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Thread: JVR rumors

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by sexicano31 View Post
    did you just say Rick Nash is a 40-50 goal scorer? Hes gotten 40 goals twice in his career. Hes not some stud player, hes hardly an 80 pt player
    The gamble you are taking is going with the assumption that if you put him on a legitimate team with legitimate linemates that production puts him up into that next level of production.....


    For me, at 8 million per I'm not comfortable making that gamble but my guess is that's how you'd have to figure why you'd do it......

    Don't see them doing that actually...the rumors will persist, but I doubt a Nash deal here ever hits reality..

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by sexicano31 View Post
    did you just say Rick Nash is a 40-50 goal scorer? Hes gotten 40 goals twice in his career. Hes not some stud player, hes hardly an 80 pt player
    To be fair he's never really played with anyone on the same level as Giroux. It should raise his production to around 40 goals, 50 is a little bit of a reach though.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by bringbackfredex View Post
    I'm not saying that I want Bryz for another 8 years, but you act like goalies grow on trees when we haven't had one since I started watching hockey (and I'm 22 years old). We had a 0% chance of winning a cup with Boucher/Bob/Leighton plain and simple, and not one person in this town wanted to see that **** anymore. At least with Bryz we have a shot if our young guys continue to develop, technically we overachieved this year with the expectations we had at the beginning of the season.

    I was glad to see Richards and Gagne win a cup, but I don't regret trading Carter for a second. He took way too many games off, was inconsistent, and was rumored to be a problem in the locker room. Yes the Kings had a potent offense, but they don't go anywhere if Quick isn't 16-4 with a 1.41 GAA in the postseason. We need to keep Bryz on the potential that he could do that alone. We have so much young talent that we will be right there again next
    year, so I still don't regret any of the moves we made in the offseason last year.
    No one is saying good goalies grow on trees.

    Wouldnt you say that a good/great goaltending will be the difference of a win or a loss a cup or not ? Come playoff time you go up against the best of the best weather its the best goal scorers or the best defense or the best goaltenders etc. which means in order to win any of the series the goals against should be low.
    Bryz playoff history is piss poor and perhaps its because thats when he plays against the best which tells me he just is not good enough come playoff time.

    It's pretty obvious great goaltending wins cups and if I am betting on that aspect it certainly would not be on Bryz.
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  4. #34
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    ^So who is available that the Flyers can acquire this offseason?

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    Quote Originally Posted by delfinko View Post
    ^So who is available that the Flyers can acquire this offseason?
    You know I am not sure what they can do that contract on Bryz pretty much handcuffs them from doing anything.I am just hoping and counting on Holmgren to do something about it and if he doesnt well then I know he did all he can and that we are screwed.I believe Snyder was the guy who went all out for Bryz,he ment well but that contract was and is terrible.

    I do trust in Holmgren he is a pretty smart Hockey guy.
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  6. #36
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    Igot an idea...... Mayson Raymond could be cheap, VAN filed for arbitration that takes away his RFA status


    FLYERS/EAGLES

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by delfinko View Post
    ^So who is available that the Flyers can acquire this offseason?
    Why does everyone keep asking this question as if there are no other options? Vokoun who was quite good this past year just signed for 2 million to back Marc Andre Fleury so that was an option. Here are 3 more that are better than a decade of disappoint from Bryz:

    1. Josh Harding - Played well and would be worth a shot as a number 1 if it means enough left over for a number 1 defenseman with the savings on Bryz and possibly moving a forward.

    2. Start knocking on St. Louis' door. They have two excellent goalies that are coming into their prime and cant hold hands in the St. Louis crease for much longer. I am also sure that St. Louis would like to get a hold of a young stud like JVR to help with their lack of offense.

    3. Give Bob a REAL shot and sign a veteran backup to mentor him like Biron. Again with the money saved on Bryz combined with moving a top 6 forward (Briere or Hartnell) you look for a number defenseman or a young stud that can be groomed into a number 1 that is the cornerstone for the next 5-10 years.

    Bottomline is if you can find someone to take his contract there are other options aside from Bryz that may be a step down in goal be combined with complimentary moves make this a better team.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by StryderSox View Post
    Why does everyone keep asking this question as if there are no other options? Vokoun who was quite good this past year just signed for 2 million to back Marc Andre Fleury so that was an option. Here are 3 more that are better than a decade of disappoint from Bryz:

    1. Josh Harding - Played well and would be worth a shot as a number 1 if it means enough left over for a number 1 defenseman with the savings on Bryz and possibly moving a forward.

    2. Start knocking on St. Louis' door. They have two excellent goalies that are coming into their prime and cant hold hands in the St. Louis crease for much longer. I am also sure that St. Louis would like to get a hold of a young stud like JVR to help with their lack of offense.

    3. Give Bob a REAL shot and sign a veteran backup to mentor him like Biron. Again with the money saved on Bryz combined with moving a top 6 forward (Briere or Hartnell) you look for a number defenseman or a young stud that can be groomed into a number 1 that is the cornerstone for the next 5-10 years.

    Bottomline is if you can find someone to take his contract there are other options aside from Bryz that may be a step down in goal be combined with complimentary moves make this a better team.

    st. louis goalies were products of their system. those guys, particularly elliot, were not that good before they got there. they had break-out regular seasons, then fizzled in the playoffs. i'll pass on both.


    bottom line, there really aren't any great options available. beyond that, this had nothing to do with Bryz. he was not the reason they didn't advance in the playoffs, so to keep blaming Bryz or wanting him gone is just using him as a scapegoat. it's petty and childish.

    he's been here for 1 year, not 5 or 10. not even 2. 1 year. if you got rid of every guy that had a bad year his first year with the Flyers you'd have to get rid of a pretty significant amount of your roster.


    and btw, saying that it's the contract you're worried about, is just a backhanded way of using him as the scapegoat again. because if he did play better than he did, nobody would be worried about his contract.


    every thread turns into a Bryz thread and it's ridiculous. 1 ****ing year....

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyeaglesman View Post
    st. louis goalies were products of their system. those guys, particularly elliot, were not that good before they got there. they had break-out regular seasons, then fizzled in the playoffs. i'll pass on both.


    bottom line, there really aren't any great options available. beyond that, this had nothing to do with Bryz. he was not the reason they didn't advance in the playoffs, so to keep blaming Bryz or wanting him gone is just using him as a scapegoat. it's petty and childish.

    he's been here for 1 year, not 5 or 10. not even 2. 1 year. if you got rid of every guy that had a bad year his first year with the Flyers you'd have to get rid of a pretty significant amount of your roster.


    and btw, saying that it's the contract you're worried about, is just a backhanded way of using him as the scapegoat again. because if he did play better than he did, nobody would be worried about his contract.


    every thread turns into a Bryz thread and it's ridiculous. 1 ****ing year....
    This.

    Bryz is here to stay, at least for now.

    Or...we could start a thread where the Flyers trade Bryz for Luongo, then amnesty Luongo, saving a couple million and using that money to make an offer on Rinne. That sounds plausible.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ace23 View Post
    This.

    Bryz is here to stay, at least for now.

    Or...we could start a thread where the Flyers trade Bryz for Luongo, then amnesty Luongo, saving a couple million and using that money to make an offer on Rinne. That sounds plausible.
    If I'm not mistaken I think Luongo actually has more money and years left on his deal than Bryz....I do figure you're obviously joking ..but just wanted to make that point lol
    Last edited by Hatch; 06-14-2012 at 12:30 AM.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyeaglesman View Post
    st. louis goalies were products of their system. those guys, particularly elliot, were not that good before they got there. they had break-out regular seasons, then fizzled in the playoffs. i'll pass on both.


    bottom line, there really aren't any great options available. beyond that, this had nothing to do with Bryz. he was not the reason they didn't advance in the playoffs, so to keep blaming Bryz or wanting him gone is just using him as a scapegoat. it's petty and childish.

    he's been here for 1 year, not 5 or 10. not even 2. 1 year. if you got rid of every guy that had a bad year his first year with the Flyers you'd have to get rid of a pretty significant amount of your roster.


    and btw, saying that it's the contract you're worried about, is just a backhanded way of using him as the scapegoat again. because if he did play better than he did, nobody would be worried about his contract.


    every thread turns into a Bryz thread and it's ridiculous. 1 ****ing year....
    In no way am I using Bryz as a scape goat or insinuating his play was the reason we did not go deeper into the playoffs. My stance on Bryzgalov has always been the same from day one.....

    Nothing against the guy himself (I actually like his weird personality) but you dont give a goalie that long of a contract unless you are damn sure that he is amongst that single digit percentage of goalies that you can build a franchise around and rely on to steal games and playoff series year in and year out (see Martin Brodeur and Patirck Roy). My arguement has never had anything to due with blaming Bryzgalov for his play and always has been that this would be a better team if instead of signing Brygalov to that ridiculous contract we give Bob a true shot and use the Bryz money to bring on a top pairing franchise defenseman. So top getting so butt hurt

    PS..... I didnt bring up Bryzgalov in this thread. I simply responding to the question of what other options are available for next year. And saying that Halak and Elliot were a product of the St. Louis system only proves my point that we are better off with a lower profile goaltender like Bob and a true number one shut down defenseman

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by StryderSox View Post
    Why does everyone keep asking this question as if there are no other options? Vokoun who was quite good this past year just signed for 2 million to back Marc Andre Fleury so that was an option. Here are 3 more that are better than a decade of disappoint from Bryz:

    1. Josh Harding - Played well and would be worth a shot as a number 1 if it means enough left over for a number 1 defenseman with the savings on Bryz and possibly moving a forward.

    2. Start knocking on St. Louis' door. They have two excellent goalies that are coming into their prime and cant hold hands in the St. Louis crease for much longer. I am also sure that St. Louis would like to get a hold of a young stud like JVR to help with their lack of offense.

    3. Give Bob a REAL shot and sign a veteran backup to mentor him like Biron. Again with the money saved on Bryz combined with moving a top 6 forward (Briere or Hartnell) you look for a number defenseman or a young stud that can be groomed into a number 1 that is the cornerstone for the next 5-10 years.

    Bottomline is if you can find someone to take his contract there are other options aside from Bryz that may be a step down in goal be combined with complimentary moves make this a better team.
    Because the point is that you aren't going to get a better goalie for next season.

    Bringing in Harding doesn't give us a better team this year. If that's the plan then you may as well use Leighton. At least we know he has some playoff experience, and if he's playing well, he can get to the finals.

    Trading for Halak would keep the goaltending situation about the same, while likely giving up a good young forward. That doesn't make the team better. I wouldn't entertain the idea of Elliot yet. I'd like to see more than one year of that kind of play.

    You can give Bob a "REAL" shot, but he's not as good as Bryz is right now. Playing Bob right now is a sign that we are playing for the future, not this year.

    Who can you get this year, that is going to make the team better and give the team a better shot at a cup THIS YEAR? So far no one has been able to answer the question. That's why everyone keeps asking that question.

    Quote Originally Posted by phillyeaglesman View Post
    st. louis goalies were products of their system. those guys, particularly elliot, were not that good before they got there. they had break-out regular seasons, then fizzled in the playoffs. i'll pass on both.


    bottom line, there really aren't any great options available. beyond that, this had nothing to do with Bryz. he was not the reason they didn't advance in the playoffs, so to keep blaming Bryz or wanting him gone is just using him as a scapegoat. it's petty and childish.

    he's been here for 1 year, not 5 or 10. not even 2. 1 year. if you got rid of every guy that had a bad year his first year with the Flyers you'd have to get rid of a pretty significant amount of your roster.


    and btw, saying that it's the contract you're worried about, is just a backhanded way of using him as the scapegoat again. because if he did play better than he did, nobody would be worried about his contract.


    every thread turns into a Bryz thread and it's ridiculous. 1 ****ing year....
    I do like Halak, and he's proven he can carry a team through the playoffs, but I don't know that he's better than Bryz. Plus we'd have to give something up to get him, so that would be a big waste. No thanks to that.

    The rest of this post is spot on. It's like people started hearing about how Philly is goalie hell so they are actually trying to make that the case. Bryz struggled at times and played exceptional at times.

    Bryz really went downhill when 24/7 aired. I'm not in the locker room, and I'm not close to Bryz but if you follow the numbers I think the negative attention got to him. Prior to that he was actually pretty solid. I believe heading into week 2 of 24/7 in December he was on an 11-1-1 streak with about a 2.3 GAA. That's not so bad. Then people started talking about him because of his weird behavior on 24/7 and his game got ****ed. Then the media got all over him for his play AND the weird behavior and his game got worse for about a month. Then the Sixers season got into full swing and there was less focus on the Flyers, and specifically less talk about Bryz and all of a sudden he was solid again. His numbers from mid January until mid February looked more like the early season numbers. Then the Flyers acquired Grossmann and March came and we saw a completely different player in the net. Maybe I'm grasping at straws, but I think if you look back at the numbers there was really only 1 bad stretch of play for 1 month from the middle of December until the middle of January.

    People can complain all they want, and they can pray we get rid of Bryz, but I still think he had a pretty good season. I just hope he can build on it now that he knows what he signed up for.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace23 View Post
    This.

    Bryz is here to stay, at least for now.

    Or...we could start a thread where the Flyers trade Bryz for Luongo, then amnesty Luongo, saving a couple million and using that money to make an offer on Rinne. That sounds plausible.
    And he shouldn't be going anywhere for at least a few years. I think everyone agrees that a 9 year deal wasn't good, but until they can find someone better, at least we have a fringe top 10 goalie in the NHL.

    BTW, Rinne signed for like 7 years in Nashville last year. just saying

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatch View Post
    If I'm not mistaken I think Luongo actually has more money and years left on his deal than Bryz....I do figure you're obviously joking ..but just wanted to make that point lol
    I know you're just going along with it, but Luongo has an opt out clause in like 2 or 3 years. Not a buy out, not an amnesty, but I think a team option to continue the contract.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by StryderSox View Post
    In no way am I using Bryz as a scape goat or insinuating his play was the reason we did not go deeper into the playoffs. My stance on Bryzgalov has always been the same from day one.....

    Nothing against the guy himself (I actually like his weird personality) but you dont give a goalie that long of a contract unless you are damn sure that he is amongst that single digit percentage of goalies that you can build a franchise around and rely on to steal games and playoff series year in and year out (see Martin Brodeur and Patirck Roy). My arguement has never had anything to due with blaming Bryzgalov for his play and always has been that this would be a better team if instead of signing Brygalov to that ridiculous contract we give Bob a true shot and use the Bryz money to bring on a top pairing franchise defenseman. So top getting so butt hurt

    PS..... I didnt bring up Bryzgalov in this thread. I simply responding to the question of what other options are available for next year. And saying that Halak and Elliot were a product of the St. Louis system only proves my point that we are better off with a lower profile goaltender like Bob and a true number one shut down defenseman


    this doesn't make sense for one glaring reason: the system. Lavi's system isn't a system that goalies love to play. it's a very aggressive, offensive-minded system. the system in st. louis is run by ken hitchcock, one of the most defensive-minded coaches in the game. the system in phoenix where Bryz came from? dave tippet, extremely defensive-minded. there's an adjustment period there for Bryz. he's coming from a team that was all about keeping the puck out of the net, to a team that was all about putting more pucks in the net than their opponent.


    in st. louis's system and phoenix's system, you can get away with having an average to above average goalie, because they collapse the net and don't let anything through in the first place. they make the goalie's job easy. the Flyers system makes the goalie stand alone a lot, and this past season, it happened even more than it should have due to breakdowns.


    i GUARANTEE you that Bryz will have a better season, purely based on if the Flyers play better defensively. GUARANTEE it. combine that with the fact that Bryz has a year under his belt in Philly and should be better in his own right, and you have yourself what you call a franchise goalie.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by delfinko View Post
    Because the point is that you aren't going to get a better goalie for next season.

    Bringing in Harding doesn't give us a better team this year. If that's the plan then you may as well use Leighton. At least we know he has some playoff experience, and if he's playing well, he can get to the finals.

    Trading for Halak would keep the goaltending situation about the same, while likely giving up a good young forward. That doesn't make the team better. I wouldn't entertain the idea of Elliot yet. I'd like to see more than one year of that kind of play.

    You can give Bob a "REAL" shot, but he's not as good as Bryz is right now. Playing Bob right now is a sign that we are playing for the future, not this year.

    Who can you get this year, that is going to make the team better and give the team a better shot at a cup THIS YEAR? So far no one has been able to answer the question. That's why everyone keeps asking that question.
    You are still looking at Bryzgalov as an isolated move and not one piece of a plan to build a championship team. Not once did I ever state or insinuate that simply not signing Bryzgalov or moving him in favour of another goalie AS AN ISOLATE MOVE made us a better team or that their was a better goalie available. The argument I have always made is that if you save yourself the 5.67 million dollar cap hit for the next 9 years (8 years now) and give Bob his shot COMBINED WITH signing a number one defenseman makes us a better team.

    If you want to argue that I am wrong then argue the point that this team is better with Bryzgalov in net and the current roster of defenseman (or a similar one due to cap restraints) playing in front of him then we would be with putting Bob in net and trading for or signing a true number one defenseman like Weber or Suter to play in front of him with the cap space saved on Bryz.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyeaglesman View Post
    this doesn't make sense for one glaring reason: the system. Lavi's system isn't a system that goalies love to play. it's a very aggressive, offensive-minded system. the system in st. louis is run by ken hitchcock, one of the most defensive-minded coaches in the game. the system in phoenix where Bryz came from? dave tippet, extremely defensive-minded. there's an adjustment period there for Bryz. he's coming from a team that was all about keeping the puck out of the net, to a team that was all about putting more pucks in the net than their opponent.


    in st. louis's system and phoenix's system, you can get away with having an average to above average goalie, because they collapse the net and don't let anything through in the first place. they make the goalie's job easy. the Flyers system makes the goalie stand alone a lot, and this past season, it happened even more than it should have due to breakdowns.


    i GUARANTEE you that Bryz will have a better season, purely based on if the Flyers play better defensively. GUARANTEE it. combine that with the fact that Bryz has a year under his belt in Philly and should be better in his own right, and you have yourself what you call a franchise goalie.
    If we tied a sweater to the goal posts this year and did the same thing next year and played better defensively, the empty sweater would also have a better year. Saying he will be better if we play better defense is like saying we will win more games if we score more goals. The point is that in order to player better defensively we need to somewhat rebuild the defense to make that possible. In order to rebuild the defense in a manner that allows us to play a strong defensive game we need to be able to bring in a couple of guys that can eat big minutes and handle themselves well in our end. In order to bring in those guys we have to have cap space for them to fit. Therefore my original argument stands that if we had opted for a lesser goalie with a more team friendly cap hit and used the extra to bring in a number one d-man we are a stronger team

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