JVR traded to TOR for Luke Schenn

[Lego My Eggo]

Schenn will be fine -- he's got all of the talent in the world & now he has Chris Pronger to teach him how to play the position.

Not to be Debbie Downer here, but, who says Prongs is even going to be around the team if he is not playing? Last year they only saw him a handful of times at best after he suffered his injury. Just sayin...
Either way I would like to think the change of scenery, getting linked up with his brother, and a new coaching scheme help him to maximize his potential. I hate to see JVR go, but at least we have a certified steamroller patrolling our blue line in exchange.
Now the Sedin's, Kostitsyn's, Staal's (well 2 of the 4), and the Schenn's are all on the same team. It makes it kinda cool to see the families uniting haha

[Claude28Giroux]

It is not uncommon for hockey players to completely transform around age 25. Theres the all star exceptions like Malkin and Oveckin that are great from day 1, so generic hockey fans all assume that all good players better be great by his age. Truth is, 99% of hockey players take a long time to develop. They hit their prime at 25/27, and until then are still developing. Most players dont see the NHL full time yet at Luke's age, and he's been there for 4 years. NHL fans saw him during his awkward stage, which they typically dont,

Basically, anybody that assumes a permanent fate for a 22 year old hockey player that shows the ability to play, is fairly simple minded. They'd be better off watching golf, much easier to comprehend.

Great Post RS

[1908_Cubs]

as far as i'm concerned, Luke has all the potential to be the #1 guy; now it just comes down to hard work, dedication, and great coaching to get him to reach his true potential.

Very much so. Just as JVR has all the potential to be a 40 goal guy. Which is why I've said from the beginning this is an amazingly fair trade on both sides.

When you consider the offensive depth we have (Giroux, Simmonds, Courutier, B.Schenn, Voracek, Wellwood, Laughton - all of whom are under TWENTY FOUR YEARS OLD, and add in Read at 26), on top of our ability to reclaim young defensemen (Carle, Mez) as well as our other past trading for defensemen (Grossmann, Timmonen, Coburn) you have to like our chances of 1) knowing what we got 2) trading from a position of strength and 3) knowing how to get him where we need him to be.

[castan_b]

FYI you have to put Prongers 4.9 salary on there. Before he goes on LTIR, his salary has to be on the books on Day 1 of the season, and the team has to be within the cap rules on Day 1, and the 10% cap offseason forgiveness does not help you on Day 1 of the season. His salary has to be factored in for Day 1. If Schenn is still a 2 way contract and can go to AHL waiver free, then there's 3.3 in space right there and we're good to go (you can just max it out, and the 1.6 million difference is your AHL callup money)

but nice job there. I still rather have Ryan, personally, because I do not think Parise wants to come here. Thats never been made official but he does seem to not want to go to a rival. Ryan WANTS to be here, so I like him.

2 million cap raise is alittle more realistic. Unless some kind of sponsor or corporation is paying for the cap increase, I do not see 5 million more coming out of the owners' pockets. no way. I think those rumors were started so the fans will pressure the owners into raising the cap in the new CBA. All fans want to see superstars on their teams. 3% is always the realistic figure.

... so ... going back to the cap debate ... and like i said earlier in my posts ... after the flyers sign their RFAs they will have around 7 - 8 million in cap room - ASSUMING you get another defender who can play or resign carle ... that drops your cap number to about 3 - 4 million dollars to sign other free agents ...

meaning that Parise, Nash or even Ryan WILL NOT HAPPEN with 3-4 million in room .... unless we find a player and drop them off the roster (hartnell and kimo are in the last year of their deals) or do not resign carle and then don't replace carle with someone of quality on defense

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-...pdate/45/45194

maybe that article will highlight what i was talking about when i said, "hartnell is expendable and we need to move him" ... for all those interested.

go flyers ... but when you go on capgeek and see what we have in cap space currently ... that is a very innaccurate way to go about making arguements until the season starts and the puck drops on game 1 ... we dont even know our RFA players bonus' yet, which also counts against the cap

[BlueEyedSuicide]

There are also talks of the Flyers showing interest in the Ducks defenseman Justin Schultz. If he were to be signed, he would apparently be signed at an entry level contract due to CBA complications and that would allow Matt Carle to walk (Hopefully!!) and give them the cap space they need to sign a stud winger or center.

[Skip25]

... so ... going back to the cap debate ... and like i said earlier in my posts ... after the flyers sign their RFAs they will have around 7 - 8 million in cap room - ASSUMING you get another defender who can play or resign carle ... that drops your cap number to about 3 - 4 million dollars to sign other free agents ...

meaning that Parise, Nash or even Ryan WILL NOT HAPPEN with 3-4 million in room .... unless we find a player and drop them off the roster (hartnell and kimo are in the last year of their deals) or do not resign carle and then don't replace carle with someone of quality on defense

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-...pdate/45/45194

maybe that article will highlight what i was talking about when i said, "hartnell is expendable and we need to move him" ... for all those interested.

go flyers ... but when you go on capgeek and see what we have in cap space currently ... that is a very innaccurate way to go about making arguements until the season starts and the puck drops on game 1 ... we dont even know our RFA players bonus' yet, which also counts against the cap

The thing about Ryan is that he isn't an FA. He will be traded for not signed, so obviously pieces would be going the other way. Doug Maclean on Hockey Central was just talking about Voracek/ Coburn or Mez in the deal. Voracek aside, Mez makes 4M and Coburn makes 4.5M Hartnell's cap hit is 4.2. So I don't know why it has to be Hartsy that has to go if we are only talking dollar value. Also, Capgeek is including Prongers cap hit right now too. So if he gets Slid to LTIR there is more then enough room for Ryan @ his $5.1 cap hit with the additional 3 to 4 mil in room that you are talking about.

So I think you are right about Parise. But the argument is moot when discussing Nash (why bother, he isn't coming) or Bobby R (much better chance) as those two will be traded for, with salaries going each way.

[MMC1710]

Capgeek includes Pronger's money because his cap hit doesn't come off our books until after the first day of the season. If we were to get Ryan and we're over the cap by whatever the allowable percentage is....Holmgren will have to put some guys in the minors so their money doesn't hit the cap...I think he did that with Schenn last year so Jagr could fit into the cap (also to lower his cap # from $3.11 million to just about $1million.)

[FLYERS-ROCK]

any word on what j schultz is doing?

[1908_Cubs]

any word on what j schultz is doing?

More than likely not signing here.

Everyone is going to offer him a max contract. This means no one can offer him more money than the other as the max is relatively low. He will sign based on:

1) NHL right away
2) Where he wants to be

In the end, it's probably less than a 5% chance he ends up here. It's just not going to happen. We will pursue and he will sign with Toronto or Edmonton.

[phillyeaglesman]

More than likely not signing here.

Everyone is going to offer him a max contract. This means no one can offer him more money than the other as the max is relatively low. He will sign based on:

1) NHL right away
2) Where he wants to be

In the end, it's probably less than a 5% chance he ends up here. It's just not going to happen. We will pursue and he will sign with Toronto or Edmonton.

just a stupid question i guess but i have to ask.

luke schenn was basically relegated to the 7th d-man role last season with all the depth they had at defense last season. so did they lose another defenseman besides schenn?

otherwise i don't see how they can promise schultz a starting job...

[1908_Cubs]

just a stupid question i guess but i have to ask.

luke schenn was basically relegated to the 7th d-man role last season with all the depth they had at defense last season. so did they lose another defenseman besides schenn?

otherwise i don't see how they can promise schultz a starting job...

Their defense sucked even when Schenn was a 6th/7th defensemen. Schenn wasn't put there based on depth, he was put there based on play. But that was largely due to Wilson's system which didnt play to his strengths and a real lack of confidence. In all honesty Pfanuef is the only guy back there who's premium. Liles is serviceable. Komiserik is a retread at this point.

Schultz can walk into Toronto and from day one, possibly be their top line pairing with Pfanuef. He walks into Philly, he's the number 6 guy.

Also, you have to remember - he's from Canada. It's been reported he wants to go to Canada. And preferably....the Leafs.

[phillyeaglesman]

Their defense sucked even when Schenn was a 6th/7th defensemen. Schenn wasn't put there based on depth, he was put there based on play. But that was largely due to Wilson's system which didnt play to his strengths and a real lack of confidence. In all honesty Pfanuef is the only guy back there who's premium. Liles is serviceable. Komiserik is a retread at this point.

Schultz can walk into Toronto and from day one, possibly be their top line pairing with Pfanuef. He walks into Philly, he's the number 6 guy.

Also, you have to remember - he's from Canada. It's been reported he wants to go to Canada. And preferably....the Leafs.

right, because he's close with Gardiner, who is a pretty damn good defenseman.

they also have Gunnarsson and Franson, both of whom they refused to trade.


Phanuef, Gunnarsson, Franson, Gardiner...at this point, are probably all better than Schultz, some for the simple reason that they have NHL experience. so i disagree with you when you say Schultz could be on their top pair.

that being said, he could still start there. i guess i find it hard to believe why he'd leave ANA for a team like TOR who hasn't made the playoffs in 4 years.

[1908_Cubs]

right, because he's close with Gardiner, who is a pretty damn good defenseman.

they also have Gunnarsson and Franson, both of whom they refused to trade.


Phanuef, Gunnarsson, Franson, Gardiner...at this point, are probably all better than Schultz, some for the simple reason that they have NHL experience. so i disagree with you when you say Schultz could be on their top pair.

that being said, he could still start there. i guess i find it hard to believe why he'd leave ANA for a team like TOR who hasn't made the playoffs in 4 years.

I think you're overrating a few of those guys. The Leafs biggest issue last season was on defense. They obviously don't want to give up on the kids and trade them, but they're also not super high end young defensive talent, either.

There's a legitimate chance Schultz walks in and claims a top pair spot by mid season. Very legit with that cast of characters.

The Leafs are likely to make the playoffs in 2012-2013, first off. And secondly, he wants to go home.

I'd be floored if he didn't end up in Toronto or Edmonton. Those are easily the most rumored places for him to land for a reason.

[phillyeaglesman]

I think you're overrating a few of those guys. The Leafs biggest issue last season was on defense. They obviously don't want to give up on the kids and trade them, but they're also not super high end young defensive talent, either.

There's a legitimate chance Schultz walks in and claims a top pair spot by mid season. Very legit with that cast of characters.

The Leafs are likely to make the playoffs in 2012-2013, first off. And secondly, he wants to go home.

I'd be floored if he didn't end up in Toronto or Edmonton. Those are easily the most rumored places for him to land for a reason.

don't forget vancouver, i believe he's from BC.

[Hatch]

The upside on Schultz makes him a kid that you really can't pass up on...sounds like he's the kind of talent that if he happens to fall in your lap then you figure out who else to move to open a spot for him. Just pick a guy and package him to upgrade something else....it's not that big a deal to move a decent NHL defender if you find yourself with one too many...