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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Okay, let's be generous enough and give Wright his career numbers, shall we?

    Wright - .303/.384/.511, 138 wRC+, -27.6 UZR
    Freese - .298/.355/.499, 133 wRC+, 0.9 UZR

    Still think it's Wright by miles? Freese is on him. Wright is the right choice, but he isn't killing Freese here.
    fwiw, you can look at any sample size that I post about, the last 18 months is the most common sample size that I use.



    Who said Freese is finally putting it together? STL-DON?

    David Freese has about 900 big league plate appearances (counting post-season)

    Through 900 big league plate appearances, Wright had a career slash line of
    .302/.371/.524. 136 wRC+, to Freese and his 133 wRC+.

    I think Freese's slash line is about all he is ever going to produce. I don't think he needs to put anything together, he is an above average offensive third basemen.


    I want to make it clear. I don't think Freese is as good as Wright. But the posts saying it's Wright by miles, or 'lol' etc. Those are just incorrect. I know Freese is over-rated for what he did last post-season. But he is a decent player who has played well when healthy. If Wright didn't break back out this year, you could argue that Freese was actually better. But with his re-emergence to superstardom it's hard to argue that any longer.

    30 point higher OBP and 12 point higher SLG. Yes. I do.

    Oh and Freese hasn't had a single season of wRC+ above 127 I don't know where you are getting these numbers from. .288/.341/.469 is his line from the last two years.

    through 900 AB wright was 23 years old. at that age freese had 300 AB in the minors. You can't pull out arbitrary numbers like that it ignores age as a factor. So what you are saying is that Freese is almost as good as a snot-nosed, green, david wright. ( for those playing at home... you also can't look strictly at age as well because it ignores experience.)

    Freese is good. Wright is great. it is a laughable comparison... you can make it seem less laughable by cherry picking... but it's still laughable. It's Mike Scott- Nolan Ryan, or Larry Walker-Ken Griffy Jr, minny minosso-Stan Musial, Good, even very good-great.
    Last edited by flips333; 06-08-2012 at 02:43 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  2. #32
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    If Freese keeps up his current production pace, his WAR for the season might top David Wright's...right now.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymfan87 View Post
    If Freese keeps up his current production pace, his WAR for the season might top David Wright's...right now.
    Now I get it.
    Last edited by flips333; 06-08-2012 at 02:52 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  4. #34
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    I guess I should have specified "through his first 54 games."

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymfan87 View Post
    I guess I should have specified "through his first 54 games."
    no I am just ********.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    30 point higher OBP and 12 point higher SLG. Yes. I do.
    And after park adjustments, he is only 5% better as a hitter, while being a worse defensive player.


    Oh and Freese hasn't had a single season of wRC+ above 127 I don't know where you are getting these numbers from. .288/.341/.469 is his line from the last two years.
    It was last calendar year, and included the playoffs.


    through 900 AB wright was 23 years old. at that age freese had 300 AB in the minors. You can't pull out arbitrary numbers like that it ignores age as a factor. So what you are saying is that Freese is almost as good as a snot-nosed, green, david wright. ( for those playing at home... you also can't look strictly at age as well because it ignores experience.)
    I fully agree. Was just pulling up the numbers.

    ]Freese is good. Wright is great. it is a laughable comparison... you can make it seem less laughable by cherry picking... but it's still laughable. It's Mike Scott- Nolan Ryan, or Larry Walker-Ken Griffy Jr, minny minosso-Stan Musial, Good, even very good-great.
    Wright is better than Freese, I won't deny that. But I don't know that I'm ready to call Wright great again.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymfan87 View Post
    If Freese keeps up his current production pace, his WAR for the season might top David Wright's...right now.
    Wright - 3.7 fWAR - pace of 9.99

    David Freese - 1.1 fWAR pace of - 3.00

    Not even there lol.

    Wright has played 10% more this season than Freese of course.

    And this is assuming that Wright's defense really is back, and it isn't just a small sample size of course. And this is with Freese having a horrible last two weeks.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    And after park adjustments, he is only 5% better as a hitter, while being a worse defensive player.



    It was last calendar year, and included the playoffs.



    I fully agree. Was just pulling up the numbers.



    Wright is better than Freese, I won't deny that. But I don't know that I'm ready to call Wright great again.
    Let me put it this way. Unless Freese changes and gets dramatically better there is no chance he's a hall of famer. Wright on the other hand has a realistic shot for 3000 hits, 350 HR, and 1500 RBIs... from a third basemen. That put's him in the top 20 3Bmen ever. No he's not Schmdit/Brett great, not even Rolen/Jones great, but that's Santo great.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by flips333 View Post
    Let me put it this way. Unless Freese changes and gets dramatically better there is no chance he's a hall of famer. Wright on the other hand has a realistic shot for 3000 hits, 350 HR, and 1500 RBIs... from a third basemen. That put's him in the top 20 3Bmen ever. No he's not Schmdit/Brett great, not even Rolen/Jones great, but that's Santo great.
    And Wright entered the league 6 years earlier. Of course Wright has a better chance of being a hall of famer.

    The question asked is who would you want at third from here forward? Wright or Freese? Wright is the right answer, but it's not a laughable comparison like so many are making it out to be.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    And Wright entered the league 6 years earlier. Of course Wright has a better chance of being a hall of famer.

    The question asked is who would you want at third from here forward? Wright or Freese? Wright is the right answer, but it's not a laughable comparison like so many are making it out to be.
    If you assume Freese is a 3-4 WAR player and Wright is a 5-6 WAR player, that's a pretty bad comparison. It's like comparing Tulo and Yunel Escobar.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymfan87 View Post
    If you assume Freese is a 3-4 WAR player and Wright is a 5-6 WAR player, that's a pretty bad comparison. It's like comparing Tulo and Yunel Escobar.
    But it isn't a 'laughable' comparison, which is what so many are making it out to be. Clearly Wright is the better ball player here, I don't think anybody has denied that. My whole argument is that it is laughable, which it isn't.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    But it isn't a 'laughable' comparison, which is what so many are making it out to be. Clearly Wright is the better ball player here, I don't think anybody has denied that. My whole argument is that it is laughable, which it isn't.
    The problem here is we have a clearly have a different definition of laughable. For me It doesn't have to be augie Ojeda to arod to be laughable... it could be Miguel Tejada to Arod and still be laughable.
    Last edited by flips333; 06-11-2012 at 08:41 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPoon
    man with hair like fire can destroy souls with a twitch of his thighs.

  13. #43
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    Easy, David Wright.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    And after park adjustments, he is only 5% better as a hitter, while being a worse defensive player.



    It was last calendar year, and included the playoffs.



    I fully agree. Was just pulling up the numbers.



    Wright is better than Freese, I won't deny that. But I don't know that I'm ready to call Wright great again.
    I'm ready to call him great again. I was very skeptical of him getting back to the level he once was at when he was constantly putting up an OPS of .900 and playing great defense.

    But, he has literally made all the mechanical adjustments to get back to being the great player he once was.

    This is not just a hot start to a good season. He made the mechanical changes he had to make in order to start producing at the caliber his talent level is capable of producing.

    At this point, I'd be very surprised if Wright slumped back to his "less than stellar ways" from 2009-2011.
    DUDA


    Quote Originally Posted by VendettaRed07 View Post
    noah is gonna be a beast man.

    with him and harvey, its like were gonna have Goku and Vegetta in the same rotation

  15. #45
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    I like Freese and think he is a SOLID and even good 3b but, he isn't a David Wright and this is during what I would call his prime years where as during Wrights he was one of the best players in baseball bar none.

    At the moment though Wright is on track to have another insane season where as Freese is just putting up a good 3b year in a era of weak 3b. Wright at a 16% BB rate to 12% K rate is better then even his best years. He is a man on a mission and one of my fav. players to watch when he is completely healthy.

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