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  1. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    However, what about the following blockbuster trade with Arizona:

    Colby Rasmus
    Yunel Escobar
    Daniel Norris
    Jake Marisnick
    Sean Nolin
    Marcus Stroman

    for:

    Tyler Skaggs
    Trevor Bauer
    Justin Upton


    Is that enough talent to get 3 potential studs, not enough or sound about right? I realize Bauer and Skaggs are their top 2 prospects, but they aren't exactly short on pitching....and Upton is coming off a down year...
    That isn't nearly enough. Rasmus, Marisnick, Nolin and Stroman may net you upton. No chance Escobar and Norris net you even one of the other guys.

  2. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post

    However, what about the following blockbuster trade with Arizona:

    Colby Rasmus
    Yunel Escobar
    Daniel Norris
    Jake Marisnick
    Sean Nolin
    Marcus Stroman

    for:

    Tyler Skaggs
    Trevor Bauer
    Justin Upton


    Is that enough talent to get 3 potential studs, not enough or sound about right? I realize Bauer and Skaggs are their top 2 prospects, but they aren't exactly short on pitching....and Upton is coming off a down year...
    That's the definition of quantity over quality there

  3. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    I think Adam Eaton would be a better acquisition if we are looking to get a potential lead off hitter from Arizona. Parra was solid in 2011 (won a GG and had an OBP of .357), but he isn't a speedster, he doesn't walk much, and he doesn't hit for any power whatsoever.

    Eaton posted an OBP over .380 and walked 14 times with only 15 K's in 103 PA's this year in Sept his first look at the pro's. He also beat up the PCL this year over 562 PA's putting up a slash line of .381/.456/.539 with 46 doubles and 38 SB's. I realize those are PCL stats, but he hit .300 with an OBP over .400 at every single level along the way (.450+ everywhere but AA in 2011 ) and rose very quickly through the ranks. He is a left handed hitter and looks like he could fit in nicely at the top of a lineup imo.

    He still has plenty of service time if we want to try him in a real AAA league in 2013, and he should cost less via trade then Parra.


    However, what about the following blockbuster trade with Arizona:

    Colby Rasmus
    Yunel Escobar
    Daniel Norris
    Jake Marisnick
    Sean Nolin
    Marcus Stroman

    for:

    Tyler Skaggs
    Trevor Bauer
    Justin Upton


    Is that enough talent to get 3 potential studs, not enough or sound about right? I realize Bauer and Skaggs are their top 2 prospects, but they aren't exactly short on pitching....and Upton is coming off a down year...
    And yet they'd give em up for two replacement level big leaguers making ~9M combined and a handful of significantly worse prospects. Oh and toss in J-Up for good measure of course. Wow.
    2013

  4. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2009mvp View Post
    And yet they'd give em up for two replacement level big leaguers making ~9M combined and a handful of significantly worse prospects. Oh and toss in J-Up for good measure of course. Wow.
    I don't hawk over those prospect lists as some other people here, but isn't the only player in that package that is well regarded is Marisnick, who didn't even play that well?

  5. #200
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    You have to think Stroman's got some value too, despite the suspension. But yeah, didn't mean to sound like a dick since I actually don't mind reading trade ideas even if they're not totally feasible, but that one is realllllly out there.
    2013

  6. #201
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    Not that crazy an idea Bart Simpson. I like that you are going after Skaggs, Bauer and Upton. Rework the deal to just get one of the tossers and lets see where we're at.

    I know Zona wouldn't part with Bauer or Skaggs.... but what would it take?

  7. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    I think Adam Eaton would be a better acquisition if we are looking to get a potential lead off hitter from Arizona. Parra was solid in 2011 (won a GG and had an OBP of .357), but he isn't a speedster, he doesn't walk much, and he doesn't hit for any power whatsoever.

    Eaton posted an OBP over .380 and walked 14 times with only 15 K's in 103 PA's this year in Sept his first look at the pro's. He also beat up the PCL this year over 562 PA's putting up a slash line of .381/.456/.539 with 46 doubles and 38 SB's. I realize those are PCL stats, but he hit .300 with an OBP over .400 at every single level along the way (.450+ everywhere but AA in 2011 ) and rose very quickly through the ranks. He is a left handed hitter and looks like he could fit in nicely at the top of a lineup imo.

    He still has plenty of service time if we want to try him in a real AAA league in 2013, and he should cost less via trade then Parra.


    However, what about the following blockbuster trade with Arizona:

    Colby Rasmus
    Yunel Escobar
    Daniel Norris
    Jake Marisnick
    Sean Nolin
    Marcus Stroman

    for:

    Tyler Skaggs
    Trevor Bauer
    Justin Upton


    Is that enough talent to get 3 potential studs, not enough or sound about right? I realize Bauer and Skaggs are their top 2 prospects, but they aren't exactly short on pitching....and Upton is coming off a down year...

    Wow....that's quite the trade! Doubt Arizona would move that much skill in one trade. They would be giving up a ton.

    I do agree Arizona and Jays match up well in a trade. They need a shortstop and have outfield and/or starting pitching to move.

    Like to get a starter...Kennedy? Offer Escobar. Maybe Oliver if he wants to move? Cecil if he doesn't...along with a prospect?

    I like Eaton's numbers...but doubt Arizona will move him without something major coming back. Probably better signing a Pagan or Pierre where we don't have to give up anything.

  8. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2009mvp View Post
    You have to think Stroman's got some value too, despite the suspension. But yeah, didn't mean to sound like a dick since I actually don't mind reading trade ideas even if they're not totally feasible, but that one is realllllly out there.
    THat's all you even get around here. Someone posts a trade idea and 20 posters say why it won't work...like they know anything. They must have predicted the Wells trade too.

    I like the trade concept....blockbuster. It does need to be tweeked a bit. Stroman or any of our 2012 picks can't get traded for 12 months or they need to be a PTBNL. You'd have to add a Lansing boy to make it fly I think.

    I just don't see why everyone loves Upton so much. I'd rather have a masher over another "5 tool" player. His numbers just don't do that much for me compared to what up would take to get him.

    I do like the ideal of getting those arms.

    What's interesting is they brought them up both at 21 and for the first times in their life...they failed. I do think it was the right thing to do but, takes trade value off them. Interesting that they have more trade value never pitching in the biggs than pitching and failing.
    Hey! It'S JoeyBatS

  9. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by town123 View Post
    Not that crazy an idea Bart Simpson. I like that you are going after Skaggs, Bauer and Upton. Rework the deal to just get one of the tossers and lets see where we're at.

    I know Zona wouldn't part with Bauer or Skaggs.... but what would it take?
    Why try and pry one of the young unproven arms away when they'd be more willing to move Ian Kennedy? He's more proven, controllable and still has upside. With the Diamondbacks needing a SS it's a perfect fit.

    To Arizona:

    SS Yunel Escobar, SP Daniel Norris, SP Deck Mcguire, SS Dickie Thon Jr.

    To Toronto:

    SP Ian Kennedy, LF/DH Jason Kubel

  10. #205
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    Not gonna propose a trade as well I'm not as familiar with the roster as some of you. However I'd like to list some players I'd like to target in trades/FA and maybe others could propose trades to get them if they agree in said players ability.

    As the Marlins I'm hearing on net are looking for another fire sale I like to target Josh Johnson and Jose Reyes. From the Mets I'd love to get Daniel Murphy and two FA's I'd target are Jake Peavy and Nick Swisher.

    Line up would be:

    Reyes
    Murphy
    Bautista
    Swisher
    Encarcion
    Lawrie
    Lind
    TDA
    Rasmus

    Johnson
    Peavy
    Morrow
    Romero
    Happ

  11. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by heusy_79 View Post
    Why try and pry one of the young unproven arms away when they'd be more willing to move Ian Kennedy? He's more proven, controllable and still has upside. With the Diamondbacks needing a SS it's a perfect fit.

    To Arizona:

    SS Yunel Escobar, SP Daniel Norris, SP Deck Mcguire, SS Dickie Thon Jr.

    To Toronto:

    SP Ian Kennedy, LF/DH Jason Kubel
    Giving up Norris I would try and get Eaton instead of Kubel? Not a fan of Kubel...30 homers and WAR of 1? Other than that I would make the trade.

    If can get a Kennedy...How about doing something suprising...a trade like Oakland did last year? Trade a starter to fill several holes which allowed them to bid big on Cepedes? Trade Morrow for Choo, Kipnis and Jiminez(who is a throw-in at this point)? Take the cash we were expecting to spend thru free agency to fill lf and 2b and land Marcum and Sanchez? Choo in left and lead-off hitter, Eaton 4th outfielder

    Makes the rotation Kennedy/Romero/Marcum/Sanchez/Jiminez. Happ is spot starter and Alvarez goes to AAA. Gives him time to work on another pitch and gives us rotation depth in case of injuries again. Anthopoulos liked Jiminez a lot 2 years ago at the deadline if he can get him straightened out could be a steal.

  12. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    I think Adam Eaton would be a better acquisition if we are looking to get a potential lead off hitter from Arizona. Parra was solid in 2011 (won a GG and had an OBP of .357), but he isn't a speedster, he doesn't walk much, and he doesn't hit for any power whatsoever.

    Eaton posted an OBP over .380 and walked 14 times with only 15 K's in 103 PA's this year in Sept his first look at the pro's. He also beat up the PCL this year over 562 PA's putting up a slash line of .381/.456/.539 with 46 doubles and 38 SB's. I realize those are PCL stats, but he hit .300 with an OBP over .400 at every single level along the way (.450+ everywhere but AA in 2011 ) and rose very quickly through the ranks. He is a left handed hitter and looks like he could fit in nicely at the top of a lineup imo.

    He still has plenty of service time if we want to try him in a real AAA league in 2013, and he should cost less via trade then Parra.


    However, what about the following blockbuster trade with Arizona:

    Colby Rasmus
    Yunel Escobar
    Daniel Norris
    Jake Marisnick
    Sean Nolin
    Marcus Stroman

    for:

    Tyler Skaggs
    Trevor Bauer
    Justin Upton


    Is that enough talent to get 3 potential studs, not enough or sound about right? I realize Bauer and Skaggs are their top 2 prospects, but they aren't exactly short on pitching....and Upton is coming off a down year...
    not sure if serious?

  13. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by statquo View Post
    not sure if serious?
    More insightful input.
    Hey! It'S JoeyBatS

  14. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartron_44 View Post
    His average WAR would be 4.1 over his first 7 years. Where did this 2.7 number come from? Sure he had a down year this year, but his war last year was 7.1, and in 2009 it was 5.8. When he has a good year, he has a very good year.

    The scary thing about Kinsler is that he only seems to be able to hit in Texas. He has posted the following OPS numbers away from home over the past 4 seasons:

    2012: 611
    2011: 730
    2010: 710
    2009: 672

    I am not so sure you can count on him being an .800 OPS bat playing in another ballpark. Especially in Toronto where he has a whopping career slash line of .174/.265/.289.
    Sorry, I meant 2.0 WAR this year. Not really impressive considering 15 million a year until 2017.

    Texas probably trade Andrus instead where he has way higher trade value. Kinsler has more value to Texas than any other team. Where Kinsler's bat is a product playing in Arlington.

  15. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by GNick View Post
    Sorry, I meant 2.0 WAR this year. Not really impressive considering 15 million a year until 2017.

    Texas probably trade Andrus instead where he has way higher trade value. Kinsler has more value to Texas than any other team. Where Kinsler's bat is a product playing in Arlington.
    3.2 WAR. Don't use Baseball Reference's WAR.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx...95&position=2B

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