Pineda Diagnosed with Anterior Labral Tear, Surgery Set for May 1

[Yankees 1903]

If He is known as the cash hater, can I be known as the saggy balled fatty hater?

Even though I don't hate him at all. I just hate cellulite.

Good talk.

We all know you have a hatred for fat Leo. You should become CC's personal trainer.

[LeoYankee]

I'm afraid he'd use me as a toothpick.

[LeoYankee]

I do actually Despise Fred though. He is an embarrassment to pinstripes.

[CostanzaNumba0]

I don't hate cashman. I think he is a league average GM with a ton of resources. I like how he has put an emphasis on SABR stats, I like how he handles resigning our own players, I like how he has a propensity to build a damn good bullpen. However, in my opinion he has really **** the bed in recent years over really important things. A few examples, last year was the last year we could use our financial clout to go overslot and sign big time draftees, we didn't do it nearly to the extent we could, his scouting staff is minor league in terms of talent size and scope compared to tampa toronto etc, he really destroyed the chamberlain situation on so many fronts i won;t get into here, he overvalues most prospects and undervalues the one that couldve stepped in and helped us the most, and he rushes prospects through the system-IPK, hughes, Banuelos just to name a few.

[CostanzaNumba0]

Hughes was the 4th ranked prospect in baseball back in 2007 while Joba was 3rd in 2008. Just about everyone who is paid to scout and evaluate players had them pegged as much more than fillers and not just the Yankees. Why do you think the Jays wanted one of them in the deal?

Like I said it's easy to sit there and call them fillers now and act as if you know it all. However back in 07-09 I doubt you or anyone else would have called them fillers or only middle relievers.

People who do those rankings are human, they obviously got sucked into the NYY prospect hype machine. I understand hyping Joba because he was explosive, but hughes' stuff has never impressed me 91-93 righty with a loopy curve and below average cutter is a 4th starter, not a number 4 prospect

[Pinstripe power]

He throws 88 and happens to be an excellent pitcher unlike the fatty jr pedigree.

If Andy had this surgery, I wouldn't be so negative. But a young flamethrower now has to try to be crafty. Ain't happening.

i get that, but thats 3 examples of guys whop succeeded, and i know at least sanata did not have the scope done like pineda has the option of. sure its an up hill battle, but hes not compeltley a lost cause

[TrueYankee]

This thread sucks. The end.

[sauronthepower]

I see you more as someone who is trying to maintain/live up to the reputation that you have gained in this forum. You're known as the guy who does not like Cashman because of the moves he makes. Everyone who posts regulatory in this forum knows Sauron as the guy who has a problem with Cashman. I don't think anyone has that much of a problem with you not liking how Cashman operates but overtime it seems that you only become a really active poster when posting about Cashman.

I don't question you as a Yankees fan but when someone seems to have a bulk of their posts dealing with one area of discussion (anything that involves putting Cashman in a negative light) one can't help to think why that is.

[sauronthepower]

I see you more as someone who is trying to maintain/live up to the reputation that you have gained in this forum. You're known as the guy who does not like Cashman because of the moves he makes. Everyone who posts regulatory in this forum knows Sauron as the guy who has a problem with Cashman. I don't think anyone has that much of a problem with you not liking how Cashman operates but overtime it seems that you only become a really active poster when posting about Cashman.

I don't question you as a Yankees fan but when someone seems to have a bulk of their posts dealing with one area of discussion (anything that involves putting Cashman in a negative light) one can't help to think why that is.

Right now I'm putting Adam Dunn in a negative light.......

[sauronthepower]

I don't hate cashman. I think he is a league average GM with a ton of resources. I like how he has put an emphasis on SABR stats, I like how he handles resigning our own players, I like how he has a propensity to build a damn good bullpen. However, in my opinion he has really **** the bed in recent years over really important things. A few examples, last year was the last year we could use our financial clout to go overslot and sign big time draftees, we didn't do it nearly to the extent we could, his scouting staff is minor league in terms of talent size and scope compared to tampa toronto etc, he really destroyed the chamberlain situation on so many fronts i won;t get into here, he overvalues most prospects and undervalues the one that couldve stepped in and helped us the most, and he rushes prospects through the system-IPK, hughes, Banuelos just to name a few.

Actually I had you pegged in exactly the light you described above.

I put you in the "Guys who don't necessarily hate Cashman, but despise this trade....."

I would add that he HAS done a pretty good job of managing the executive portions of his job, especially keeping the various ego machines in check.

Problem is that his talent analysis is absolutely putrid.

There is a horribly long list of failures that is extremely top heavy in pitching and it just keeps going on and on. Cashman HAS to implement a new system or hire talent to make those decisions for him. The combination of overhype, developmental mismanagement and 3rd tier signings that pitch like 4th tier talent litters his resume.

[yankeesfan09]

Before we all get into a panic mode, this quote was taken from an interview with Dr. Colin Eakin:

Question: What are labral tears and how do they usually happen?
Dr. Eakin: Your shoulder is a ball and socket joint where the ball is the top of your arm and the socket is your shoulder. The labrum is a ring around the socket. It's spongy, soft and squishy. If you imagine your shoulder joint as a golf ball and tee, the tee isn't flat. The labrum is that ring that makes the golf tee concave so that the ball doesn't just roll right off. The labrum stabilizes the ball in the socket. When forces cause the ball to fall out of the socket, the labrum gets damaged.

There are two types of injuries that cause the ball to fall out of the socket: a traumatic event or chronic strains.

Question: What are the treatment options?
Dr. Eakin: If you want to return to your sport or resume normal activity, surgery is the only way to repair a torn labrum. Luckily, the procedure is now done orthoscopically so the incisions are very tiny. If the labral tear is small and does not destabilize the joint, the surgeons will just "clean it up" and make it less irritating and more comfortable for the patient. In cases where the labrum is pulled off the rim, it must be re-anchored, which is a more major surgery. The good news is that people who suffer from this injury almost always return to a full level of activity.

[nolushhere]

tell that to mark prior and brandon webb just to name a couple. Same injury, never came back to 1/3 of the pitcher they were.

This is why you dont trade prospects like montero. Pitchers get hurt way too often, and batters tend to make it longer without injuries that affect their game.

You also dont trade a hot batting prospect for a pitching prospect which is what pineda was, you only trade for a 27-30 veteren starter imo.

Pineda was way unproven.

[rudemechanical]

Anyone think Cash still has a job if the Boss is still around?

If the Boss were still around, The Bat would still be around, especially after that torrid September, where he OPS'd over 1. in the home yard.

The Boss was thick about certain things, but if he'd witnessed that effortless power stroke to right field, and watched ML pitchers pitching around a rookie who had been here for five minutes, he'd have forbidden any trade with the name "Montero" in it.

[TrueYankee]

Uh.....yeah.....about that!

At last count I pegged it at

Sauron
Webslinger
RudeMechanical
MuddyDog
Rubzzy
nysportsfan02

Guys who dont necessarily hate Cashman but are seriously deriding this move:

Costanza
Daoud or Dayners (I cant remember which)
Infernoscurse (you know I'm right on this 'curse.....you were against this deal from Day 1, BEFORE there was a hint of injury.....just sayin)

Either way man, you can't just blindly defend Cashman on this one. This is going to rank at all time historical levels of bad (probably worse than Buhner at the very least) and this is not hater-speak. This is fact, plain and simple, regardless of your opinion on Cashman.

There, I said it nicely.....

Are you THAT confident that this injury will derail his career and "rank at all time historical levels of bad" for the Yankees? How can you be so confident in something you have little knowledge of. He didnt fully tear the labrum and the rotator cuff was unharmed. Be careful of what you say because you are giving people a misconception of what really happened. Talk to me again in 2014 when we see results? Ok? Good, great, now...

Sorry, but this is simply not true. This must be how common misconceptions get started. Pineda's velocity dropped 3 mph in September from what it was in April and May.

I'm not sure where you can find this proof. ESPN showed Pineda's velocity throughout his entire season and it actually went up after June. This was also his rookie season. Who is to say it he simply did not tire out? The Mariners, like most teams, put an innings limit on young pitcher in their rookie season. You see it all the time.

Pineda games started in 2011:

July-5
August-4
September/October- 3

You think that decline is due to injury? You are foolish. That is the Mariners putting an innings limit on their young pitcher. Not to mention, they are nowhere near competing either.

1st half SO/BB is 3.14
2nd half SO/BB is 3.16

The numbers are virtually similar. There are no red flags.

[Webslinger]

Actually I had you pegged in exactly the light you described above.

I put you in the "Guys who don't necessarily hate Cashman, but despise this trade....."

I would add that he HAS done a pretty good job of managing the executive portions of his job, especially keeping the various ego machines in check.

Problem is that his talent analysis is absolutely putrid.

There is a horribly long list of failures that is extremely top heavy in pitching and it just keeps going on and on. Cashman HAS to implement a new system or hire talent to make those decisions for him. The combination of overhype, developmental mismanagement and 3rd tier signings that pitch like 4th tier talent litters his resume.

You put someone else in charge and there's no way we could have snatched Pineda away from Seattle for Montero and Noesi.