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View Poll Results: Best AL East SS in 2012

Voters
188. You may not vote on this poll
  • Hardy

    47 25.00%
  • Escobar

    82 43.62%
  • Jeter

    59 31.38%
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Results 61 to 75 of 253
  1. #61
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    Can't believe everyone is picking Yunel. I'll go with Hardy.

    The Wizards' missing piece.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yankees 1903 View Post
    Yankees forum Press release: 7chuck7 does not represent the views of the PSD Yankees forum. We were very happy with Jeter's improved bat during the 2nd half of the 2011 season and his good start this season. However we do not condone the use of hustle, ticket sales, grit, and leadership as a way to determine the playing ability of a MLB player.
    Wow! An official Yankees forum press release. Thank you. Nice to have a Yankee spokesperson right here on the forum.
    "Well, that kind of puts a damper on even a Yankee win."
    -- Yankees announcer Phil Rizzuto after reading a bulletin that Pope Paul VI had died

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yankees 1903 View Post
    Yankees forum Press release: 7chuck7 does not represent the views of the PSD Yankees forum. We were very happy with Jeter's improved bat during the 2nd half of the 2011 season and his good start this season. However we do not condone the use of hustle, ticket sales, grit, and leadership as a way to determine the playing ability of a MLB player.
    +1 for nullifying the "but he's our captain" argument.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Haha View Post
    Range is overrated.
    sarcasm...or....?


    Starlin Castro and Asdrubal Cabrera have great range, but they both mess up a lot of routine plays.

    But their range still keeps balls in the infield and still manage to take away base hits.

    Range is one of the most important factors for being a good shortstop.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    sarcasm...or....?


    Starlin Castro and Asdrubal Cabrera have great range, but they both mess up a lot of routine plays.

    But their range still keeps balls in the infield and still manage to take away base hits.

    Range is one of the most important factors for being a good shortstop.
    Range is very important, yes. I am thrilled watching Nunez fill in for Jeter, dashing back and forth, until he inevitably kicks a ground ball into the third row at a key part of the game. I just think, while range is very important, it is focused on a bit too heavily while reliable hands are focused on a bit too lightly.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Haha View Post
    Range is very important, yes. I am thrilled watching Nunez fill in for Jeter, dashing back and forth, until he inevitably kicks a ground ball into the third row at a key part of the game. I just think, while range is very important, it is focused on a bit too heavily while reliable hands are focused on a bit too lightly.
    Well most defensive metrics (I'm assuming that's what your original argument was, if not, just dismiss this post) focus on the total number of outs that a player makes when compared to their counterparts at the same position based on the number of balls hit in their directions.

    It's all based on the number of outs the fielder makes, so that extra range might give guys like Castro and Cabrera extra outs, but they make so many other mistakes that stats like the ever flawed UZR still highlight that they mess up too many routine plays.

    One mistake I wish middle infielders could be properly penalized for is messing up double plays. Wether it's a double pump out of the glove or whatever. If they still get one of the outs, it just looks like a fielders choice and the pitcher doesn't get the double play he earned. There is something else that defensive metrics (nor traditional defensive statistics) know how to properly calculate. Castro and DeWitt have messed up 4 double play opportunities and executed one in this Cubs/Cards game today, which has helped the Cards to get 6 runs by the 5th inning. It isn't all Maholm's fault, he got the ground balls he needed but his middle infielders didn't help him out.

    I am excited about the new camera data to be released, hopefully within a year from now.
    Last edited by Jeffy25; 04-15-2012 at 03:50 PM.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Well most defensive metrics (I'm assuming that's what your original argument was, if not, just dismiss this post) focus on the total number of outs that a player makes when compared to their counterparts at the same position based on the number of balls hit in their directions.

    It's all based on the number of outs the fielder makes, so that extra range might give guys like Castro and Cabrera extra outs, but they make so many other mistakes that stats like the ever flawed UZR still highlight that they mess up too many routine plays.

    One mistake I wish middle infielders could be properly penalized for is messing up double plays. Wether it's a double pump out of the glove or whatever. If they still get one of the outs, it just looks like a fielders choice and the pitcher doesn't get the double play he earned. There is something else that defensive metrics (nor traditional defensive statistics) know how to properly calculate. Castro and DeWitt have messed up 4 double play opportunities and executed one in this Cubs/Cards game today, which has helped the Cards to get 6 runs by the 5th inning. It isn't all Maholm's fault, he got the ground balls he needed but his middle infielders didn't help him out.

    I am excited about the new camera data to be released, hopefully within a year from now.
    Good points. But I was talking about what we focus on as fans, not critiquing the stats. I could not agree more about the double plays. I wonder if there will ever be a way to settle that very important issue. And I too am excited for the cameras. I want to give more credibility to defensive metrics--as they stand now, I can't--and hopefully this will be the way forward.

  8. #68
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    ^ yeah, they are pretty bad compared to all other baseball metrics.

    Offensively, I feel like wOBA and wRC+ are pretty close to accurate since it's based on scoring runs. That's pretty easy to quantify. You have to pass four bases to score a run, and each base has an easy to quantify amount.

    Pitching metrics are coming along, but not as accurate as offensive metrics.

    and defensive metrics have constant holes and errors. They are better than say fielding percentage, but they have a ways to go.

    The camera data should really help, but I'm not ready to anoint that information great either, I think it will take awhile to properly categorize the information and to use it correctly.

    Were getting there, but we have a ways to go too.

  9. #69
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    Jeter still has something left, Not a bad hitter still I see him hitting 310 this year, but at this point of his career he isnt better then hardy, or escabar
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  10. #70
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    Not in the field but at the plate right now. Three run homer
    Quote Originally Posted by CubbieSteve View Post
    Squibble Squabble

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    ^ yeah, they are pretty bad compared to all other baseball metrics.

    Offensively, I feel like wOBA and wRC+ are pretty close to accurate since it's based on scoring runs. That's pretty easy to quantify. You have to pass four bases to score a run, and each base has an easy to quantify amount.

    Pitching metrics are coming along, but not as accurate as offensive metrics.

    and defensive metrics have constant holes and errors. They are better than say fielding percentage, but they have a ways to go.

    The camera data should really help, but I'm not ready to anoint that information great either, I think it will take awhile to properly categorize the information and to use it correctly.

    Were getting there, but we have a ways to go too.
    I'm happy to say I'm looking forward to getting there. There is nothing wrong with better information; just as there is nothing wrong with being a fan for fun.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by The X Factor View Post
    Not in the field but at the plate right now. Three run homer
    Jeet is MASHING right now. I don't think it's a fluke: he looked great in spring, also. I think he's got a lot left in the tank.

  13. #73
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    Jeter looks the best right now and has the most intangibles so I'll go with him.

  14. #74
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    Hardy gets the job done better, Yunel is too flashy and isn't a team player. Talent wise, Yunel, but player wise, HARDY.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atl Bill View Post
    Hardy gets the job done better, Yunel is too flashy and isn't a team player. Talent wise, Yunel, but player wise, HARDY.
    Considering you're a Braves fan, I respect your opinion.. But Yunel has been ANYTHING, but a poor team player who's too flashy. He's everything you could ask for minus the pop. He's making Adeiny Hechavarria movable.


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