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  1. #1081
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    but I guess if you're thinking is that he will leave then I would understand a little I guess. But I have faith he will stay

  2. #1082
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    Quote Originally Posted by browniebuck View Post

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bgass9d

    Just because a trade works on the Trade Machine doesn't mean that it makes ANY sense at all. In order for a trade to be consummated, both sides have to agree to it, meaning that there are benefits to both teams. The trade that I linked above is just to show you that you can get any trade to work, but that it doesn't make a damn bit of sense to actually think that it would happen.

    how about this one???

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ajvqcn4

    When you are trying to get a trade to work out, you have to look at years remaining on contracts, signability for impending free agents, likelihood of the player gelling with their new team, depth chart issues, system issues, etc. You can't simply put a bunch of numbers together and say that the trade works.
    both made me throw up in my mouth a little. Why would we give up a 24 year old franchise player under contract for 3 years at least, for a 31 year old role player, and two sucky players?

    If you want the ultimate, you've got to be willing to pay the ultimate price. It's not tragic to die doing what you love.

  3. #1083
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    Quote Originally Posted by browniebuck View Post
    Cavaliers fan here...you have to be drunk or high if you think that the Cavaliers are giving up Anderson Varejao (signed for another 3 years) AND their 2013 1st rounder for Pekovic (only signed for another year) and Williams (reasonable contract for next 3 years...but you don't know what you are getting). The Cavs are trying to build for a solid future, you don't do that by giving up a 1st rounder almost guaranteed to be in the top 5...maybe the Lakers or Heat pick (we have the option of swapping for the higher of these two picks), but no way in hell do they throw in their own 2013 pick.

    I kind of hope that something does happen with this deal. I love Andy...he plays the game the way you want your young guys to learn, HARD! His offensive game comes around when he has a solid scorer around him (LeBron first and now Kyrie Irving). He has always been a great rebounder and a great "hustle" guy. I hate to see him go, but he isn't getting any younger and his health scares the hell out of me...because of the way that he plays.
    While I agree that it makes no sense for Cleveland to trade it's first rounder, I also think you overvalue Varejao. I for one would not want to trade Pek for Varejao straight up, much less include Williams too. Varejao has a "nice" medium-term contract, but seems to be fairly injury prone (which YOU have to factor into his value).

    Now Pek may be a bit slower, but he led the league in offensive rebound percentage last year and was 3rd in FG% while scoring 14 points the hard way. Cleveland could simply use his contract to clear cap, but they also could keep him for years with RFA rights.

    Williams on the other hand is an inconsistent (we hope he is getting to the point of shaking that) 2nd year 2nd pick. If Cleveland really wants to get younger and shed some long-term salary, well then Williams + pieces for Varejao is a reasonable starting point. Is Varejao better than Williams now? Absolutely! Does his presence really do anything to impact the Cavs in the next three years? Not likely.

  4. #1084
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye15 View Post
    both made me throw up in my mouth a little. Why would we give up a 24 year old franchise player under contract for 3 years at least, for a 31 year old role player, and two sucky players?
    Please tell me that you didn't think that either one of them were in ANY way, shape, or form intended to be serious. I was simply trying to show how you could get the Trade Machine to work for almost any trade if you threw in a player here or there to make the dollars work. Sarcasm would be a word to describe the trades that I linked...nothing but sarcasm.

  5. #1085
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    Pek for AV isn't even fair straight up. topdog was completely right in his above statement.

    That said, I actually have faith that Kahn will only make a good/fair deal. Even if Pek is included.


    AK47 the Dragon Tamer!

  6. #1086
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    Quote Originally Posted by topdog View Post
    While I agree that it makes no sense for Cleveland to trade it's first rounder, I also think you overvalue Varejao. I for one would not want to trade Pek for Varejao straight up, much less include Williams too. Varejao has a "nice" medium-term contract, but seems to be fairly injury prone (which YOU have to factor into his value).

    Now Pek may be a bit slower, but he led the league in offensive rebound percentage last year and was 3rd in FG% while scoring 14 points the hard way. Cleveland could simply use his contract to clear cap, but they also could keep him for years with RFA rights.

    Williams on the other hand is an inconsistent (we hope he is getting to the point of shaking that) 2nd year 2nd pick. If Cleveland really wants to get younger and shed some long-term salary, well then Williams + pieces for Varejao is a reasonable starting point. Is Varejao better than Williams now? Absolutely! Does his presence really do anything to impact the Cavs in the next three years? Not likely.
    This is where not watching the Cavs on a frequent basis can sway someone. Since Andy has been out, Tristan Thompson, a player that most fans were growing frustrated with, has been playing out of his mind. Reason??? Anderson Varejao has shown him how a big should play the game...balls to the wall. Thompson has been averaging a double-double since Andy got hurt...he is playing like Andy.

    Will Anderson Varejao win a team a championship? Absolutely not. Can he help a team that has a scorer or two reach the next level with his hustle, rebounding, and inside scoring...absolutely. I really don't understand why you guys are the team linked to him in the first place...not really a need IMO.

    The reason that Cavs fans are at all interested in Williams is simply because NBA media folks have thrown his name out there. He doesn't fit. He is a small PF that shouldn't play much SF (where someone of his size SHOULD play) but isn't big enough to defend at PF. We already have Thompson at the PF position...so he would be coming here as a back-up. We are intrigued because a lot of Cavs fans were interested in him after Kyrie Irving in the draft...but not a lot of us get to watch him play very often, so we don't realize just how limited he really is at this point in his career...we are just hoping that with a change of scenery and/or system he would be able to reach the potential that everyone saw prior to the draft.

    I don't see a trade working...you guys would be getting a more athletic version of Pekovic...not something that would push you into the playoffs. Besides, once Love is healthy, he and Andy would just get in each other's way under the rim, IMO.

  7. #1087
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    Quote Originally Posted by browniebuck View Post

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=bgass9d

    Just because a trade works on the Trade Machine doesn't mean that it makes ANY sense at all. In order for a trade to be consummated, both sides have to agree to it, meaning that there are benefits to both teams. The trade that I linked above is just to show you that you can get any trade to work, but that it doesn't make a damn bit of sense to actually think that it would happen.

    how about this one???

    http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ajvqcn4

    When you are trying to get a trade to work out, you have to look at years remaining on contracts, signability for impending free agents, likelihood of the player gelling with their new team, depth chart issues, system issues, etc. You can't simply put a bunch of numbers together and say that the trade works.
    well, apparently you don't understand sarcasm either.... i obviously dont think we could get gay with a bunch of bench players. but the trade machine was made for people to day dream, and that is what i did.

  8. #1088
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    Quote Originally Posted by browniebuck View Post
    This is where not watching the Cavs on a frequent basis can sway someone. Since Andy has been out, Tristan Thompson, a player that most fans were growing frustrated with, has been playing out of his mind. Reason??? Anderson Varejao has shown him how a big should play the game...balls to the wall. Thompson has been averaging a double-double since Andy got hurt...he is playing like Andy.

    Will Anderson Varejao win a team a championship? Absolutely not. Can he help a team that has a scorer or two reach the next level with his hustle, rebounding, and inside scoring...absolutely. I really don't understand why you guys are the team linked to him in the first place...not really a need IMO.

    The reason that Cavs fans are at all interested in Williams is simply because NBA media folks have thrown his name out there. He doesn't fit. He is a small PF that shouldn't play much SF (where someone of his size SHOULD play) but isn't big enough to defend at PF. We already have Thompson at the PF position...so he would be coming here as a back-up. We are intrigued because a lot of Cavs fans were interested in him after Kyrie Irving in the draft...but not a lot of us get to watch him play very often, so we don't realize just how limited he really is at this point in his career...we are just hoping that with a change of scenery and/or system he would be able to reach the potential that everyone saw prior to the draft.

    I don't see a trade working...you guys would be getting a more athletic version of Pekovic...not something that would push you into the playoffs. Besides, once Love is healthy, he and Andy would just get in each other's way under the rim, IMO.
    It sounds to me like Andy's served his purpose and now it's time for Thompson to get those minutes and continue to develop.

    I also don't quite get the rumored interest although the logical argument is that the Wolves are preparing for Pek's impending free agency and aren't sure they want to pay him what others will.

    I'm sure part of the initial intrigue for Cavs fans with Williams was the possibility of having the top two picks in a draft on one team. His position isn't quite figured out but he seems as of late to have figured out how to balance out his game and produce.

    I absolutely am disgusted by that bolded comment of yours though. I am imagine you are simply comparing statistics because Pek is an offensive post player who gets in deep and finishes with classic big man moves while Varejao is a defensive player with an okay jumper and good timing. Pek isn't a lesser anything version of Varejao.

  9. #1089
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    Grizzlies firesale!!!!!

    Gay on the block
    Zach on the block.

    You can bet your *** if those two are traded for rebuilding pieces Marc will ask to be traded too.

    Wolves should look into it.

  10. #1090
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    Quote Originally Posted by browniebuck View Post
    Cavaliers fan here...you have to be drunk or high if you think that the Cavaliers are giving up Anderson Varejao (signed for another 3 years) AND their 2013 1st rounder for Pekovic (only signed for another year) and Williams (reasonable contract for next 3 years...but you don't know what you are getting). The Cavs are trying to build for a solid future, you don't do that by giving up a 1st rounder almost guaranteed to be in the top 5...maybe the Lakers or Heat pick (we have the option of swapping for the higher of these two picks), but no way in hell do they throw in their own 2013 pick.

    The Cavs have been high on Alexey Schved as well...would much rather take Pekovic and Schved than Williams, but I don't think that you guys would finish the phone call if that is what we were looking for.

    I kind of hope that something does happen with this deal. I love Andy...he plays the game the way you want your young guys to learn, HARD! His offensive game comes around when he has a solid scorer around him (LeBron first and now Kyrie Irving). He has always been a great rebounder and a great "hustle" guy. I hate to see him go, but he isn't getting any younger and his health scares the hell out of me...because of the way that he plays.

    Feel free to come to the Cavs forum to join our discussion as well regarding the rumors.

    Had to edit this post - I clicked your link to see your proposal. There is absolutely no way in hell that Chris Grant would even be able to finish this phone call without laughing out of his seat. You think for a second that we give up Varejao, Miles, Zeller, and Gee to get Pekovic, Williams, and Barea....AND give you our 2013 first rounder????????? WOW!!!
    I can care less about Varejao I was just giving my suggestion on what might happen if things do start happening. Varejao is having a great season but I have never been high on him and will never. But it seems like the T-Wolves are in love with international players too much. Cavaliers are asking way too much in return for Varejao without a question. Overall Varejao isn't a consistent player like Pekovic which is why I wouldn't want to trade for Varejao in the first place. But with Pekovic might ask about 10-13 million a year after his contract expired that is the only reason why the T-Wolves are interest in Varejao. Varejao has a good contract which he gets paid about 8 million a year. Sometimes trades are not meant to be fair or both side to get equal value back in return. Some trades are just for shedding money and some are for personal reason.

  11. #1091
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellcrooner View Post
    Grizzlies firesale!!!!!

    Gay on the block
    Zach on the block.

    You can bet your *** if those two are traded for rebuilding pieces Marc will ask to be traded too.

    Wolves should look into it.
    I thought Spanish players were the consummate professionals though.

  12. #1092
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    Toyed with the idea of sending Love, Williams, Ridnour + for Zach and Gay. Wouldn't really work economically cause we would be getting above the cap by a lot (especially when we re-sign Pek and Bud). Also not sure I would like it.

    United we Run

  13. #1093
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    Kahn said he is forsure looking into adding a playmaker to the team by trade. He said they have been trying, but most teams hold off until the trade deadline to get the best deal possible, so they are definitely in the market to add an impact player, but other teams are hesitant to make any moves until closer to the dead line. Kahn said right now they are trying to work a few deals, and just trying to do the best they can until they can get a deal done.
    Now why did the Wolves do that?

  14. #1094
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4wanderingeyes View Post
    Kahn said he is forsure looking into adding a playmaker to the team by trade. He said they have been trying, but most teams hold off until the trade deadline to get the best deal possible, so they are definitely in the market to add an impact player, but other teams are hesitant to make any moves until closer to the dead line. Kahn said right now they are trying to work a few deals, and just trying to do the best they can until they can get a deal done.
    He is looking to add a playmaker? Why?

    United we Run

  15. #1095
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    Because of all of the injuries.
    Now why did the Wolves do that?

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