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  1. #31
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    I like that way of thinking...

    Have actually thought about seeing what kind of return Staal would get. While I am admittedly not familiar with the guy you speak of, why would a team trade a young skilled guy who is under a reasonable contract? Would have to be Staal plus something else good..

    But even if that is the case, I'd be down for that. Wouldn't hesitate to deal Girardi, either, in a similar type deal. Not that I'm saying I want either guy gone, far from it, but I'd be listening if someone came to me with a good deal. McD, on the other hand, is about as untouchable as any player we have not named Henrik..

  2. #32
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    Shadyone, Dustin Byfuglien plays for the Jets, was a member of the Blackhawks when they one the cup. Drafted late rounds as a dman, Hawks played him with Kane and Toews. He was a player moved by the Hawks because they had to get rid of guys due to qualifying offers being sent out late, the previous year. Many thought he was just a product of playing with the other 2. When he was moved to Atlanta he said he wanted to go back to defense. Played in the ASG 2 years ago, was selected this year but was injured at the time of the game. Should check him out on youtube.

    Is he available, I dont know but I do know the Jets did not make the playoffs last year. They have 2 othe guys who can play the pp also in Enstrom and Bogoszian (could be off on speing). Both are younger then him. Maybe they look at Staal and like more of his defensive side and are entised with the addition of a prospect and 3rd round pick.

    What I do know is every team wants to get better and if they feel that moving him for a good return makes them better they could be interested. Their prospect pool isnt the best (mainly cause Thrashers were a mess) so if they feel the extra pieces may help down the line. Most of their better players are young, so if they feel its better for them in the long run, where he helps us now and going forward they could listen.

    Edit: forgot to bring up Girardi. All though he does not bring all the top end skills to the table, he reminds me of Hal Gill a true shut down type dman. I joke that hes made out of the stuff Wolverine from Xmen is because he blocks everything and just shakes it off lol. Because that is his main asset I dont see him comanding alot of money even when this contract is up and a player that stablizes the D. But if it improves the team I would listen. It depends what else is in the package.
    Last edited by Isca92; 07-14-2012 at 04:51 PM.

  3. #33
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    re

    the way this offseason is going and how strong the rangers are already.. it doesnt look like any team will trade anything to us .. look for the rangers to sign another washed up forward .. sather has to bite the bullet and give up stephan and hope someone from camp can fill his center ice shoes . its the only way we are going to get a top 6 forward in a trade .. GET BOBBY RYAN !!!!!

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShadyOne View Post
    Honestly, we really don't need upgrades on D. Sure, it would be nice to get a guy with a cannon shot from the point, but unfortunately, those guys are few and far between, and they cost...A LOT....

    Honestly, it isn't so much about how hard you shoot, but whether you can get it through. I thought overall the D did a decent job of that, and in particular I thought Stralman showed he has a solid shot from the line. ...

    If this defense doesn't need upgrades and it's not about how hard you shoot, but whether you get it through, can you explain the PP failures?

    Forget Leetch, which defenseman moves the puck like Zubov? Do any of them really help on the power play? It almost appears to be an accident if they score. It's a hack PP as I see it. Nice/So/So players but nothing that keeps opponents awake at night.

    How about we forget the big shot from Weber and look at his passing, his hitting, his ability to clear the front of the net which nobody on this defense does?

    I like the youth and home grown as much as many yet let's be honest, besides Washington in which it appeared even, the Rangers weren't nearly as physical as Ottawa and New Jersey. The Rangers may have blocked a lot of shots but the opponents certainly appeared to move the biscuit on the PP better than the Rangers did. Nobody cleared out the front of the net.

    Is in imperative for the Rangers to add a defenseman? No, but there are severe problems on the PP using any combination of these defensemen. Perhaps this analogy doesn't fit but maybe it does. Back 1981 the NY Giants had arguably four Pro-Bowl linebackers yet still jumped at the opportunity to draft Lawrence Taylor. Adding Shea Weber to this Rangers defensive corps improves the whole team and he's without question the #1 defenseman in the Conference let alone the team.
    Last edited by NYSPORTS98; 07-15-2012 at 09:25 AM.

  5. #35
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    Nysports98, I dont think the problem with our pp has anything to do with the point but strictly on the forwards. The pp workers when they get established in the zone. The problem is they rarely are established for more then 45 seconds of any given pp and heres why.

    Starts with losing the opening face off puck cleared. They come up the ice lose the puck and back down. Come up the ice, dump it in. Hopefully the get there at the same time as the defenseman and battle it out, when they dont beat them to the puck or get there at the same time puck is out of the zone. This happens alot.

    When they do they battle it out, when they lose the battle, the puck goes out. When they win the battle, a good portion of the time they either throw a pass in the teammates skates, which allows the defenders to pressure them and puck out of the zone or just a bad pass that leaves the zone on its own.

    When they do win the battle and get the puck clean, establish their positions then they usually have good plays. The problem is all the other stuff just took atleast half the pp away and if they dont execute on the first established set up they dont score and the pp is over.

    I dont know other sports so I cant touch your LT comments. However, Phauef is nasty and has a hard shot, Chara is nasty and has the hardest shot, Byfuglien Is big and has a hard shot, yet all these guys lost the Norris no an non-nasty more accurate shooter just not as hard to Erik Karlsson. Whos only playoff point was a pass to noone that deflected off a Ranger skate into the net.

    If MDZ continues to develop he could be a player like Letang, and MCD, could be another Suter, and I would love to have that Im not saying I wouldnt love to have him, but the cost to aquire him, can be better used to address our weakest position of the 3, the forwards. If Nash costs 2 rostered forwards, why wouldnt Weber cost 2 rostered defensman, which while addressing one need, creates another hole.

    Heres what Nash brings to the table to address the pp issues. When he skates the puck up after getting a forchecke behind him(whether he was passed the puck past the guy or stick handles past him) the other 3 defending players respect his skill and back off allowing them to enter the zone smoothly, this is seen with guys like Kovy, Malkin, Stammer, Giroux, etc. he can take a one timer which no one does. Hes a big body that goes to the net, but has the skill to put the rebound in while being pressures (while msost of our guys just put it into the goalie). He can redirect shots, hes a complete player. Someone that has to be wtched at all times, the only reason his stats arent better is he has no one to play with. His best defenseman would be our 5th in Fedor Tytuin, (I leave Johnson out because he just got there) and linemates would be 2 and 3 liners on other teams.

    While you say is it imperative they add a D, no (like you say) but it is imperative to add a forward. They dont need to add the second/third line guys for that secondary scoring cause it hasnt worked. They need another go to guy as most cup winning teams have had.

  6. #36
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    The PP has many issues and believe there is blame on both the forwards and defensemen. The team looks practically incompetent when moving the puck around. It's Richards and Gaby with nobody else really displaying offensive instincts to scare anybody. It's more of a "hack play" than a "power play". We all know it's ugly.

    As far as the LT comment, it's similar to the philosophy the whole Giants organization has. "GET THE BEST AVAILABLE PLAYER". Best players and fill in the rest. It's not realistic to not only build from within, but to develop stars, depth, no holes and remain under the cap. You can't have it all. IMO, this Rangers team is very similar to the 1991 team which was young, hustled non-stop and won. Then we really broke the team down and realized, hey, this team has a bunch of nice players but nobody who can really outshine stars. Even in 1994, the team wasn't talented enough to win in the playoffs until the trade deadline. Who wanted to trade Amonte & company? This team is young and record wise outshined almost everybody but we saw Ottawa & Washington play basically even with them. We saw a Devils team beat'em. One goal not scored or one more given up and this team doesn't get out of the first round.

    You need upper tier players. Who are the upper tier players or guys who have the potential to be upper tier players? (besides the goaltender)

    1. Richards
    2. Gaby
    3. Kreider (we hope/think)
    4. MDZ
    5. McDonough

    Cally is the heart of the team and basically an Adam Graves.
    Stephan - nice, maybe better
    Hagelin - maybe, maybe better
    Staal - he's nice but don't think he's near elite at doing anything.
    Girardi - nice

    Add or subtract a few - basically, there is your team.

    If you added Weber, where would he be on the list. I'd say #1 b/c he would be the best defenseman, the QB on the PP, the physical presence on the backline and the accurate shot (accuracy which appears missing by just about everybody on this team)

    If you added Nash, where would be on the list? He's good, real good, but I wouldn't put him #1. Not sure where I would rank him.

    IMO, if you have a chance for Weber, go get him b/c I don't see any of these guys with his upside. If you don't want Weber, wait until the trade deadline next season b/c I believe the forwards the young forwards have had less time to develop.

    Stars and role players with fewer role playes trying to be stars. Heck, I think Kreider is going to be Nash. Can't see anybody being Weber.

    Speaking of costs too: I know these numbers are crazy but how is Minnesota going to build with two guys making close to $100 million? Simple, they kicked the contracts out a long way. Now, if we're concerned about the next few seasons. What makes the Rangers better? Nice players like Staal and Duby tying up $8 million or moving them out and having a star like Weber for $10 million? Can make a case for Nash yet I'm from the defense wins championships school.

  7. #37
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    2.05.... Thats how many goals a game we let up in the playoffs. Third, behind LA who won and behind Ottawa, you know why Ottawa let up less goals per game? Cause they played us in their only series. Before you say the Kings let up the least goals and won the cup, the Kings also scored the third most per game behind Philly and Pitt who had inflated totals from their first round series. We didn't lose because of our defense, we lost because of an anemic offense that Weber will help, but not impact in a way Nash will.

  8. #38
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    Also on a sidenote the Rangers pp% in the playoffs would have put them between 10-15 in the regular season, not the 26th or whatever they were in the regular season. Maybe its the start of something good

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isca92 View Post
    Nysports98, I dont think the problem with our pp has anything to do with the point but strictly on the forwards. The pp workers when they get established in the zone. The problem is they rarely are established for more then 45 seconds of any given pp and heres why.

    Starts with losing the opening face off puck cleared. They come up the ice lose the puck and back down. Come up the ice, dump it in. Hopefully the get there at the same time as the defenseman and battle it out, when they dont beat them to the puck or get there at the same time puck is out of the zone. This happens alot.

    When they do they battle it out, when they lose the battle, the puck goes out. When they win the battle, a good portion of the time they either throw a pass in the teammates skates, which allows the defenders to pressure them and puck out of the zone or just a bad pass that leaves the zone on its own.

    When they do win the battle and get the puck clean, establish their positions then they usually have good plays. The problem is all the other stuff just took atleast half the pp away and if they dont execute on the first established set up they dont score and the pp is over.

    I dont know other sports so I cant touch your LT comments. However, Phauef is nasty and has a hard shot, Chara is nasty and has the hardest shot, Byfuglien Is big and has a hard shot, yet all these guys lost the Norris no an non-nasty more accurate shooter just not as hard to Erik Karlsson. Whos only playoff point was a pass to noone that deflected off a Ranger skate into the net.

    If MDZ continues to develop he could be a player like Letang, and MCD, could be another Suter, and I would love to have that Im not saying I wouldnt love to have him, but the cost to aquire him, can be better used to address our weakest position of the 3, the forwards. If Nash costs 2 rostered forwards, why wouldnt Weber cost 2 rostered defensman, which while addressing one need, creates another hole.

    Heres what Nash brings to the table to address the pp issues. When he skates the puck up after getting a forchecke behind him(whether he was passed the puck past the guy or stick handles past him) the other 3 defending players respect his skill and back off allowing them to enter the zone smoothly, this is seen with guys like Kovy, Malkin, Stammer, Giroux, etc. he can take a one timer which no one does. Hes a big body that goes to the net, but has the skill to put the rebound in while being pressures (while msost of our guys just put it into the goalie). He can redirect shots, hes a complete player. Someone that has to be wtched at all times, the only reason his stats arent better is he has no one to play with. His best defenseman would be our 5th in Fedor Tytuin, (I leave Johnson out because he just got there) and linemates would be 2 and 3 liners on other teams.

    While you say is it imperative they add a D, no (like you say) but it is imperative to add a forward. They dont need to add the second/third line guys for that secondary scoring cause it hasnt worked. They need another go to guy as most cup winning teams have had.
    agree 1,000,000,000% on the PP comments here, it was the same everytime...

    to add.. ottawa we obviously so much faster than us hence why they always got to the puck and created their space... and closed down our space...

    weber is exceptional.. but we are also in an exceptional position with the D we have and trading for weber is not what sather should be using his time up with right now... if his contact is up next year.. we can re-visit this at the deadline where if he isnt likely to sign back in nashville, he will more than likely be dealt.. now is about offense

  10. #40
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    Saintant, Im glad im not the only one that sees that. From watching it seems like only Richards has the green light to carry the puck over the blue line if its not an odd man rush. I agree with your Ottawa and Weber comments.

    Nysports98, Nash hands down becomes slotted as the number 1 guy, when not including Hank. While I agree defense wins championships, we were a minute logging defenseman short. If they had someone who could go out there and play 12-15 minutes instead of Bickels 5, its alot of minutes off our top guys just in the playoffs led alone the 82 regular season games. The defense we have is one of the better sets as a whole in the league the problem is our forwards arent. Nash instantly puts us far ahead of our team last season.

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