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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunsfan88 View Post
    Dudley, #13 for Horford, Williams, #23

    We take Williams horrible deal off your hands, y'all get a lottery pick and Dudley should be a solid player for you guys whether as a 6th man or starter.
    NO! You knew that was a crap deal for us before you posted it!

  2. #77
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    Plus Williams doesn't have a "horrible" deal, so I don't see why it's a "burden" or anything and that you are helping us get rid of him by taking one of our 2 best trade pieces. I have a hard time trading Horford for the 1st pick in this draft let alone #13.
    Last edited by *Silver&Black*; 06-27-2012 at 11:08 AM.

    McGOAT

  3. #78
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    Good article on CBSSports.com, Jeff Goodman came up with a rating system for GMs based on their draft record.
    NBA general managers will be on the clock Thursday night for the NBA Draft -- and we've put each under a microscope for their NBA Draft history.

    We've come up with a scoring system to evaluate each current general manager/decision maker that justly rewards those who didn't screw up a top pick -- and also gives credit for nailing a selection later in the draft.

    We've rated every single player, put them into a category (elite, perennial all-star, occasional all-star, solid starter, quality reserve, rotation guy, bench and overseas/out of the league).

    Then we've given them a numerical value from 1 to 10 based on where they were drafted.

    Sure, drafting Kevin Durant at number two in 2007 was a no-brainer for Oklahoma City general manager Sam Presti, but it's still deserving of credit. Just not as much as taking, say, Steve Nash at No. 15 as Toronto GM Bryan Colangelo did back in 1996.

    And we've penalized abysmal picks as well. Chris Wallace's pick of Hasheem Thabeet and Joe Dumars' selection of Darko Milicic were two of the most egregious.

    For many of those taken in the 2011 NBA Draft and some in 2010, we've handed out incomplete grades to be fair.

    Now it's time to see which general manager you can trust on draft night -- and which ones appear to be throwing darts.

    -----

    Goodman's NBA Draft Rating System:

    Elite (examples: Kevin Durant, LeBron James, Tim Duncan, Kobe Bryant)
    #1-3 overall - 7.5 points
    4-8 - 8 points
    9-14 - 8.5 points
    15-20 - 9 points
    21-30 - 10 points
    Second Round - 10 points

    Perennial All-Star (Paul Pierce, Dirk, Chris Paul, Garnett)
    1-3 - 7 points
    4-8 - 7.5 points
    9-14 - 8 points
    15-20 - 8.5 points
    21-30 - 9 points
    Early 2nd (31-40) - 9.5 points
    Second - 10 points

    Occasional All-Star (Joe Johnson, Rudy Gay, Danny Granger, Devin Harris)
    1-3 - 5 points
    4-8 - 6 points
    9-14 - 7 points
    15-20 - 7.5 points
    21-30 - 8 points
    Early 2nd (31-40) - 8.5 points
    Second - 9 points

    Solid starter (Arron Afflalo, Tyreke Evans, Luke Ridnour, Raymond Felton)
    1-3 - 2.5 points
    4-8 - 3.5 points
    9-14 - 4.5 points
    15-20 - 5.5 points
    21-30 - 6 points
    Early 2nd (31-40) - 6.5 points
    Second - 7 points

    Quality reserve (C.J. Miles, Michael Beasley, Taj Gibson, Thaddeus Young)
    1-3 - minus-1 points
    4-8 - 1.5 points
    9-14 - 3 points
    15-20 - 4 points
    21-30 - 5 points
    Early 2nd (31-40) - 6 points
    Second - 6.5 points

    Rotation player (Ronny Turiaf, Patrick Patterson, Ryan Gomes)
    1-3 - minus-3 points
    4-8 - minus-1 points
    9-14 - 0 points
    15-20 - 1.5 points
    21-30 - 2.5 points
    Early 2nd (31-40) - 3.5 points
    Second - 4.5 points

    Bench player (A.J. Price, Jon Brockman, Luke Harangody)
    1-3 - minus-5 points
    4-8 - minus-4 points
    9-14 - minus-3 points
    15-20 - minus-1 points
    21-30 - 1 points
    Early 2nd (31-40) - 2.5 points
    Second - 3.5 points

    Overseas/Out of league (Joe Alexander, Alexis Ajinca, Morris Almond)
    1-3 - Minus-7.5 points
    4-8 - Minus-6.5 points
    9-14 - Minus-5 points
    15-20 - Minus-4 points
    21-30 - Minus-3 points
    Early Second (31-35) - minus-1 points
    Second - 0 points

    * Must have minimum of five picks to qualify
    NBA GM Rankings GM Rating
    1. Sam Presti (OKC) 2.79
    2. Geoff Petrie (SAC) 2.58
    3. Billy King (BKN) 2.42
    T4. Danny Ainge (BOS) 2.38
    T4. Danny Ferry (ATL) 2.38
    6. Rod Higgins (CHA) 2.07
    7. Kevin O'Connor (UTA) 2.06
    8. Daryl Morey (HOU) 2.05
    9. Larry Bird (IND) 1.92
    10. Bryan Colangelo (TOR) 1.73
    http://www.cbssports.com/nba/draft/gm-ratings/

    Keep in mind, this only deals with the draft, not stuff like coaching hires, trades, etc.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-27-2012 at 12:12 PM.

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB75 View Post
    Interesting!



    Would you take Tyrus to get rid of Joe?
    I would do Joe Johnson for Tyrus Thomas and the #2 pick in a heartbeat. His contract is bad (3 yrs/$26M) but it's manageable and way shorter and cheaper than Joe (4 yrs/~$90M). The Bobcats want shooters and will never be able to lure an "all-star" to Charlotte via FA, so the deal would make sense in my opinion. And the Bobcats would essentially only be taking on ~$10M net in salary.

  5. #80
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    The guys over at PH used Goodman's scale to rate Billy Knight's draft record:
    Billy Knight's NBA Draft Record

    Year Player Pick No. Goodman Designation Value (overall)
    2003 Boris Diaw 21 Solid Starter 6
    2003 Travis Hansen 37 Overseas 0
    2004 Josh Childress 6 Rotation Player -1, Josh Smith 17 Occasional All-Star 7.5
    2004 Donta Smith 34 Out of League -1, Royal Ivey 37 Bench Player 2.5
    2005 Marvin Williams 2 Quality Reserve -1, Salim Stoudamire 31 Out of League -1
    2006 Shelden Williams 5 Bench Player -4, Solomon Jones 33 Overseas -1
    2007 Al Horford 3 Occasional All-Star 5, Acie Law 11 Bench Player -3

    Total 9: GRAND TOTAL OF BILLY KNIGHT's DRAFT ACUMEN = 0.75
    That score would place him second to last (MIN's David Kahn, 0.50) among all current GMs who qualify. Acie Law is actually overseas now, so that would drop Knight's total to 7 and his overall score to .58, or almost tied for last with Kahn. One player I was wrong about at the time was Salim Stoudamire -- thought he could be a solid player.

    I'll try this formula for Rick Sund:
    2008 No Pick
    2009 Jeff Teague 19 Solid Starter 5.5, Sergyi Gladyr 49 Overseas/Out Of League 0
    2010 Jordan Crawford 27 Rotation Player 2.5, Pape Sy 53 Overseas/Out Of League 0
    2011 Keith Benson 48 Overseas/Out Of League 0
    Total 8: Rick Sund's Draft Acumen 1.6... which would place him 13th, between Ernie Grunfeld and RC Buford (!)
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-27-2012 at 12:57 PM.

  6. #81
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    Drew makes it clear he’s not looking for a developmental project at No. 23, but a guy who can come in and produce immediately.

    “That’s an understatement,” Drew said when asked if he’s looking for rotation player in the draft. “When you go into a summer, come July 1, we’ll only have six players under contract. So we have some holes we have to fill. We have to analyze what we have and we have to look at the personnel where we’ll need the most help from.”

    With only six players currently under contract the Hawks have depth needs at point guard, small forward and center. With so many holes to fill Drew says the team isn’t looking to draft for a specific position, but will take the best available talent on their big board.

    “At [pick] twenty three it will probably be the best player available unless somebody slides,” Drew said. “We have targeted some names that we hope will be there and the probability they’re not and then certainly we’ll just have to move to the next guy. In most cases it will be best player at that time.”

    A few of the prospects who could be on the board at No. 23 include Syracuse’s Fab Melo, Vanderbilt’s John Jenkins and Jeff Taylor, Iowa State’s Royce White, Mississippi State’s Arnett Moultrie and Memphis’ Will Barton.
    http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-am-atl...or-busy-summer

    I don't know how much power Drew has with the draft, but his comments here are about as clear as it gets.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo95 View Post
    http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-am-atl...or-busy-summer

    I don't know how much power Drew has with the draft, but his comments here are about as clear as it gets.
    Interesting omission of Wroten...

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdiddy24
    Interesting omission of Wroten...
    My guess is that's just the writer listing random names who might be around, and 3 of those guys (White, Moultrie, Barton) are considered more "polished" players. We all know why Drew wouldn't want to draft a project: He's got 1-year left on his deal. A coach with more job security would probably have no problem with it, but Drew is in "Win Now" mode.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-27-2012 at 02:17 PM.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bravo95 View Post
    My guess is that's just the writer listing random names who might be around, and 3 of those guys (White, Moultrie, Barton) are considered more "polished" players. We all know why Drew wouldn't want to draft a project: He's got 1-year left on his deal. A coach with more job security would probably have no problem with it, but Drew is in "Win Now" mode.
    Yea but Drew doesn't make the decisions, Ferry does... and he is on a 6 year deal and Drew isn't HIS coach.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Silver&Black*
    Plus Williams doesn't have a "horrible" deal, so I don't see why it's a "burden" or anything and that you are helping us get rid of him by taking one of our 2 best trade pieces.
    Yeah, 2yr/15M left on his deal. He's overpaid, but a solid spot up shooter. If they don't move him this year, he will be a valuable expiring contract that some other team seeking cap relief will definitely bite on next summer.
    Quote Originally Posted by jdiddy24
    Yea but Drew doesn't make the decisions, Ferry does... and he is on a 6 year deal and Drew isn't HIS coach.
    My guess is, they will "collaborate" on this particular draft.
    Last edited by Bravo95; 06-27-2012 at 03:23 PM.

  11. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdiddy24 View Post
    Yea but Drew doesn't make the decisions, Ferry does... and he is on a 6 year deal and Drew isn't HIS coach.
    Yep...... I hope his comment carry's absolutely no weight. Draft the palyer who you think will be the best down the road Mr. Ferry. The Hawks are not close enough to pass on talent, because Woodson wants someone who is NBA ready. That's how 2nd teir teams (which the Hawks are) become 3rd teir teams.

  12. #87
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    I see the Pau/Smith rumors are going around again....... If a 3rd team is in it and we get a high pick, I can see it. But Bringing Pau to Atl only satisfies the move Horford to PF push. I don't think it makes us better than the Heat and Gasol is on the decline. There is also the almost 40 mil he adds to the cap over the next 2 years. Love or hate Smith it doesn't make sense for the Hawks...


    As for the Lakers, bringing in Smith to learn from Kobe and his work ethic would be GREAT! He would fit in with what they do at PF and give Bynum more room on the block.

  13. #88
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  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB75 View Post
    Yep...... I hope his comment carry's absolutely no weight. Draft the palyer who you think will be the best down the road Mr. Ferry. The Hawks are not close enough to pass on talent, because Woodson wants someone who is NBA ready. That's how 2nd teir teams (which the Hawks are) become 3rd teir teams.
    +1. IMO Drew shouldn't have any say in it. Plus I don't understand the "we won't take a project at #23" stuff. That is all that falls to #23, either projects or players that are not that good. I don't see a "ready to come in and put up points up with no development needed" player, that player would already be gone off the board.

    On the good side, we won't draft Melo, as he is a project.

    McGOAT

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by SB75 View Post
    I see the Pau/Smith rumors are going around again....... If a 3rd team is in it and we get a high pick, I can see it. But Bringing Pau to Atl only satisfies the move Horford to PF push. I don't think it makes us better than the Heat and Gasol is on the decline. There is also the almost 40 mil he adds to the cap over the next 2 years. Love or hate Smith it doesn't make sense for the Hawks...


    As for the Lakers, bringing in Smith to learn from Kobe and his work ethic would be GREAT! He would fit in with what they do at PF and give Bynum more room on the block.
    I love Smith and will be sad to see him go SB, whenever that is. I just want a new team that is consistent and players that understand what they can and can't do. I always include Smith as the odd man out due to the fact he has put himself as the odd man out numerous times.

    Now to this Gasol/Smith trade, hopefully like you said, somehow a high 1st is involved and we can ship Marvin out with this deal too. Getting Gasol, drafting Wroten, and maybe another high draft pick (center or wing to replace Marvin/Smith), we could have a great team next year.

    McGOAT

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