Tim Duncan vs Lebron James - New Organization

[JordansBulls]

Being on the all star team doesn't mean you have top 40 talent in the league. But even if he was a top 40 talent during that time in 2005, Big Z was there BEFORE Lebron was on the team. I'm originally arguing the Cavs management didn't bring any top 40 talent once Lebron was there.

Carlos Boozer

[Raps08-09 Champ]

Carlos Boozer

He was there before Lebron then left after Lebron's rookie year.

Again, the Cavs failed to give him a current top 30-40 player when Lebron was at the level where he was able to perform at a superstar level.

You're not even trying anymore are you.

[SteBO]

Raps08-09 Champ, don't bother anymore. When you're speaking to someone who already has his heels dug in, you're just going to end up going in circles. Don't drive yourself crazy.......

[Raps08-09 Champ]

Lolol. I know JB doesn't know ****. I just want to see how far he'll go.

[JordansBulls]

He was there before Lebron then left after Lebron's rookie year.

Again, the Cavs failed to give him a current top 30-40 player when Lebron was at the level where he was able to perform at a superstar level.

You're not even trying anymore are you.

What do you mean give him? He had top 30-40 players that were on the team before he arrived. Why couldn't Lebron aid anyone into becoming a top 30-40 player? Why did he have to get handed guys who were already proven as stars and many in there primes?

[Raps08-09 Champ]

What do you mean give him? He had top 30-40 players that were on the team before he arrived. Why couldn't Lebron aid anyone into becoming a top 30-40 player? Why did he have to get handed guys who were already proven as stars and many in there primes?

Are you even following anymore?

We are talking about the difference between Cavs and Spurs management.

I'm arguing 1 thing: That the Cavs didn't bring Lebron top talent help when it mattered (in his prime years) while contenders brought over top talent or had players capable of developing into a top 30 player. Lebron never had a top 30-40 player during his prime years and didn't have anyone capable of developing into one because Cavs management doesn't equate to front offices of other contenders.

For a contending team, the Cavs probably had one of the worst coaching staffs, worst supporting cast in terms of talent to surround their star, one of the worst front offices and one of the worst owners.

[JordansBulls]

Are you even following anymore?

We are talking about the difference between Cavs and Spurs management.

I'm arguing 1 thing: That the Cavs didn't bring Lebron top talent help when it mattered (in his prime years) while contenders brought over top talent or had players capable of developing into a top 30 player. Lebron never had a top 30-40 player during his prime years and didn't have anyone capable of developing into one because Cavs management doesn't equate to front offices of other contenders.

For a contending team, the Cavs probably had one of the worst coaching staffs, worst supporting cast in terms of talent to surround their star, one of the worst front offices and one of the worst owners.

The Spurs didn't either, neither Parker nor Manu were top 30-40 that the Spurs brought in. They became that playing with Duncan because Duncan made them better. Guys don't become stars playing around Lebron, they get worse because of his ball dominant nature.

[Raps08-09 Champ]

How'd Duncan make them better? They were responsible for their own development. Duncan made it easier but they certainly had the capabilities to become the exact same player without Duncan. Lebron's certainly ball dominant, but he's never had a young talent that actually had the capability of becoming a top 30-40 talent.

But this doesn't really have anything to do with my original point when I first started. Duncan didn't create the Spurs. Management did. Lebron didn't create the Cavs. Management did. Hence why the Spurs won and the Cavs couldn't get over the hump: because the Cavs weren't as good as Spurs management.

[JordansBulls]

How'd Duncan make them better? They were responsible for their own development. Duncan made it easier but they certainly had the capabilities to become the exact same player without Duncan. Lebron's certainly ball dominant, but he's never had a young talent that actually had the capability of becoming a top 30-40 talent.

But this doesn't really have anything to do with my original point when I first started. Duncan didn't create the Spurs. Management did. Lebron didn't create the Cavs. Management did. Hence why the Spurs won and the Cavs couldn't get over the hump: because the Cavs weren't as good as Spurs management.

If they had these capabilities they would not have been the 29th and 57th pick in the draft.

[beliges]

This question is difficult to answer at this point. Duncan got his team 4 titles and decent longevity while ending up as a top 10 Player to play. Lebron at this point is on pace to get to that kind of level. His longevity and his ability to win will decide his place in history. If we could win another 3 titles, Id place him above Duncan on the all time list. But as to who you would pick for your franchise, its difficult to say since Duncan is already accomplished while Lebron is in his prime trying to accomplish the same success.

[Patman]

If they had these capabilities they would not have been the 29th and 57th pick in the draft.

Yeah because Manu is such a scrub when not playing with Timmy. Euroleague MVP, Champ, Olympic Champ as the main man. That all was because Tim made him better. What made Parker and Gino, the players they have become, was their talent and that the spurs are by far the best Team when it comes to player development.



I'd probably take Duncan to build a franchise. The guy just dominated Both ends of the Floor like very few ever did, still can't believe he never got DPOY honors. But it could very well be that LeBron will be the easy pick after we know how his career plays out.

[Money_23]

- "how is it definitely Lebron?"

- "because he's better"
chooses Duncan*

[JordansBulls]

- "how is it definitely Lebron?"

- "because he's better"
chooses Duncan*

Are you referring to b@llhog24?

[Fired-Up]

Tim Duncan won Finals MVP in 2003 with Stephen Jackson as his 2nd best player.

When Lebron James takes a giant turd on the rest of the league like that, let me know.

Lebron when he joined Bosh and Wade destroyed his chances of being "the man".

[Raps08-09 Champ]

If they had these capabilities they would not have been the 29th and 57th pick in the draft.

They developed into the players they are today. That doesn't mean Duncan was the sole reason they became better.