Will Schenn and Couturier be better than Richards and Carter?

[castan_b]

couturier is already better than carter ...

here is my arguement ... who would you rather have on your team in the playoffs right now?

the answer is the guy who can shut down the MVP of the league while providing great 2ndary scoring ...

Richie, at the moment, is better than Schenn ... but Richards has peaked, Schenn could over take him sooner than later

[1908_Cubs]

couturier is already better than carter ...
here is my arguement ... who would you rather have on your team in the playoffs right now?
the answer is the guy who can shut down the MVP of the league while providing great 2ndary scoring ...

Richie, at the moment, is better than Schenn ... but Richards has peaked, Schenn could over take him sooner than later

That is completely team dependent.

If I'm the Flyers and have no room on my top 3 or need for a goal scorer, I want the defensive minded Couturier. If I'm the Kings who can barely buy a goal, I don't need another non-scorer. I want the offensive Carter.

Don't be an idiot. Carter is a top 20/30 center in the entire league. Couts, while the potential is great, is not anywhere near that ranking right now. He's got a long way to go offensively to be in that discussion.

[mattyboy88]

That is completely team dependent.

If I'm the Flyers and have no room on my top 3 or need for a goal scorer, I want the defensive minded Couturier. If I'm the Kings who can barely buy a goal, I don't need another non-scorer. I want the offensive Carter.

Don't be an idiot. Carter is a top 20/30 center in the entire league. Couts, while the potential is great, is not anywhere near that ranking right now. He's got a long way to go offensively to be in that discussion.

Carter is lazy big for nothing pussssy and never came through when he had the opportunities. He gets a zero from me. The only thing he has is a wicked wrist shot.... with little accuracy

[delfinko]

Carter is lazy big for nothing pussssy and never came through when he had the opportunities. He gets a zero from me. The only thing he has is a wicked wrist shot.... with little accuracy

Sure, if you completely ignore his defense. Jeff Carter is vastly under rated in the Flyers section of this forum. I wasn't broken up about him leaving (I was upset about Richards though), and I think the change was needed, but he's so much better than he's given credit for here. I think Cubs might actually over rate him because of that, but he's been right about everything he's said about Carter.

My only real complaint about Carter was faceoffs, and he sometimes got into a mindset of just throwing the puck at the net. Not even that he wasn't good on faceoffs, just that he didn't win them when we had to win them. Faceoffs have been a general problem we've had the past 5 years though, it wasn't just him, and no one was really winning them when we had to.

[Hatch]

Even though I never really liked Carter much he is still a pretty strong player in this league....I think it's his attitude that makes people under appreciate him a little. He's not a guy that LOOKS like he's trying all that hard when he's out there and you know how that goes in this town. For all the good things he can do people don't totally buy into him because he doesn't have that intense kind of demeanor on the ice..

[StryderSox]

That is completely team dependent.

If I'm the Flyers and have no room on my top 3 or need for a goal scorer, I want the defensive minded Couturier. If I'm the Kings who can barely buy a goal, I don't need another non-scorer. I want the offensive Carter.

Don't be an idiot. Carter is a top 20/30 center in the entire league. Couts, while the potential is great, is not anywhere near that ranking right now. He's got a long way to go offensively to be in that discussion.

Couts has 3 goals and 4 points playing 3rd line minutes so far this playoffs. Carter has 0 goals and 2 points playing top line minutes so far this playoffs. Couts is also tasked with shutting down Malkin which he has done an excellent job with. I know it is just my opinion but I dont ever remember Carter having the kind of playoff impact for the Flyers that Couts has had on this series. Add in the fact that he is only 19 while Carter is in his prime and I take Couts all day long and double time on the weekends.

[thPrizedFighter]

Like Cubs had mentioned a lot of this (^) is team and/or opponent dependent.

I too would take Couts over Carter. I was a big fan of Richards and was a little sour to see him go, but I'm already getting the feeling I'd take Schenn over Richards...especially with the fact that we have Couts.

[StryderSox]

Like Cubs had mentioned a lot of this (^) is team and/or opponent dependent.

I too would take Couts over Carter. I was a big fan of Richards and was a little sour to see him go, but I'm already getting the feeling I'd take Schenn over Richards...especially with the fact that we have Couts.

The Schenn over Richards is a little different. Richards had a little more to offer and I dont think Schenn is quite there yet although I think he will eventually be as good if not better than Richards is now. Again if you factor in that we also have Simmonds because of that trade.....

Schenn + Simmonds is much better than Richards alone just the same as Couts and Voracek are much better than Carter alone. These two deals gave us two players that will be just as good as what we gave up if not better and also added to addtional players that have been very good and added a lot of depth in Simmonds and Voracek.

[delfinko]

Couts has 3 goals and 4 points playing 3rd line minutes so far this playoffs. Carter has 0 goals and 2 points playing top line minutes so far this playoffs. Couts is also tasked with shutting down Malkin which he has done an excellent job with. I know it is just my opinion but I dont ever remember Carter having the kind of playoff impact for the Flyers that Couts has had on this series. Add in the fact that he is only 19 while Carter is in his prime and I take Couts all day long and double time on the weekends.

Just saying:

Couturier only trails Giroux among forwards on the Flyers in time-on-ice in the playoffs. It's mostly for defensive purposes, but the difference in total ice time between Couturier and Carter is less than 2 minutes per game. They both only have points in one game. Couturier has 4 points among 20 goals scored, Carter has 2 points among 9 goals scored.

Also, have you watched the Kings-Canucks series at all? Maybe Carter doesn't have 4 points but from the parts of the series I've watched he's looked pretty good. He's not a franchise savior, but he's a good piece to any team that needs some offense.

They play different positions and they play a different game, it's apples and oranges.

I'm not saying I'd rather have Carter on the Flyers, and I'm not even saying if I were a GM of a different team that I'd choose Carter over Couturier, but you people act as if he has the talent of Jody Shelley without the tough guy attitude.

[StryderSox]

Just saying:

Couturier only trails Giroux among forwards on the Flyers in time-on-ice in the playoffs. It's mostly for defensive purposes, but the difference in total ice time between Couturier and Carter is less than 2 minutes per game. They both only have points in one game. Couturier has 4 points among 20 goals scored, Carter has 2 points among 9 goals scored.

Also, have you watched the Kings-Canucks series at all? Maybe Carter doesn't have 4 points but from the parts of the series I've watched he's looked pretty good. He's not a franchise savior, but he's a good piece to any team that needs some offense.

They play different positions and they play a different game, it's apples and oranges.

I'm not saying I'd rather have Carter on the Flyers, and I'm not even saying if I were a GM of a different team that I'd choose Carter over Couturier, but you people act as if he has the talent of Jody Shelley without the tough guy attitude.

I didnt say Carter was not still a good offensive weapon in the NHL and is far more valuable then a lot of other guys but in my opinion not Couturier. They may have similar minutes but a lot of Couturier's minutes come on the penalty kill or shadowing Malkin or Crosby. Those are hard minutes to play. The fact that it was suggested that it is idiotic to think that Couts was just as valuable if not more valuable than Carter at this point is idiotic in itself. My point is that Couturier is more valuable to the Flyers than Carter at this point and if you are going to compare you have to consider the complete trade and compare Couts + Voracek to what Carter brings.

Personally I dont care about who is more valuable to LA or any other team. All I care is that the Flyers are a much better team with Couts and Voracek in the lineup than with Carter in the lineup. I would also tend to same the same about Simmonds and Schenn over Richards.

[Annalise]

I'll always love Richie.

That goal in the Montreal series 2 years ago...just wow.

[Phillysports101]

I didnt say Carter was not still a good offensive weapon in the NHL and is far more valuable then a lot of other guys but in my opinion not Couturier. They may have similar minutes but a lot of Couturier's minutes come on the penalty kill or shadowing Malkin or Crosby. Those are hard minutes to play. The fact that it was suggested that it is idiotic to think that Couts was just as valuable if not more valuable than Carter at this point is idiotic in itself. My point is that Couturier is more valuable to the Flyers than Carter at this point and if you are going to compare you have to consider the complete trade and compare Couts + Voracek to what Carter brings.

Personally I dont care about who is more valuable to LA or any other team. All I care is that the Flyers are a much better team with Couts and Voracek in the lineup than with Carter in the lineup. I would also tend to same the same about Simmonds and Schenn over Richards.

This.

[TeaPot]

First, a story. My son's birthday is right around Thanksgiving, and every year his mother gets him tickets to the Flyers game on Black Friday. Of course he always takes me with him. Last year of Richards/Carter, we're at the game, and during warmups I point out those two boys to him, and guaranteed a Flyers loss. Both of them were visibly hung over. Both of them were invisible during the game, and yes, the Flyers lost.

Now, I have no problem with guys in their 20's hitting the bars. Did it myself. But show up for the friggin' game the next day, please. It was Christmas in June for me last year when Homer dealt those two drunks outta here.

Turning to the discussion, Schenn is Richards without the miserableness. He'll be a good two way player, and a leader. He'll peak around the level that Richards did the year the Flyers went to the finals against Chicago. Off the ice, with the media, and in the locker room, he'll be an asset rather than the liability that Richards was.

You can't compare Couts and Carter. Two very different players. Coutourier doesn't have the sniper in him like Carter, but is already a vastly better defensive player (although Carter was actually a better faceoff guy than most people think). I think Couts tops out as a top-six forward and a 25 goal, 60 point guy. I still think he was the second best player in that draft, and am stunned he was there when the Flyers selected at No. 8 (thank you, mono). That being said, I wonder what a couple summers of power skating training does for Couts. If he fills out and picks up a step, he could be a scary individual.

[Dark Donnie]

I'll always love Richie.

That goal in the Montreal series 2 years ago...just wow.

"The Shift".... One of my favorite series of plays I ever seen.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...ZU6zGRLZ_9jM0g

[delfinko]

Haha I just showed that video to my dad last night. We were discussing the differences in the team from last year to this year, and I mentioned "The Shift" will always be the reason I love Richards.