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  1. #31
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    Ok

    I think we are on the same page for the most part now.. The only difference is that it took Edmonton and Pit. Several years of SUCKING ***** to get to the point they are now. Same with the Capitols. You all of those teams had at LEAST one or more #1/#2 overall picks for several years. And they still needed to luck out and not screw up everything else. Look at the NYI. They have had a #1 pick, but it takes more than one young stud to develop a team. I'm not terribly interested in being the worst team in the NHL for 3-5 years so we can become a top team 3-5 years after that.... I don't think any fans are. We need to be better at drafting.. which I think this GM and staff has proven that they are. And we need to make more smart signings/trades. Which I think they are on the right track to doing. I agree that Cullen is over paid.. But when we signed him we had just about zero depth at center.. Now we seem to have a stockpile of active players and prospects. I think This is certianly Cullens last year here, if he isn't traded. As for PMB, Its tuff. But based on your analysis Crosby should quite the game too. (Ok, thats extreem) Unless PMB comes back and can prove that he isn't a health risk he walks at the end of next year, or is signed to a two way deal that pays him peanuts aside from incentives. You can't arguee the guy has skills, but he apparently has a soft head also. I think Fletcher has shown that the past year or two his intent has been to sign young guys and draft well. Along the lines of what Edmonton is doing. I think it will work. Would i like to see the Owner step up and spend some $ this year too continue to get younger and more talented.. Damn Skippy!! It is just my opinion, but I think the GM is on the right track.. Lets hope they take some of the $ avilible and continue to prove it to us though.

    Here's to finishing in the bottom 2-5 this year and getting a stud in a fairly deep "top end" of the draft!! As we sit if we play our cards right we could be in line for a top 3 pick!!

  2. #32
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    ya we need to keep losing which saddens me to say

  3. #33
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    It sucks that we have to lose to get to this point, but at this point I am super happy that the Wild at this point have not given out any contracts especially big ones that other teams have shelled out to get some players. Imagine if we would have signed Ville Leino to that contract, or Erhoff, both good players but those contracts are awful and we are much more fortunate going into this and next off season looking at 20mil+ in cap room to sign these "big" name players everyone wants, but you also have to realize most of Edm and Pit depth and great players have come from the draft, something we are still waiting to see the fruits of and should start seeing next year with Bulmer, Zucker, Granlund and Coyle (Maybe Brodin).

    I think the biggest and most important thing to look at, hockey futures had us at the 29th team in depth of prospects last year. And this year we were number 9 or something and the only team with 3 players in the top 15 (Granlund #2, Coyle was 12 I think and Brodin was 10?) and 5 in the top 50? And that wasnt including Zucker or Phillips if I remember correctly. Remember that doesnt include Scandella (a future top pairing) and Spurgeon our best D man right now or Falk who is proving to be pretty good. That is IMPRESSIVE, what Fletcher has done with our prospects is 10x better then signing players and putting them into our system instead of having them grow around our system. And as to your Belanger/Nystrom/Powe rant yes your right management signed and has put players into spots in our line up they dont belong. But it was mostly out of need. Who we were gonna do at center if we didnt sign and overpay Cullen? I agree I never wanted him here or us paying him anywhere near that much but we literally had no depth two years ago, so we had to overpay. In hindsight, we havent run into any cap issues so I dont see the problem, and if we fail again next year he will be a great trading piece. Look at what teams got for Gaustad/Pahlsson/Moore this year and Cullen is better then all of them imo. But also remember that players like Nystrom/Powe/Belanger are NEEDED to win the cup. Im sure this year we will sign or trade for some 3rd/4th line guys but hey we will need them especially since the youth movement at the skill position is coming and they will need more mentors then Koivu.

    Also on the bright side, if we keep this up were looking at at least a top 3 pick. Yakupov/Grigor/Forsberg/Galy are all there for us (which I was surprised but they said they would be interested in Galy at wherever our pick is) and all could potentially have an NHL impact next year. Morgan Reilly/Dumba and other top D men are their too, which is something of bigger need for us but management made it clear they will take the best player and not draft by position.

    There are going to be growing pains, we went from a team with a high profile player carrying us into the playoffs with a great coach and fantastic system, but we also paid a price for bad management and giving up youth/draft picks for older vet's to carry us. Now we are building a healthy organization with GREAT prospect depth, our management has been heralded by other teams for their drafting the past few years. Improvements will come it just takes time, you cant really fail doing things the way we are now.

  4. #34
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    Trade?

    I think the wild should sign harding to a 1-2 year deal at slightly above market value... 2-3million for him, then trade backstrom to the highest bidder. Teams may be more likely to take Backstrom with only 1 year currently at 6mil. It frees up some cap space. Brings Hacket up for 1-2 years as a backup/potential starter..

    I'd trade him for a mid/high first rounder alone....

    Thoughts?

    I'd also like to see Cullen go this year via trade maybe also...

    I guess it depends on how the youngsters come into the system.. If they are ready... Make room and gather assets.. If not, Keep cullen for the remainder of the contract.

  5. #35
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    of course the wild miss out on the damn lottery ugh we need offense in thee worst way

  6. #36
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    only a MN team is dumb enough to start winning when it doesn't matter and lose out on a future star. Now we are just out of a spot where we could have gotten a meaningful player. And if anyone thinks we are getting Parise or Suter your dreaming, I appreciate the enthusiasm but there is no way those guys would come to this disaster of a franchise right now. Our GM is already making excuses and saying the market will be tough and keeps referring to "our young guys coming up" as if all of them are going to pan out. It will be another year of signing a couple 30 point a year guys for 4 years or so and way overpay them. If Matt Cullen and or Pierre MB are around again next year I don't think I can watch this team anymore, I despise them, they are both overpayed you now whats. I'm sorry if my views are too real for some people but MN fans need to stop living in candyland and realize the idiocracy of MN sports and demand more of them. Tell these owners to spend money and go for a championship like all the other teams or take a hike.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by MNWILD2012 View Post
    only a MN team is dumb enough to start winning when it doesn't matter and lose out on a future star. Now we are just out of a spot where we could have gotten a meaningful player. And if anyone thinks we are getting Parise or Suter your dreaming, I appreciate the enthusiasm but there is no way those guys would come to this disaster of a franchise right now. Our GM is already making excuses and saying the market will be tough and keeps referring to "our young guys coming up" as if all of them are going to pan out. It will be another year of signing a couple 30 point a year guys for 4 years or so and way overpay them. If Matt Cullen and or Pierre MB are around again next year I don't think I can watch this team anymore, I despise them, they are both overpayed you now whats. I'm sorry if my views are too real for some people but MN fans need to stop living in candyland and realize the idiocracy of MN sports and demand more of them. Tell these owners to spend money and go for a championship like all the other teams or take a hike.
    Man if your going to be one of these people then good riddance. So many of thes fair weather fans come in here and ***** how you dont think you can watch this or that team anymore cause they are losing. Well get over it. The only way to sustain a franchise and keep it healthy is by having some pretty ****** years and building through the draft. This is becoming more and more true in every sport. Facts are, we are the first team EVER to have 5 prospects in the top 75 of Hockeyfuture in the same year. As far as not panning out yeah they probably wont all become top line 100pt players, but Granlund, Brodin and Coyle are all pretty sure bets at this point being ranked 2nd 12th and 14th. Add in Hackett and Keumper two future good NHL caliber goalies. And Larsson the top rookie in the SEL, our future is extremely bright.

    As far as having no chance at Parise or Suter well that was a pretty ignorant comment. As long as we have the cap space then we have the chance. You really dont think Parise would be lured by a 7-8m per year contract to come home where his dad was a star, he was a star growing up and where he has a house? Yeah he will look and see that our past couple of years arent the greatest, but he also knows that its a player like him and a couple solid D away from the playoffs and then building from there. A major selling point is he can come here and play for his hometown, how great would it be to come back home and help The State of Hockey raise a cup...thats exactly what we need to be telling him.

    As far as the draft goes I think missing out on the top 3 is a blessing in a way. Yakupov is no sure thing, and we really need some solid D prospects as we are super thin there besides Brodin. I would love for us to get Reinhart or Dumba, I would take Dumba. Forwards are pretty hit and miss in this draft after Yakupov, Grigor, Forsberg and Galy. If none of them fall to us, and Reilly doesnt fall to us than Dumba with his extreme physical game and above average puck moving skills would be my choice. He also is a pretty damn good skater
    Last edited by pidg88; 04-11-2012 at 04:19 PM.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by MNWILD2012 View Post
    only a MN team is dumb enough to start winning when it doesn't matter and lose out on a future star. Now we are just out of a spot where we could have gotten a meaningful player. And if anyone thinks we are getting Parise or Suter your dreaming, I appreciate the enthusiasm but there is no way those guys would come to this disaster of a franchise right now. Our GM is already making excuses and saying the market will be tough and keeps referring to "our young guys coming up" as if all of them are going to pan out. It will be another year of signing a couple 30 point a year guys for 4 years or so and way overpay them. If Matt Cullen and or Pierre MB are around again next year I don't think I can watch this team anymore, I despise them, they are both overpayed you now whats. I'm sorry if my views are too real for some people but MN fans need to stop living in candyland and realize the idiocracy of MN sports and demand more of them. Tell these owners to spend money and go for a championship like all the other teams or take a hike.
    The only way these two are not on the team next year is IF we trade them.
    Cullen is servicable but was forced to play outside of his expected roll. He is NOT a #1 center.. I will admit with some of the youth coming up, i'd like to see the wild trade him for a top (by top i mean first 2 rounds) pick in the draft.

    PMB.... You dont' even have to watch him.. He is out all the time... No one can deny that he brings some amazing skills to the ice when healthy.. He isn't Crosby or Ovi. But he has some mad skills.. If you can't see that you don't know what your looking for. His contract is an insurance issue for the wild.. it sucks that he counts against the cap, but we aren't planning on spending to the Cap probably anyways.

    As for the "team being dumb"... Smart money says Fletcher was squirming in his chair when the team started winning.

    BUT the players are playing for contracts and pride. They will play hard "generally" all the time.. And YEO was hired to WIN GAMES not tank at the end just for a draft pick.. I'm as frustrated as the next fan that we won those games. But I don't hold it against them. They are paid to play and win. Even if they lost all of those games, they don't go out the next time and loose just so we can get a higher draft pick.. Talk about a comment not looking at the big picture.... WOW

    And we are not "just out of a spot where we could get a meaningful star" I think we are right on the fringe. I've done my share of digging. The top 4 forwards are very strong. The top 2 D-men are studs, the next several D-men are very high upside players and we are right where we need to be. We will still have a shot at one of the top 4 deffensemen in the draft most likely.. If we dont', it is likely that one of the top forwards falls to us.. I don't forsee a forward falling to us though... I think for the needs of the team (We need some young puck moving offensive D-men) we are in a pretty good spot. Its not great, but 7th in this draft is leaps and bounds better than 10th..

  9. #39
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    I'm not so sure

    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    As far as having no chance at Parise or Suter well that was a pretty ignorant comment. As long as we have the cap space then we have the chance. You really dont think Parise would be lured by a 7-8m per year contract to come home where his dad was a star, he was a star growing up and where he has a house? Yeah he will look and see that our past couple of years arent the greatest, but he also knows that its a player like him and a couple solid D away from the playoffs and then building from there. A major selling point is he can come here and play for his hometown, how great would it be to come back home and help The State of Hockey raise a cup...thats exactly what we need to be telling him.

    As far as the draft goes I think missing out on the top 3 is a blessing in a way. Yakupov is no sure thing, and we really need some solid D prospects as we are super thin there besides Brodin. I would love for us to get Reinhart or Dumba, I would take Dumba. Forwards are pretty hit and miss in this draft after Yakupov, Grigor, Forsberg and Galy. If none of them fall to us, and Reilly doesnt fall to us than Dumba with his extreme physical game and above average puck moving skills would be my choice. He also is a pretty damn good skater
    I would agree, on the top 3 draft prospects, but I think Nail has a pretty strong chance of being a stud as well as forsberg and Grigor... Galy is a toss up in my mind. We have been Mocked Dumba, Rehinart and Trouba in many of the mocks i've seen. A couple old ones had Galy an Forsberg falling to us but I don't see that happening any more.

    As for Parise and Sutter. I think we have a better chance at Sutter than Parise. Zach has openly stated he wants to be on a CUP CONTENDING TEAM. Not just a playoff contending building for the future team.. he's 27 years old (I think) and that means only a couple more years in his prime. The guy is already making 6 mill per year so he's loaded. If you had an offer from the wild for 6 mill per and an offer from the redwings for 5mil per and your already rich and really want to get your hands on Lord Stanleys cup... where do you sign?? Home town or not, Detroit isn't that far from the twin cities and they've got a pretty good history of being a competitor.. Not to mention they'll have right about the same cap space themselves as the wild do. Heck I could see the wings making a run at both Sutter and Parise. They have almost 16 million coming off the books on 4 players 6 of which is Lidstrom's contract and he is retiring. If I were the Wings I'd make a 5-7 million offer to each of those guys then sign a servicable 2 more guys at 1-2 million any day of the week.. Same money out the door with equal or better tallent than the current roster and they are an INSTANT Cup Favorite next year. I wouldn't even be supprised to see him stay in NJ if they make a deep run in the playoffs.

    Sutter is in it for the money. IMHO which gives us a better shot. I'd be intersted in signing sutter and any one of Penner, Boyes, Doan (If he'll leave the Yotes... "NEver thought i'd type that in a comment before").. I still belive that i'm not all about dishing out a huge long term contract to anyone.. How many 30+ year old players in the league are really worth more than 6 million.. Heater sure isn't.. I like him, but its a big contract for 25 ish goals and 25 ish assists. Though I will be happy to see that 7.5 million come off the books the year before we look to extend some of our youth..
    Last edited by Tg1; 04-11-2012 at 05:26 PM.

  10. #40
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    Well the only thing I would disagree with is that every top major athlete right behind winning (or before depending on who) is the dollar signs. Its not about making 6 million a year, its about what your worth. Parise is worth 6-7m a year, if he is offered 5m by Detroit he might see it as an insult. Imagine if you think your worth 60-70k a year at the job your interviewing for and all of a sudden they offer you 50k. Wouldnt you be insulted a little? Now multiply that by 100 because of an athlete's extreme ego.

    I dont believe there is any way Forsberg falls to us. Landeskog and Forsberg are pretty darn similar, with Forsberg probably not just being as polished and NHL ready. I think our best bet is to draft the best D man available and hope they are ready in two years instead of the usual 3-4 it takes a D man to develop. Or we get lucky and find the next Fowler/Myers enter name of recent NHL ready D man drafted haha. We really need a D who can move the puck. Spurg is alright at it, same with Scandella but we need a true PP leader. I honestly wish we were at the 3rd or 5th so we could get that, but Dumba would bring above average puck movement and way above average toughness. Nothing makes me more happy then seeing a D man make a good outlet pass in one zone and join the rush, and then coming back and laying a forward flat on his *** when he tries to enter the zone. Dumba can bring both.

    And my only argument against Suter is I just dont think we need a player like him right now.If our D stays healthy and Scandella/Falk/Spurgeon/Brodin keep developing and becoming better we dont need to sink 7m in him. Im not saying we dont need a great defender, we do, but we are better off developing our own in house. It would be much better fit going to a forward. I think Parise-Koivu-Heatley easily bring Heatley back to 30-40G, I think Heatley reaches 30G this year if Koivu isnt out so long.

  11. #41
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    Pidg the only thing I disagree with you is on Yakupov he is going to be a stud he is the real deal. Honestly as much as i think Suter would hep a ton Parise gives us goal scoring which as always is something we need. This is why we cheer for the Devils to lose in the first round

  12. #42
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    I think Yakupov COULD be a huge stud. Especially if he can put on weight. But I think he is not as a sure thing as say Taylor Hall the last sniper-esque player. I also think there is a certain bust possibility with him. I follow the draft closer then I do regular season, and if there is a question I have about Yakupov its about commitment. I mean the kid was the biggest star and skipped out on the All Star game and was then suspended by the league. If your in contention to be the number one pick, I dont care if one doctor tells you you cant play if the leagues doctor says you can you strap em on and get out there and at least play a little. It was an all star game its not like you have to go that hard. Yakupov has the highest ceiling but I think Grigor and Forsberg are closer to sure things without as high of ceiling.

  13. #43
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    I mostly agree

    Quote Originally Posted by pidg88 View Post
    Well the only thing I would disagree with is that every top major athlete right behind winning (or before depending on who) is the dollar signs. Its not about making 6 million a year, its about what your worth. Parise is worth 6-7m a year, if he is offered 5m by Detroit he might see it as an insult. Imagine if you think your worth 60-70k a year at the job your interviewing for and all of a sudden they offer you 50k. Wouldnt you be insulted a little? Now multiply that by 100 because of an athlete's extreme ego.

    There are a couple MAJOR differences.
    I'm not coming off of multiple contracts of over 3 million per season. Lets face facts. Zach has made more money in one season than I or many others for that matter will ever see in their life.

    Even if I was offered 60-70K, there is no trophy for finishing first. I just work for a full year and make my money. Zach has a chance to have his name put on a trophy that he has probably dreamt about since he started skating.

    So If I was offerd 50K and that 50 K was to put me on a team where I could win something that has been a life long dream, and I was already loaded, yeah, i'd take less money to pursue a life long competative dream.

    Generally speaking yeah, its about what your worth.. the difference is that Zach has said in multiple interviews that he wants to go some place where he can win a cup..

    Lets be real here. If you have 5 million or 6 million for 1 YEAR!! and you have a significantly increased probablility of attaining a major personal competative goal which do you do? Oh yeah, and again, your already wealthy beyond most peoples wildest dreams..

    He may see it as an insult.. Your right on the money there. But, if he wants to win a cup AND make some serious Bank, again I pose to you.. Would you take 5million and a 90% chance at the playoffs and a 50+% chance at the Cup? or would you take 6 mill per year and a 50-75% chance of making the playoffs and probably 25% chance at the Cup? Keep in mind your goal is the CUP, not $ which he has said..

    I hope the wild pick him up.. But..... I'm not gonna get my hopes up.

  14. #44
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    The problem is the only definite in your equation is the money. In neither is he guaranteed a cup. You also didnt factor many qualitative factors like how winning it at home might factor in. How his family and friends are here and this is where he grew up. Dont get me wrong im not getting my hopes up at all either. I think its probably 50% chance he stays in NJ and then maybe as high as a 10% chance for us. My hopes arent up, trust me.

  15. #45
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    well like i said we cheer against NJ the worse the do in the playoffs the better our chances at Parise get

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