The Official Flyers 2012 Offseason Thread

[fanofphilly]

which is why like i was stating before...

Coburn / Grossman
Timo / Carle
Mez / Schenn

looks very attractive the more and more I look at it.

And of course this is speculating that Prongs is done. or LTIR'ed.

Gus / Manning / Bourdon / Bart to rotate.

IMO Bourdon should be traded as hes an RFA

[Giroux 4 MVP]

which is why like i was stating before...

Coburn / Grossman
Timo / Carle
Mez / Schenn

looks very attractive the more and more I look at it.

And of course this is speculating that Prongs is done. or LTIR'ed.

Gus / Manning / Bourdon / Bart to rotate.

IMO Bourdon should be traded as hes an RFA

I do like those pairings, but I really don't want carle any more, it may be biased but he makes more defensive errors then damn Lilja, you also have to remember we have Lilja still too, again I like the d that way but I feel we need one more good forward as well

[Phillysports101]

What's everyone's deal with Schenn? Why is he so desirable? Maybe it was just the way he played against the Flyers, but giving JVR, Briere, Read, a first, or Bob? That all just seems like too much for what I've seen. Add in the fact that he was basically pushed to the number 6 in Toronto, I don't think you need to give that much up for him.

Hes young and has tons of potential. He still needs some development, but he has all the potential in the world to become a shut down guy. Similar to how people are on the fence about JVR, Schenn is in the same boat in Toronto if not worse. I'd would be so pumped if we had him as a 3rd pairing.

[BaddNewz]

No, I don't fault Homer for going after a guy like Bryz. But with the contract we gave him it's almost like we were negotiating against ourselves. An eight year No movement clause just seems uneccessary. It's not like anyone cares right now because it's so far away...but in year 3 or 4 this deal has the potential to look awfully bad.

The same concept is Suter....this is almost the same situation as Bryz last year.....everyone wants a defenseman to fix things....Suter, by all accounts, is a solid guy...but if we give him a big overpay or crazy no trade terms then it could be a mess a few years down the road.

Bryz's contract is balanced over the entire length of it, 5.6 mil over the length of the contract. Which will actually be a great number if/when our defense evolves to protect him, and he becomes an Allstar goaltender.

Except it's really not the same at all. Suter isn't a 31 year old goalie, he's a 27 year old defenseman. You will be getting Suter as he enters his prime rather than the last 2-3 years of it. Plus defensemen typically last longer than goalies, discounting injuries. If you give him an 8 year contract, when it's over he will still be younger than Kimmo Timmonen is right now. If Suter is only as good as Timmonen has been the last 2-3 seasons, I would gladly take him for the next 8 years.

I'm not saying he's a must have, but to be able to add an all-star defenseman to an already good group on the blueline would be tremendous. Maybe Weber made him better, I won't say he did or didn't but he's not going to be an all star without having the talent. Pair him with Carle, Timmonen or Meszaros and he's still a very good defenseman and you have 3 very good defensive pairings.

FYI old goalies have been in style, if you havent noticed:

Tim Thomas 38 - 35W 2.36 GAA .920 Sv% 5 SO
Marty Brodeur 40 - 31W 2.41 GAA .908 Sv% 3 SO
Mikka Kiprusoff 36 - 35W 2.35 GAA .921 Sv% 4 SO
Jose' Theodore 36 - 22W 2.46 GAA .917 Sv% 3 SO
Tomas Vokoun 36 - 25W 2.51 GAA .917 Sv% 4 SO
Nikolai Khabibulan 39 - 12W 2.65 GAA .910 Sv% 2 SO
Johan Hedberg 39 - 17W 2.23 GAA .918 Sv% 4 SO

I think you hold off on Suter this summer. Take the chance Weber signs a 1 yr deal with Nashville and heads to UFA next year, then trade for his rights and give him a blank check next summer.

Bob+ for Schenn. Dooooo it.

They have Reimer and Gustavsson, why would they look into another goalie that has question marks about whether or not they can be a top goaltender in this league?

[delfinko]

I said a two part deal bob and briere for grabovski and schenn, you can probably get schenn for a 2nd rounder at this point like the flyers did with Mezsaros a few years back, I also think he just needs a change of scenery, he's really a very good talent, get him playing with his brother and a better environment, he might blossom.

I still think that's giving up too much. Also, isn't Grabovski a center? If Schenn can turn it around and become another Coburn, or Meszaros, then I'm cool with working out a way to get him. I just hadn't seen enough to warrant giving up any of the names being thrown around. You could be right, he may just need a change of scenery.

Briere for Grabovski is ok I guess, mostly because you get younger, but you aren't really gaining in that situation. You aren't filling a need, the cap numbers are pretty close, you'll get similar point production in the regular season if you're lucky, and you lose one of the best playoff performers in the NHL right now. I don't think it happens and I wouldn't even speculate on Briere being traded until you hear that the Flyers approach him about it. And if the Flyers do approach Briere for a trade I hope they give him the respect to give a list of teams he would like to go to and try to send him to one of those teams. He's earned that.

Listen i have no problem keeping / resigning Carle IF we can land a Schenn for Bob trade. Toronto is so butt hurt over a goalie that this could actually work in our favor. I have never had anything against Toronto and would love to see Bob get a chance somewhere. This would mean we would have to sign a backup or even draft a goalie and allow Leighton (cringe) the chance to be the backup.

But please understand Im not saying Suter sucks, its just that hes a better version of Carle who doesnt make as many defensive mistakes. He will cost too much, prob around 6+ million i would say at the least.

Schenn is Coburn 2.0. Remember how we got Coburn and what he has grown into? He is one of our most reliable d-mans out there. Schenn would be the same thing, and hes a better offensive threat then Coburn is. Plus lets not mention how cool it would be to be able to play with your brother again.

And G4MVP if you think Calre gets signed for 1 million less then Suter you're crazy. Suter is a lot better then Carle. But for Suter 6-8 million Carle 4-5 million I take Carle... And use that extra 3 million to lock up Jakub or both Zol + Betts something like that.

No way Toronto takes Dannys contract and plus his NMC he would of course have to waive. I think Homer likes Danny too much to be honest. Hes loved him since day one. Unlike how hes spoke of Carter and Richards.

We need to add a RW for sure as well

Homer was crying in the interviews after he traded those guys. It's pretty obvious he really liked those guys and was forced to trade them, very much like the way he was forced to sign Bryzgalov no matter what it took to do it. Why do you think he didn't say the team would be better without them, but different? Those 2 are the biggest scapegoats for the failure to win a championship as I've ever seen.

I think they move Briere to RW on a line with Schenn or Couturier as the center. Your top 3 RW are likely Briere, Simmonds and Voracek.

[phillyeaglesman]

people gotta get off the Bob to Toronto train. Toronto is gonna go hard after Luongo. they want a proven NHL goalie, not another prospect. they already have 2 or 3 goalie prospects in their system; they don't want another, they want a seasoned vet.


and even Bob for Schenn is too much at this point. he's fallen out of favor in toronto. anything more than really a 2nd round pick would be too much for him.

[Giroux 4 MVP]

I still think that's giving up too much. Also, isn't Grabovski a center? If Schenn can turn it around and become another Coburn, or Meszaros, then I'm cool with working out a way to get him. I just hadn't seen enough to warrant giving up any of the names being thrown around. You could be right, he may just need a change of scenery.

Briere for Grabovski is ok I guess, mostly because you get younger, but you aren't really gaining in that situation. You aren't filling a need, the cap numbers are pretty close, you'll get similar point production in the regular season if you're lucky, and you lose one of the best playoff performers in the NHL right now. I don't think it happens and I wouldn't even speculate on Briere being traded until you hear that the Flyers approach him about it. And if the Flyers do approach Briere for a trade I hope they give him the respect to give a list of teams he would like to go to and try to send him to one of those teams. He's earned that.



Homer was crying in the interviews after he traded those guys. It's pretty obvious he really liked those guys and was forced to trade them, very much like the way he was forced to sign Bryzgalov no matter what it took to do it. Why do you think he didn't say the team would be better without them, but different? Those 2 are the biggest scapegoats for the failure to win a championship as I've ever seen.

I think they move Briere to RW on a line with Schenn or Couturier as the center. Your top 3 RW are likely Briere, Simmonds and Voracek.

Grabovski can play wing and center that's why I out briere in that trade cause they play kinda similar and graby is much younger

[Giroux 4 MVP]

people gotta get off the Bob to Toronto train. Toronto is gonna go hard after Luongo. they want a proven NHL goalie, not another prospect. they already have 2 or 3 goalie prospects in their system; they don't want another, they want a seasoned vet.


and even Bob for Schenn is too much at this point. he's fallen out of favor in toronto. anything more than really a 2nd round pick would be too much for him.

I think you over value bob, someone awhile ago said that bob has the same potential as varlamov, which I no longer believe, I think bob at best would net a mid first round selection

[delfinko]

Hes young and has tons of potential. He still needs some development, but he has all the potential in the world to become a shut down guy. Similar to how people are on the fence about JVR, Schenn is in the same boat in Toronto if not worse. I'd would be so pumped if we had him as a 3rd pairing.

I understand that, but your last sentence is where I'm thrown. We're talking about giving up JVR, Briere, Bob, a first, Read, whoever else, for a 3rd line dman with a 3.6 million cap hit. Just go with Gustaffson if that's the cost.

Bryz's contract is balanced over the entire length of it, 5.6 mil over the length of the contract. Which will actually be a great number if/when our defense evolves to protect him, and he becomes an Allstar goaltender.



FYI old goalies have been in style, if you havent noticed:

Tim Thomas 38 - 35W 2.36 GAA .920 Sv% 5 SO
Marty Brodeur 40 - 31W 2.41 GAA .908 Sv% 3 SO
Mikka Kiprusoff 36 - 35W 2.35 GAA .921 Sv% 4 SO
Jose' Theodore 36 - 22W 2.46 GAA .917 Sv% 3 SO
Tomas Vokoun 36 - 25W 2.51 GAA .917 Sv% 4 SO
Nikolai Khabibulan 39 - 12W 2.65 GAA .910 Sv% 2 SO
Johan Hedberg 39 - 17W 2.23 GAA .918 Sv% 4 SO



They have Reimer and Gustavsson, why would they look into another goalie that has question marks about whether or not they can be a top goaltender in this league?

I'm not saying that goalies can't play at a high level past their prime, it's just not as likely as a defenseman doing it. What if Bryz doesn't decline as nicely as those guys have? What if he completely drops off, rather than slowly declines? OR what if he gets better like Tim Thomas? I doubt it, but I guess it's possible.

I was mostly just saying the two situations don't relate that well because of how different the positions typically decline.

[Giroux 4 MVP]

I understand that, but your last sentence is where I'm thrown. We're talking about giving up JVR, Briere, Bob, a first, Read, whoever else, for a 3rd line dman with a 3.6 million cap hit. Just go with Gustaffson if that's the cost.



I'm not saying that goalies can't play at a high level past their prime, it's just not as likely as a defenseman doing it. What if Bryz doesn't decline as nicely as those guys have? What if he completely drops off, rather than slowly declines? OR what if he gets better like Tim Thomas? I doubt it, but I guess it's possible.

I was mostly just saying the two situations don't relate that well because of how different the positions typically decline.

I really don't think they will be asking him for that much, I think bob alone could get schenn and Reimer kept getting hurt, and gustavsson was awful for the most part last season

[Giroux 4 MVP]

I say trade bob to Tampa along with a later pick for the number 10 pick in the draft and call it a day

[fanofphilly]

They have Reimer and Gustavsson, why would they look into another goalie that has question marks about whether or not they can be a top goaltender in this league?

Gusta is a joke and Reimer has the potential but Bob has better skills they have expressed interest in Bob last season and even this season. If the Flyes were smart they would do that...

Homer was crying in the interviews after he traded those guys. It's pretty obvious he really liked those guys and was forced to trade them, very much like the way he was forced to sign Bryzgalov no matter what it took to do it. Why do you think he didn't say the team would be better without them, but different? Those 2 are the biggest scapegoats for the failure to win a championship as I've ever seen.

I think they move Briere to RW on a line with Schenn or Couturier as the center. Your top 3 RW are likely Briere, Simmonds and Voracek.

Homer did what he needed to for the Media. There was a huge article saying how he was the brain behind the trade had to do something because while he loved their PLAY STYLE he didnt like the lack of leadership and remarks that were being said in the locker room. And thats the stuff as a fan we have no control over.

I have to agree with you, move Briere to wing problem solved!

[fanofphilly]

I say trade bob to Tampa along with a later pick for the number 10 pick in the draft and call it a day

sry x2 post.


Bob is not worth a 1st at all. You would have to pair him. Hes good and deserves a shot as a started and could evolve into a great goalie but right now lets not over value him lol

[Giroux 4 MVP]

I ment our later first round pick? How is that over valuing him?

[jc27]

I say trade bob to Tampa along with a later pick for the number 10 pick in the draft and call it a day

Why not ask Tampa for 3 number ones and Stamkos?