5th all time in TD's, most TD's in a season (I'm sure it'll be broken sometime soon), 16-0 regular season, 3 Super Bowls, 2 Super Bowl MVP's, 2 league MVP's (only unanimous MVP ever), winningest coach/QB combo ever, most Postseason consecutive wins (10), most consecutive wins, most consecutive wins at home, highest TD to INT ratio in a season ever, highest win % of all time.
Yeah, I'd say that those alone make him an all time great. Another Super Bowl would just cement everything most people already know.
Another thing is Peyton has always had more pressure on him, because the Colts never had an elite defense. With the Patriots Tom Brady didn't have to win the game by himself, especially in the years you are referring to, they had one of the best defenses in the league. It was okay to only score a field goal or go fourth and out once in a while. Manning has always tried to score on every drive, because he pretty much needs to, his team is that bad.
Last edited by Corndog; 01-11-2012 at 04:22 AM.
Ironic but Brady and the Patriots did a whole bunch of the heavy lifting for Indy the year they went all the way.
If N.E. doesn't upset the Chargers in San Diego in the Divisional Round then the Colts don't play the AFC title game at home one week later. They would've been on the road against Tomlinson, Michael Turner, Darren Sproles and a team that ran for 200 yards a game.
A flat-out bad match up for a team like Indianapolis. My guess is that's a game they would have lost.
Dungy is the most overrated coach of all time. Manning made him.
The fact is that Manning would be this good anywhere. Would his stats be quite as good? Probably not without the dome, but they'd still be the best of this era. The question is, how would Manning's playoff winning have looked in a different environment, with good defenses?
I just don't know why people don't look at defenses when comparing Brady/Montana to Manning/Marino. It doesn't mean you have to give Manning or Marino the nod. Not at all. But to not recognize that Brady and Montana never won without an elite defense, and that Marino and Manning very rarely had elite defenses, just seems dishonest.
Also, to talk about TD:INT ratio without talking about the defense and how often they played from behind is also sort of irresponsible. QB's throw more INTs when playing from behind, and throw more INTs when the team doesn't trust their defense. That is simply reality.
Like I said, this doesn't have to change someone's opinion, but it simply never even gets brought up.
Really folks this gets silly. There are 20 or so quarterbacks that were perfect for the moment and situation they were given. Most of the greats are linked with one coach or one system. Have you noticed how no QB has ever won a Superbowl for two different teams? Hell I can only think of Warner and Morton. Thats because that's how it works... A great QB gets the right system and players around them, they learn to play in that system and they would not be as good if you interchanged them cause they all had great systems built around them.
Originally Posted by MrPoon
You can't just remove an elite quarterback from that team, throw him somewhere else, and say "Okay, throw for 5,000 yards in this system, now". That's not how it works. You build around a good QB, finding his strengths and weaknesses. The Saints have done that with Drew Brees.
If you take Tom Brady and put him on Denver next season, Tom Brady sucks. Does that mean he's a "system QB"? It means that every team has certain plays, calls, and players for their team. Denver is set up for Tebow to succeed. Tebow could probably not succeed on a team that has Tom Brady plays, just like Tom Brady could not play on a team that has Tim Tebow plays. It's really that simple.
I really think the "system QB" stuff is dumb. Who the hell cares? For what Tom Brady does in our system, he's a perfect fit. It's that simple.
* The patriots went 13-3 with the 31st ranked defense...Brady does fine with little defensive help lol
* Harrison/Reggie NEVER left the colts, so you can't really use that argument. EVERYONE knows they were all pro recievers even the COLTS KNEW..Which is why wayne's last deal he recieved 6 yrs/39 mill..And Harrison was also paid good..
Also Reggie had 75 catches/960 yrds this season with absolute bums throwing him the ball..Pretty good huh??
Arguing Who had more offensive talent before 07 is LAUGHABLE...
Averaged 84.77 receptions per season, which is second to the all time record
held by Sterling Sharpe who averaged 85 receptions per season. He had
previously been averaging 93 per season until 2007, where he missed the
majority of games with a knee injury, resulting in a 20 reception season.
4th most touchdown receptions in a decade (95) 2000–2009
3rd most receiving yards per game throughout a career (76.7 yds/game)
2nd most receiving yards in a decade (10,439) 2000–2009
Holds the NFL record for receptions in a single season with 143, set in 2002.
Most receptions in a 2 season period (252), 2001–2002; 3 season period (
354), 2000–2002; 4 season period (469), 1999–2002; 5 season period (563), 1999–2003; 6 season period (649), 1999–2004; 7 season period (731), 1999–2005; 8 season period (826), 1999–2006; 9 season period (885), 1998–2006; 10 season period (958), 1997–2006; 11 season period (1,022), 1996–2006.
Most receiving yards in a 4 season period (6,322), 1999–2002; 5 season period (7,594), 1999–2003.
Most games with at least 8 receptions (51), 9 receptions (32), 11 receptions (12), 12 receptions (8), 13 receptions (4)
Most games with at least 14 receptions (2)-tied with Brandon Marshall, Jerry Rice, Jason Witten, Jimmy Smith, Kellen Winslow
Most consecutive games with at least 6 receptions (16) and 9 receptions (6)
Most consecutive seasons with at least 5 touchdowns (11) – shared with Jerry Rice, Don Hutson, Cris Carter, Tim Brown
Most consecutive seasons with at least 6 touchdowns (11) – shared with Jerry Rice, Don Hutson
Most consecutive seasons with at least 5 touchdown receptions (11) – shared
with Jerry Rice, Don Hutson, Cris Carter, Tim Brown
Most consecutive seasons with at least 6 touchdown receptions (11) – shared with Jerry Rice, Don Hutson
Most consecutive seasons with at least 10 touchdown receptions (8)
Most consecutive seasons with at least 11 touchdown receptions (4)-tied with Lance Alworth, Art Powell
Most consecutive seasons with at least 14 touchdown receptions (2)-tied with Jerry Rice
Consecutive seasons with 1,400+ receiving yards (4); 1999–2002
Consecutive seasons with 100+ receptions (4)
Consecutive seasons with 82+ receptions (8); 1999–2006.
Most games in a single season (2002) with at least 6 receptions (15), 7 receptions (12), 8 receptions (12), 9 receptions (10), 11 receptions (5).
3rd most games in a single season with 10+ receptions (6). Wes Welker and Andre Johnson have 7.
Only player with 16 career games with double digit receptions for one team
^^ Is this an argument FOR or AGAINST manning??
lolPhillies' top 10 p4p- Mayweather/Ward/Marquez/Bradley/Martinez/Froch/Wlad/Pacquiao/Rigondeaux/Alvarez
Boxing fan? Come discuss Boxing!