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  1. #1
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    Top Second basemans in the league

    This is the top 10 players in the game today. There was some confusing about the first basemans.


    1. R. Cano
    2. D. Pedroia
    3, C. Utley
    4. B. Phillips
    5. I. Kinsler
    6. R. Weeks
    7. D.Uggla
    8. A. Hill
    9. G. Beckham
    10. O. Hudson

  2. #2
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    lol @ Cano being one, we have had this discussion 15 billion times, in fact, we are still having it in the MLB section. This is why he is considered over-rated, so many people place him as the best second basemen in the game, but they can't back it with any argument other than 'he just is' even though he isn't by any measurable factor. He is top 5, but he isn't the best in the game.

    1. Zobrist
    2. Utley
    3. Pedroia
    4. Cano
    5. Kinsler
    6. Phillips
    7. Weeks
    8. Uggla
    9. Kendrick
    10. Johnson


    Of course, for Zobrist to keep his title for me, he has to remain at second more than in right.

  3. #3
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    Agree with Jeffy's list

  4. #4
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    Ben Zobrist? Number one? LOL WHAT?!

  5. #5
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    imo, kinsler should be #3 behind pedroia/cano.

    1. Pedroia
    2. Cano
    3. Kinsler
    4. Utley
    5. Phillips
    6. Zobrist
    7. Weeks
    8. Uggla
    9. Kendrick
    10. Walker

    #Beastmode 24/7

  6. #6
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    1. Utley
    2. Pedroia
    3. Cano
    4. Kinsler
    5. Weeks
    6. Phillips
    7. Kendrick
    8. Uggla
    9. Ackley
    10. Zobrist

  7. #7
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    1. Dustin Pedrioa
    2. Ben Zobrist
    3. Chase Utley
    4. Robinson Cano
    5. Ian Kinsler
    6. Brandon Phillips
    7. Dan Uggla
    8. Ricky Weeks
    9. Howie Kendrick
    10. Kelly Johnson

  8. #8
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    Zobrist is easily top 2, possibly best

  9. #9
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    Pedroia
    Zobrist
    Cano
    Utley
    Kinsler

    Kinsler and Utley are interchangable depedning on how you view Utley's health impacting him.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by iAugust View Post
    Ben Zobrist? Number one? LOL WHAT?!
    Yes, do you have a way you would like to disagree with that?

    Because he has been the most productive second basemen in baseball the last three seasons.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffy25 View Post
    Yes, do you have a way you would like to disagree with that?

    Because he has been the most productive second basemen in baseball the last three seasons.
    Zobrist WAR

    7.0
    3.1
    5.1

    AVG: 5.0

    Pedroia WAR

    4.7
    3.7
    6.8

    AVG: 5.0

    Their past three season averages the same WAR value. Add to Pedroia that he's 2.5 years younger than Ben and he edges Zobrist.

    1. Pedroia
    2. Utley
    3. Zobrist
    4. Cano
    5. Kinsler

    BRING BARRETT TO CAROLINA, GETTLEMAN!

    MMA FIGHTERS: WERDUM, JONES, SONNEN, MAYHEM, BELFORT, HENDRICKS, MAYNARD, ALDO, WINELAND

  12. #12
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    Zobrist's batting splits:

    '11:

    as a 2B: 265/341/816 (517 PA)
    as a RF: 280/399/848 (184 PA)

    '10

    as a 2B: 191/293/580 (194 PA)
    as a RF: 259/356/736 (360 PA)

    '09

    as a 2B: 261/388/822 (344 PA)
    as a RF: 313/395/925 (157 PA)

    Zobbrist for his career as a starter (last 3 years) has hit better when not playing 2B. This is a trend that has held for all his time as a regular, so I think it's noteworthy. It's not just a blip - there's enough evidence that this is a real factor IMO. I'm just curious how people factor that into their decision making.

    Also, as mentioned Zobrist has only been a starter for 3 years. He has never in his career put up back to back season above 100 OPS+ as a regular. He hasn't shown offensive consistancy from year to year yet. His OBP in '10 was only 323. Zoborist was not that good in '10. Good, but definately not #1 at his position good. I need a little more consistancy before I put him up there.


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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post
    Zobrist's batting splits:

    '11:

    as a 2B: 265/341/816 (517 PA)
    as a RF: 280/399/848 (184 PA)

    '10

    as a 2B: 191/293/580 (194 PA)
    as a RF: 259/356/736 (360 PA)

    '09

    as a 2B: 261/388/822 (344 PA)
    as a RF: 313/395/925 (157 PA)

    Zobbrist for his career as a starter (last 3 years) has hit better when not playing 2B. This is a trend that has held for all his time as a regular, so I think it's noteworthy. It's not just a blip - there's enough evidence that this is a real factor IMO. I'm just curious how people factor that into their decision making.

    Also, as mentioned Zobrist has only been a starter for 3 years. He has never in his career put up back to back season above 100 OPS+ as a regular. He hasn't shown offensive consistancy from year to year yet. His OBP in '10 was only 323. Zoborist was not that good in '10. Good, but definately not #1 at his position good. I need a little more consistancy before I put him up there.
    Where he is playing defensively should never have anything to do with his offensive output, he is the same player.

    He has played second base more than anywhere else in his career, and he is a career .252/.348/.435 hitter at second, and is a career .257/.348/.435 hitter overall.

    You posted a tiny sample size. He can play second base well defensively and he has an above average bat, especially with his plate discipline. The fact that he has some good at bats in games where he played right field doesn't mean anything. When he bats, his glove isn't up there with him. When he plays defense, his bat isn't out there with him. Once given enough plate appearances as a second basemen, he will have his slash line eventually where his career output is supposed to be.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by hugepatsfan View Post

    Also, as mentioned Zobrist has only been a starter for 3 years. He has never in his career put up back to back season above 100 OPS+ as a regular. He hasn't shown offensive consistancy from year to year yet. His OBP in '10 was only 323. Zoborist was not that good in '10. Good, but definately not #1 at his position good. I need a little more consistancy before I put him up there.
    And yeah, Zobrist has only been an everyday player for 3 seasons, his first of which was a 7 WAR year. It seems like a lot to expect back to back seasons of anything when the guy only has a 3 year sample size as a regular and his only bad season was in the middle.

    We have three years of Zobrist data, one year was bad, two years were fantastic (including the most recent one). That's a pretty good indicator that he is more like his 09 and 11 version then he is his 2010 version.

    Not to mention, his 2010 was supported completely by a dump in his ball in play average, something unsustainable with his contact rates. And yet, he still managed a 3.5-4.0 WAR in 2010. You can basically count on 5 WAR from Zobrist every year, just like Pedroia and Cano.

  15. #15
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    2b

    1. cano
    2. pedroia
    3. kinsler
    4. phillips
    5. utley
    6. weeks
    7. zobrist
    8. ackley
    9. uggla
    10. rickie weeks

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