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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by ring91013144043 View Post
    Thanks for not even bothering to argue with the main point of my post, that Roethilsberger is unquestionably better than Eli. That doesn't mean it isn't close, but it's not a photo finish or anything.

    However, in your later post, you try pointing out a double-standard that Roethlisberger "won his Super Bowls" whereas Eli "rode his defense." I personally have not seen that. I've seen the average fan say both rode their respective defenses and Giants fans say that Roethlisberger rode his defense while Eli won his Super Bowls. People with a clue and Steelers fans, generally one in the same , say that both quarterbacks contributed and understand that every championship team needs a good defense. But maybe we're not looking in the same spots.
    No need to argue something I likewise believe in.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by ring91013144043 View Post
    There's an "Is Eli top 5?" thread with a poll, with about 60-40 in favor of Eli being outside of the top 5. And given that at least 8-10 of the 15 voters for Eli were Giants fans...I don't know if that brings the number to 95%, but the fact remains that it's very skewed and homeriffic.

    And I'm somewhat offended that you didn't include me in the list of people who tries to educate you Giants fans.
    how can I argue with you if you don't take time to actually read..I said Steelers fans arguing for their QB..thats you..I hope Todd Haley completely takes yals run game out so you can see what kind of QB Ben really is without the run game to lean on and the defense getting old
    Eli Manning going for 2012-2013 NFL MVP

    not to mention this: http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/ima...ine=1328584116

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYkillaPriest View Post
    how can I argue with you if you don't take time to actually read..I said Steelers fans arguing for their QB..thats you..I hope Todd Haley completely takes yals run game out so you can see what kind of QB Ben really is without the run game to lean on and the defense getting old
    he should argue for his quaterback over eli. its the right answer
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  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinstripe power View Post
    and the ones argueing for him are almost exclusively giants fans. most non-giants fans simply don't join the arguement


    eli is not top 5, and thats not even remotely debateable because ben rothlisberger has him oin stats, intanglible, clutchness, success, etc. giants fans can think he;s top 5 all they want, its not true
    Stats- not YPA and Eli and the Giants were the best deep ball team in the league without a game changer who uses his speed to take the top off the defense..theres stats that Ben put up more than Eli and there are stats Eli puts up more than Ben so thats wash..get away from ESPN for your stats then come talk

    Intangibles-yea right..Ben cant make all the throws how Eli does..his pocket presence isn't nearly as good as Eli..and he causes most of his own injuries by holding the ball to long

    Clutchness- NO..Eli is the most clutch player in the league

    Success-2 SB victories a piece..Ben 0 SB MVPs..Eli 2 SB MVPs..please give me another measure to judge success in any sport that puts Ben ahead
    Eli Manning going for 2012-2013 NFL MVP

    not to mention this: http://forums.prosportsdaily.com/ima...ine=1328584116

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYkillaPriest View Post
    1) Stats- not YPA and Eli and the Giants were the best deep ball team in the league without a game changer who uses his speed to take the top off the defense..theres stats that Ben put up more than Eli and there are stats Eli puts up more than Ben so thats wash..get away from ESPN for your stats then come talk

    2) Intangibles-yea right..Ben cant make all the throws how Eli does..his pocket presence isn't nearly as good as Eli..and he causes most of his own injuries by holding the ball to long

    3) Clutchness- NO..Eli is the most clutch player in the league

    4) Success-2 SB victories a piece..Ben 0 SB MVPs..Eli 2 SB MVPs..please give me another measure to judge success in any sport that puts Ben ahead
    1) for his career, ben YPA is higher, and its been higher every single year of their careers except this season. so congrats, eli's beat ben in one stat in one single season

    2) ben is argueablly the toughest guy in the NFL at the qb position. dont give me the injury crap, ben plays through more than most do. just because eli ahsn't missed a game doesn't mena he's tougher then ben. and you;'d be surprised what throws ben can make that most think he can't.

    3) not even remotely close to be true. if eli is so cluthc, why do the giant shave a reputation of being embarassed in playoff loses under him and collapsing in the second have of the season. plus ben has 27 4th quater or overtime game winning drives, and is the only person to get 20 before the age of 30. eli wins the clutch arguement with alot of quaterbacks, but no one is as clutch as ben rothlisberger, the bane of every ravens fans existance

    4) superbowl MVPs mean nothing, esepcailly when Eli didn't exactly dominate either game he got one in. he got them because he was the quaterback on the winning team



    ben rothlisberger is undoubtably, unquestionably better than eli manning, and its not really that close. theres is nothing eli does that ben does not do equal or better. just becaus ehe had a slightly better year this year and was on the superbowl winning team doesn't change that
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  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYkillaPriest View Post
    how can I argue with you if you don't take time to actually read..I said Steelers fans arguing for their QB..thats you..I hope Todd Haley completely takes yals run game out so you can see what kind of QB Ben really is without the run game to lean on and the defense getting old
    They tried that in 09. Roethlisberger threw 26 TDs and 12 INTs for a 100.5 QB raiting and the Steelers had the 19th Rushing game.

  7. #67
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    1. Rodgers
    2. Brady
    3. Brees
    4. Peyton Manning
    5. Big Ben
    6. Romo
    7. Rivers
    8. Eli Manning
    9. Alex Smith
    10. Matt Ryan
    Last edited by Green_Monster; 02-08-2012 at 03:23 PM.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYkillaPriest View Post
    There are only 4 posters on PSD who continue to argue agianst Eli being top 5 in every Eli thread are you..wade>kobe..pinstripe power..hugepatsfan..don't even have to look it up to know the famous 4..everybody else is a Steelers fan or Cowboys fan arguing for their QB..or a sad Eagles fan..I've even seen Cowboys say Eli is better..hell the owner said it..so I don't know where you get your 95% from
    Them, me, and everyone else who ISN'T a HOMER.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYkillaPriest View Post
    Stats- not YPA and Eli and the Giants were the best deep ball team in the league without a game changer who uses his speed to take the top off the defense..theres stats that Ben put up more than Eli and there are stats Eli puts up more than Ben so thats wash..get away from ESPN for your stats then come talk

    Intangibles-yea right..Ben cant make all the throws how Eli does..his pocket presence isn't nearly as good as Eli..and he causes most of his own injuries by holding the ball to long

    Clutchness- NO..Eli is the most clutch player in the league

    Success-2 SB victories a piece..Ben 0 SB MVPs..Eli 2 SB MVPs..please give me another measure to judge success in any sport that puts Ben ahead
    Nice job ignoring my post showing that all of Eli's career highs would barely be in Roethlisberger's top 5 for each category. But apparently it doesn't matter because Roethlisberger can't do it in the pocket.

    Can someone please explain to me how Eli is clutch when this is the second time he hasn't gone one and done in his playoff career? Now "clutch" is bull**** as is for anyone, but seriously.

    Justin Tuck was the MVP of Super Bowl XLII, don't kid yourself. Any other organization would have given the XLIII MVP to Roethlisberger for that performance. So, in the opinion of people who actually watched each quarterback's Super Bowl-winning performances, that's one MVP per player. That's a wash.

    Does the fact that A FREAKING RAVENS FAN is arguing Ben over Eli to you tell you anything?

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by ring91013144043 View Post
    Nice job ignoring my post showing that all of Eli's career highs would barely be in Roethlisberger's top 5 for each category. But apparently it doesn't matter because Roethlisberger can't do it in the pocket.

    Can someone please explain to me how Eli is clutch when this is the second time he hasn't gone one and done in his playoff career? Now "clutch" is bull**** as is for anyone, but seriously.

    Justin Tuck was the MVP of Super Bowl XLII, don't kid yourself. Any other organization would have given the XLIII MVP to Roethlisberger for that performance. So, in the opinion of people who actually watched each quarterback's Super Bowl-winning performances, that's one MVP per player. That's a wash.

    Does the fact that A FREAKING RAVENS FAN is arguing Ben over Eli to you tell you anything?
    i would bet any amount of anything their comeback is because im a "hater"


    i would also like to add that nobody, and i mean nobody, scares me more to play aginst in the NFL then ben rothlisberger
    Last edited by Pinstripe pride; 02-08-2012 at 06:41 PM.
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  11. #71
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    I have a question. Eli is considered elite because he steps it up in the playoffs, even though he's not usually great in the reg season. Why can't this also be said about the defense? In the playoffs they allowed 14 points per game. This is to teams that scored 35,32,25 and 24 points per game in the regular season. They held the 7th highest offense to 0 points. One of the highest scoring ever to 20. They forced 4 turnovers against a team that had 14 in the entire regular season. So if Eli is going to get so much credit for playoff performance, can we stop hearing about how terrible the defense was?

    Even the run game improved. They went from 3.5 yards per carry in the reg season to 4.1 in the playoffs and averaged 116 yards per game.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYkillaPriest View Post
    There are only 4 posters on PSD who continue to argue agianst Eli being top 5 in every Eli thread are you..wade>kobe..pinstripe power..hugepatsfan..don't even have to look it up to know the famous 4..everybody else is a Steelers fan or Cowboys fan arguing for their QB..or a sad Eagles fan..I've even seen Cowboys say Eli is better..hell the owner said it..so I don't know where you get your 95% from
    I like it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Haha View Post
    What I feel right now is like the satisfaction you feel when a highly judgmental, moralistic televangelist gets caught screwing a male hooker.
    NE Patriots Forum HOF (Class of 2011)

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  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by bosox3431 View Post
    I have a question. Eli is considered elite because he steps it up in the playoffs, even though he's not usually great in the reg season. Why can't this also be said about the defense? In the playoffs they allowed 14 points per game. This is to teams that scored 35,32,25 and 24 points per game in the regular season. They held the 7th highest offense to 0 points. One of the highest scoring ever to 20. They forced 4 turnovers against a team that had 14 in the entire regular season. So if Eli is going to get so much credit for playoff performance, can we stop hearing about how terrible the defense was?

    Even the run game improved. They went from 3.5 yards per carry in the reg season to 4.1 in the playoffs and averaged 116 yards per game.
    You can take your unbiased logic and shove it you know where... YOU CAN'T SPELL ELITE WITHOUT ELI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Haha View Post
    What I feel right now is like the satisfaction you feel when a highly judgmental, moralistic televangelist gets caught screwing a male hooker.
    NE Patriots Forum HOF (Class of 2011)

    Trill Team

  14. #74
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    Also, if were going to constantly bring up Eli's 4th qtr stats and clutchness, why not talk about his failures also. How about against SF? Made it to the red zone, then failed to score. The Green Bay game, Eli threw a pick 6 and lost by 3. Against Seattle they lost by 11. Eli threw 3 picks in that game, one for a pick 6. Giants were also 1-12 on 3rd down conversions that game. The Philly game in which giants lost by 7. Eli had a pick in that game, played pretty bad across the board and the eagles scored the winning td with 2:45 left to play. Plenty of time to make a drive" Eli obviously failed. Or the redskins game they lost by 13. Eli played like ****. Had 3 int, one of which resulted in a skins td. They also weren't very successful on 3rd down.

    So of were going to credit him for his 5 or whatever game winning drives which area brought up constantly, lets factor in games and failed game winning drives.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post
    I like it.
    Me too. I think we should get us a sig mad lol. Can't forget more than most though. The Famous 5. Sounds good.

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