to his non-throwing side would just exacerbate those problems.. Maybe we could run more, but since the beginning of time Andy Reid has passed to set up the run, and that's how this league is played nowadays anyway.

Finally someone who knows Vicks strengths and weaknesses. I guess everyone doesn't pay attention to the fact the Vick is horribly inaccurate when he rolls right and tries to make a throw. I agree that we need to start throwing shorter and improve on the inside the numbers passing game, but its hard for Vick since he throws a line drive ball, unless its deep.

[BDawk4Prez]

Short passing game? With Vick? No, you utilize a short passing game with accurate, smart passers like Brees and Brady (and when you have receivers who fit that mold as well). We use a ton of play action already so that wouldn't be a change.. Rolling to his right would be stupid, he has a hard enough time making reads and being accurate from the pocket, rolling out to his non-throwing side would just exacerbate those problems.. Maybe we could run more, but since the beginning of time Andy Reid has passed to set up the run, and that's how this league is played nowadays anyway.

I meant left.

[petski]

I meant left.

What?!?!?! Vick does roll to his left. Don't start flip-flopping now. Hahahaha

[BrianWestKins]

I meant left.

But we do roll him about a fair bit to his left. You have to remember, you're essentially taking away half the field when the QB is rolling out (unless you're Vick and you throw accross your body to the other team, we don't want that), you can't do it all that often.

[Knowledge]

Short passing game? With Vick? No, you utilize a short passing game with accurate, smart passers like Brees and Brady (and when you have receivers who fit that mold as well). We use a ton of play action already so that wouldn't be a change.. Rolling to his right would be stupid, he has a hard enough time making reads and being accurate from the pocket, rolling out to his non-throwing side would just exacerbate those problems.. Maybe we could run more, but since the beginning of time Andy Reid has passed to set up the run, and that's how this league is played nowadays anyway.

This.

I'm sure their are short to intermediate options available in the plays we call for Vick but he either refuses to throw to those options or he can't recognize defenses well enough to consistently find the open man. I think it is a combination of both.

Outside of a handful of games during his eagles career, he has not consistently shown the ability to operate the short area of the field. The fact that he still can't recognize blitzes (especially secondary blitzes off the edge) hinders him from consistently doing it.

[BDawk4Prez]

What?!?!?! Vick does roll to his left. Don't start flip-flopping now. Hahahaha

I meant more designed rolls to his left to get outside the pocket.

I didn't factor in left handed and inadvertently typed right. Sue me.

[BDawk4Prez]

But we do roll him about a fair bit to his left. You have to remember, you're essentially taking away half the field when the QB is rolling out (unless you're Vick and you throw accross your body to the other team, we don't want that), you can't do it all that often.

Fair enough. I just think there is more we can do off this. Weak side screens, te drag routes, quick outs, etc. it's not a cure all by any means.