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  1. #241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randall Stevens View Post
    Think its safe to say the delay we are currently having is further trade negotiations ongoing between the 2 teams? I'll basically sum up what most likely happened.....

    Homer: "ok screw Piole, we are not sending Schenn and Couturier for Weber, lets just send in an offer sheet"

    Homer: "Hey Poile, we just signed Weber to a crippling contract you cant rationally afford, so here's my 4 1st rounders, its been a pleasure"

    Poile: "Not so fast, I'll match the offer out of spite unless you send us more compensation"

    Homer: "Ok Poile, what do you want?"

    Poile: "Couturier and Schenn"

    Homer: "Yeah, eat a dick pal. You can't afford it, it's as I said...a crippling contract. You can have Voracek, and if your wife sucks me off tonight, I'll throw in MAB. I call your bluff."
    Fixed.
    <Meaning and Content>

    ...And did you see that Giroux goal?

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randall Stevens View Post
    I agree with everything you said there. Really hope we keep Jake and send out Read. Read deserves a shot at 2nd line center on a rebuilding team. Flyers are short on Wingers, no sense in shipping off one of their most important ones....


    And why is everyone always mentioning Mez? Timonen has played there before and his salary will only be 3 million next season. Don't forget the team has been shopping Lilja as well. But if the Flyers get Weber, I think it almost has to be guaranteed that either Mez or Timonen will be moving to Nashville.
    because in a trade package, Mez is the more desirable asset. he's younger and less money and he's controlled for another year after this. yes, Timonen has played there before, but he also has a NMC and he's 37 years old and often injured.



    plus, just for me personally, i would like to see that guy win a cup in Philly, and if the Flyers were to obtain Weber, this year would realistically be his best shot. he's played so well for us since he's come over and has been nothing short of fantastic on the ice and in the locker room for that team. i don't mind just losing him to FA next year. let's see, if they can get Weber, if the Flyers can put a strong push for a cup here this year.

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyeaglesman View Post
    because in a trade package, Mez is the more desirable asset. he's younger and less money and he's controlled for another year after this. yes, Timonen has played there before, but he also has a NMC and he's 37 years old and often injured.



    plus, just for me personally, i would like to see that guy win a cup in Philly, and if the Flyers were to obtain Weber, this year would realistically be his best shot. he's played so well for us since he's come over and has been nothing short of fantastic on the ice and in the locker room for that team. i don't mind just losing him to FA next year. let's see, if they can get Weber, if the Flyers can put a strong push for a cup here this year.

    Idk the way I saw it this last season, was Bryz has a very specific style of goaltending, and it relies on bigger more physical defensemen for him to succeed. He doesn't swallow rebounds, he needs his defensemen to clear his garbage (both opposing players and the puck) Anybody else notice that Bryz had a monster run right when Grossmann and Kubina got settled in? Timonen, Carle, and MAB dont really gel with Bryz's style well. But despite his size, Timonen is at least very responsible with puck-maintenance in his own low slot, I will give him that.

    But I'm sure Mez is what Nashville wants. I predict Weber goes to Philly, and Mez, Voracek, and 2 1sts go to Nashville (thats not what I want, its what I think will happen)


  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randall Stevens View Post
    Idk the way I saw it this last season, was Bryz has a very specific style of goaltending, and it relies on bigger more physical defensemen for him to succeed. He doesn't swallow rebounds, he needs his defensemen to clear his garbage (both opposing players and the puck) Anybody else notice that Bryz had a monster run right when Grossmann and Kubina got settled in? Timonen, Carle, and MAB dont really gel with Bryz's style well. But despite his size, Timonen is at least very responsible with puck-maintenance in his own low slot, I will give him that.

    But I'm sure Mez is what Nashville wants. I predict Weber goes to Philly, and Mez, Voracek, and 2 1sts go to Nashville (thats not what I want, its what I think will happen)

    i agree. i just think Timonen's experience and wit is necessary for this team. i love what he brings to the table as far as his positioning on the ice, ability to read the play, and leadership. obviously the team has plenty now, and adding Weber helps a ton as well; i just think he's somewhat of a calming influence on that team and specifically the D corp.

  5. #245
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    Between Voracek and Read I think I may want to trade Voracek. I LOVE him and all and I love his game but Reads cap is so amazing. I think Voracek can be great but what's up with his contract? Losing Read is only going to take off 900k. Not a big difference. If we lose Voracek that's at least saving up 3.5 million. We can sign Doan to that kind of money. And for wishful thinking.. Semin. (Probably more like 4.5 millionish for him though)


    This is why I watch soccer.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue_Ninja View Post
    Between Voracek and Read I think I may want to trade Voracek. I LOVE him and all and I love his game but Reads cap is so amazing. I think Voracek can be great but what's up with his contract? Losing Read is only going to take off 900k. Not a big difference. If we lose Voracek that's at least saving up 3.5 million. We can sign Doan to that kind of money. And for wishful thinking.. Semin. (Probably more like 4.5 millionish for him though)
    -Doan has been offered way more than 3.5, and he cant replace what Voracek can bring to the table. Doan is a 2way forward, not a shooter or passer.

    -Semin will never be on a Peter Laviolette team. They learned a ton from Nikolay Zherdev

    For me personally, Matt Read doesn't have a spot on this team. To me, that void on this team is fulfilled by Briere. Smaller center with a great shot, so small it hurts their play along the boards/behind the net, yet they always seem to come up with clutch goals (however Read is worlds ahead of Briere defensively). It seems this team is VERY loyal to Briere and he is here to stay.

    However, playmaking/passer wingers that can also play the role of power forward when necessary.... all we got is Voracek. Same role fulfilled by Jagr, but hes obviously gone. They need to hold on to Voracek.

    ray: Weber comes to Philly, Read-Mezaros-Bourdon-Lilja-1st-2nd to Nashville. I'd do jumping jacks.


  7. #247
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    If the hold up is because a trade is being made and Vorachek is involved. As much as I want to keep Mez, we are going to have to trade him, so we can use his cap space to add another winger. Doan, Ryan (probably nothing left to trade for him) or anyone else they try to sign or trade for they need some flexibality with the cap, which Mez is 4 million will do, you Cut Shelly and know you have 5.1 million, and guess who makes 5.1 million (Ryan). Just saying!!

    Personally I would call Pollie bluff, and keep my players to try to add another superstar like Ryan. Even if you dont make a trade keep Mez and Vorachek and we wont have a weak link on our roster.

  8. #248
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    I like your thinking Randall. If Read and Mez go we have money for Jake and then some. At this point I dont put anything pass Holmgren. In Homer I trust. After this, if Weber is wearing Orange and Black, Homer should be the GM of the year

  9. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by sev66 View Post
    If the hold up is because a trade is being made and Vorachek is involved. As much as I want to keep Mez, we are going to have to trade him, so we can use his cap space to add another winger. Doan, Ryan (probably nothing left to trade for him) or anyone else they try to sign or trade for they need some flexibality with the cap, which Mez is 4 million will do, you Cut Shelly and know you have 5.1 million, and guess who makes 5.1 million (Ryan). Just saying!!

    Personally I would call Pollie bluff, and keep my players to try to add another superstar like Ryan. Even if you dont make a trade keep Mez and Vorachek and we wont have a weak link on our roster.
    fyi unlike the NFL, you cant cut players in the NHL. All you can do is put them in the AHL, then their salary is not on the cap anymore. Shelley will most likely be a scratch in the AHL fairly often this year


  10. #250
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    As long as we keep Weber, I don't care...TWO DAYS DOWN!!!! (Yes, I'm doing this to myself...I have my hopes WAYYY up!!! **** it!!! I'm all in!!)

  11. #251
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    lol munchie... go big or go home F the alternative!!!

    love the attitude

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  12. #252
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    think its very funny how much Homer has royally screwed over the Penguins this offseason.

    Pitt just traded away some talented players to make cap room for a huge splash in FA. Even though Parise and Suter werent coming to philly, Homer made sure he topped Pittsburgh's offers, making them irrelevant. So Pitt got NOBODY, and there they sit with $10 million to spend. Maybe Pitt was thinking, hey, its ok, now we have what it takes to get Weber next year as a UFA. lol, not anymore!


  13. #253
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    I would not be surprised at all if that's what was going on in Homer's mind. It's a win-win-win-win-win-win situation for Homer. Either he signs(ed) Suter, Parise, and/or Weber or the Penguins (and Rangers/Devils) don't.

    **** the rest of the Atlantic, Paul Holmgren says.

  14. #254
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randall Stevens View Post
    think its very funny how much Homer has royally screwed over the Penguins this offseason.

    Pitt just traded away some talented players to make cap room for a huge splash in FA. Even though Parise and Suter werent coming to philly, Homer made sure he topped Pittsburgh's offers, making them irrelevant. So Pitt got NOBODY, and there they sit with $10 million to spend. Maybe Pitt was thinking, hey, its ok, now we have what it takes to get Weber next year as a UFA. lol, not anymore!
    There's still Semin...lol
    <Meaning and Content>

    ...And did you see that Giroux goal?

  15. #255
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    While the hockey world waits to see whether the Nashville Predators will match the Flyers' $110 million offer sheet to All-Star defenseman Shea Weber, a pair of Philadelphia's own restricted free agents are left to wonder how (if at all) the outcome of the offer sheet will affect their own status with the team.

    Forward Jakub Voracek and defenseman Marc-Andre Bourdon both remain unsigned as of now. The Voracek negotiations are, by far, the dicier of the two.

    When the Flyers had their end-of-season media day after the Devils series, general manager Paul Holmgren said that he did not anticipate that Voracek would be a tough signing. However, he also said he anticipated getting Matt Carle re-signed below market value ahead of July 1.

    Voracek's agent, Petr Svoboda, is looking for a substantial raise on the $2.25 million that his client earned last season on a one-year contract. Based on other recent signings such as Teddy Purcell's deal with Tampa Bay, is believed that the current asking price on Voracek on a multi-year deal is close to the $4 million range. At this point, if there is to be a multi-year agreement, the Flyers would be paying the soon-to-be 23-year-old Voracek based more on his potential continued development than his track record to date.

    The demands may be significantly lower in a one-year deal. However, Voracek would be a restricted free agent again next summer and the price tag could shoot up (lowered cap ceiling or not) if he were to have a big season.

    Bourdon's situation is not nearly as tough from a financial standpoint. The 22-year-old figures to get a modest raise on the $875,000 he received in the third and final season of his entry-level contract. While he generally played well in 2011-12 prior to suffering concussion issues in the latter part of the season and playoffs, Bourdon only has 45 games on NHL experience under his belt.

    However, Bourdon is already affected by a numbers crunch on the blueline. Even without Weber in the picture, the Flyers would have eight veteran NHL defensemen (Kimmo Timonen, Luke Schenn, Braydon Coburn, Nicklas Grossmann, Andrej Meszaros, Bruno Gervais and Andreas Lilja) plus waiver-exempt Erik Gustafsson to compete with Bourdon for a roster spot.

    If the Flyers add Weber to the picture, there's no spot for Bourdon unless there are multiple injuries when the 2012-13 season (eventually) starts. Because he is no longer on his entry-level contract, Bourdon would require waivers to be sent to the Phantoms next year. The team has a difficult decision to make on him. He definitely played well enough as an NHL rookie to merit some playing time next year, but will it be in Philadelphia?

    Increasingly, it seems as if the Weber offer sheet will end up going one of two ways: the Predators match it and try to manage around the severe financial hardships it will cause or else they arrange a de facto trade for Weber in exchange for not matching the offer sheet.
    The least likely scenario appears to be the possibility of the Predators simply walking away with the four first-round picks that would come their way if they don't match.

    In the "Gratton trade" scenario, the Predators would decline to match the offer sheet and then immediately send some or all of the first-round picks back to Philadelphia in exchange for players. If this is the case, I think Bourdon or Gustafsson will be one of the secondary pieces heading to Nashville.

    It is also not out of the question that Voracek could end up in Nashville.

    Yes, the Flyers have already lost substantial pieces at wing with the depatures of Jaromir Jagr and James van Riemsdyk. Yes, the club would like to see if Voracek (who closed the season out with the best two-way hockey of his career) can fill the Jagr void. But if the club refuses to deal either Sean Couturier or Brayden Schenn -- even at the risk of losing out on the best all-around defenseman in the NHL -- they will almost have to make Voracek available.

    This is especially true if Svoboda was looking for more money than the club was willing to pay even BEFORE taking on Weber's $7.9 million cap hit (not to mention paying out all the signing bonus money due to the defenseman under the terms of the offer sheet). If Weber comes, the Flyers would ideally prefer to shed a couple salaries. With Nashville having so much required spending left to get to the cap floor, Voracek could probably get both more money and a multi-year deal.

    If Voracek were to get dealt to, he could step right into a top-six role in Nashville. The Flyers would feel his loss but still have some decent options for Giroux's right wing (Wayne Simmonds, Matt Read, shifting Danny Briere from second-line center to top-line RW). But Philly would definitely be much weaker on the wings that they were a year ago. The trade-off would be potentially having the top blueline in the NHL.

    A deal that would send Voracek, Meszaros , one of Bourdon or Gustafsson and two or three of the first-round picks to Nashville for Weber and the return of one or two of the first-round picks may or may not get it done.

    I'm sure David Poile would prefer one of Couturier or Brayden Schenn and the healthier Coburn instead of Meszaros (who is coming off back surgery but is just a year removed from winning the Barry Ashbee Trophy as the Flyers top defenseman). However, I would think that, if that is the case, Paul Holmgren would tell the Predators to go ahead and match the offer sheet if they can.

    If the Flyers had been willing to trade all that in the first place, they wouldn't have gone the offer sheet route. Now that the Predators are under the gun of matching the offer sheet, I think the return they can realistically expect goes down a bit -- but not as much as some may think.

    Before, Nashville still faced the possibility of losing Weber as a UFA next summer. Now, if they can somehow come up with the money to match without totally destroying the money-losing franchise's financial outlook, they know they can keep Weber for the rest of his career if they so desire.



    the last 2 bolded paragraphs is what i have been saying over the last day or so now.



    also includes some things about voracek. good read.

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