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  1. #1
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    Respect and Deep Thought

    Does anyone else feel like there is a real lack of respect and thought given on these forums to anyone who disagrees with your own personal point of view? It seems like the thrust of many of the posts here is "Here is what I believe, if you do not believe the way I believe the only explanation is that you are an idiot."

    Is there not a single issue on which two intelligent people can disagree without one of them being a complete moron? Do that many people really think every issue is so cut and dried that any debate is worthless and indicative of a lazy mind not coming around to the "right way of thinking"? I have varied opinions on many issues. No one could ever paint me into a "right" or "left" box. Does that make me an idiot 1/2 of the time to 1/2 of the people?

    To sum up, I am not anti-Liberal or anti-Conservative. I am however, anti-smug, know-it-all, judgemental people.

  2. #2
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    we're americans so most of the time we are going to be smug b/c our opinion is usually the only one that matters... (in our minds)

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    Does anyone else feel like there is a real lack of respect and thought given on these forums to anyone who disagrees with your own personal point of view? It seems like the thrust of many of the posts here is "Here is what I believe, if you do not believe the way I believe the only explanation is that you are an idiot."

    Is there not a single issue on which two intelligent people can disagree without one of them being a complete moron? Do that many people really think every issue is so cut and dried that any debate is worthless and indicative of a lazy mind not coming around to the "right way of thinking"? I have varied opinions on many issues. No one could ever paint me into a "right" or "left" box. Does that make me an idiot 1/2 of the time to 1/2 of the people?

    To sum up, I am not anti-Liberal or anti-Conservative. I am however, anti-smug, know-it-all, judgemental people.
    I completely agree with you on this one. I can't stand the smear campaign, regurgitated talking point spin that comes from Hannity and Rush then ends up being presented on here as fact. I would much rather discuss actual policy information, historical results of similar policy, etc. I don't see much economic discussion on here at all, with the exception of ari. I try to bring it up but no one seems to want to do the research to understand it or discuss it. with the exception of the worn out "raising taxes" talking point, no conservative opinion wants to discuss economic policy.

  4. #4
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    True enough Eastside ...

    But, the politics forum is a lot better than it was when they first opened it -- thus the rules that DB posted.
    Когда́ де́ньги говоря́т, тогда́ пра́вда молчи́т

  5. #5
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    ive said this in post before... no one changes anyone's mind on here... its just everyone spouting their own ideas or opinions they share.

    or if you Phx you come here to accuse everyone (conservatives) of spin and just using talking points and never acknowledging that these "talking points" are real concerns to some people that just happen to be brought up in the media.

    just because you read something in the paper or heard it on tv doesn't make it automatically a lie. sometimes it just helps you get your verbiage across in a legitimate concise way.

    i think the saddleback forum is a perfect representation on american people... some people try to calculate, articulate and sometimes over think EVERYTHING. and some people shoot straight from the hip. they have simple standards and thought process, so when questions like abortion, gay marriage and others come up.. no long winded answer be needed.

    so some people (like me) have already came up with our own morals and standards and when questions like abortion come up we(I) can give direct answers... others take a more tactful approach.. but its still the same outcome... getting your beliefs across to people who are asking about them. because sometimes you can be too tactful and talk so much and be so vague that people dont really know what you even just said and then go and "interpret" it to fit what you thought he meant

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHX-SOXFAN View Post
    I completely agree with you on this one. I can't stand the smear campaign, regurgitated talking point spin that comes from Hannity and Rush then ends up being presented on here as fact. I would much rather discuss actual policy information, historical results of similar policy, etc. I don't see much economic discussion on here at all, with the exception of ari. I try to bring it up but no one seems to want to do the research to understand it or discuss it. with the exception of the worn out "raising taxes" talking point, no conservative opinion wants to discuss economic policy.
    Thanks for agreeing, but the sentence I bolded is actually an example of the kind of thing I am talking about.

  7. #7
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    Yeah we have to bring Rush's spin into this, don't we. With all due respect, PHX, there isn't some huge campaign by Rush and Hannity to invade PSD with their talking points.

    But speaking of talking points, I think that's the biggest issue with forums like these. Everyone has their talking points (even if it's just "Stop talking like Rush"), not enough people are willing to compromise, few people come in to learn about something. And that's when people aren't flaming or baiting
    "Compromise, hell! That's what has happened to us all down the line -- and that's the very cause of our woes. If freedom is right and tyranny is wrong, why should those who believe in freedom treat it as if it were a roll of bologna to be bartered a slice at a time?"

    RIP Jesse Helms

  8. #8
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    I agree completely. I think people on all side (left, right, middle, none) need to use discrestion when posting on here. A lot of use have strong believes, weather it be for one party or another or a specific issue. Because of this, one small post/statement can trigger an emotional response and things can spiral quickly into this is why you (or your party) are morons.

    Also, PHX, you saying the Rush/Hannity spin stuff has become your own talking point. You can say it all you want, but as has been stated, there are people who believe in conservative/republican values/principles who don't listen to, or are not fans of Rush/Hannity. It's insulting to be told, after virtualy ever arguement that I or others who tend to think like me are just spewing the propaganda of Rush/Hannity. The insinuation is that I or others, are not thinking for ourselves, and while I can only speak for myself, that is not the case. I personally don't listen to Rush/Hannity, but don't see it as relevant in either case. I don't write off everything you say as coming for Olberman's mouth or whatever the liberal equivalent would be and would appreciate it if you did the same.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    "Here is what I believe, if you do not believe the way I believe the only explanation is that you are an idiot."
    yea, I get that all the time.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Fluty View Post
    ive said this in post before... no one changes anyone's mind on here... its just everyone spouting their own ideas or opinions they share.

    or if you Phx you come here to accuse everyone (conservatives) of spin and just using talking points and never acknowledging that these "talking points" are real concerns to some people that just happen to be brought up in the media.

    just because you read something in the paper or heard it on tv doesn't make it automatically a lie. sometimes it just helps you get your verbiage across in a legitimate concise way.

    i think the saddleback forum is a perfect representation on american people... some people try to calculate, articulate and sometimes over think EVERYTHING. and some people shoot straight from the hip. they have simple standards and thought process, so when questions like abortion, gay marriage and others come up.. no long winded answer be needed.

    so some people (like me) have already came up with our own morals and standards and when questions like abortion come up we(I) can give direct answers... others take a more tactful approach.. but its still the same outcome... getting your beliefs across to people who are asking about them. because sometimes you can be too tactful and talk so much and be so vague that people dont really know what you even just said and then go and "interpret" it to fit what you thought he meant
    I don't know. I'd hope people are at the very least learning something in here.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by b1e9a8r5s View Post
    I agree completely. I think people on all side (left, right, middle, none) need to use discrestion when posting on here. A lot of use have strong believes, weather it be for one party or another or a specific issue. Because of this, one small post/statement can trigger an emotional response and things can spiral quickly into this is why you (or your party) are morons.

    Also, PHX, you saying the Rush/Hannity spin stuff has become your own talking point. You can say it all you want, but as has been stated, there are people who believe in conservative/republican values/principles who don't listen to, or are not fans of Rush/Hannity. It's insulting to be told, after virtualy ever arguement that I or others who tend to think like me are just spewing the propaganda of Rush/Hannity. The insinuation is that I or others, are not thinking for ourselves, and while I can only speak for myself, that is not the case. I personally don't listen to Rush/Hannity, but don't see it as relevant in either case. I don't write off everything you say as coming for Olberman's mouth or whatever the liberal equivalent would be and would appreciate it if you did the same.
    I wouldn't bring up the Rush/Hannity thing if I didn't hear the exact same thing from Hannity or Rush and their speculation and spin then come in here and see it all within 24 hours.

    You don't have the olberman talking point with me because I don't watch him or get my information from him.

  12. #12
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    im glad other people notice in here about phx and his tactics...

    people make a good point and go through a explanation of why you feel like you do and he just dismisses it as spin or talking points...

    never invoking thought through his own posts.. just berating others views just because they happen to be shared by other conservatives...

    glad i wasnt the only one noticing...

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Fluty View Post
    im glad other people notice in here about phx and his tactics...

    people make a good point and go through a explanation of why you feel like you do and he just dismisses it as spin or talking points...

    never invoking thought through his own posts.. just berating others views just because they happen to be shared by other conservatives...

    glad i wasnt the only one noticing...
    sorry but the talking points are never followed by an explanation, they are usually followed by more talking points, just like when Hannity goes through the spin about obama spiel.

    I love to invoke thought about the policies. Those are the posts that are always ignored so we can instead talk about twisting someone's words or saying that they have no policies or specifics. Funny I haven't heard that argument from a few posters since I gave them some links to legitimate information that they were obviously ignoring.

    Also, I'm not the one with tactics or berating. I stick to the facts, that's why I didn't just spend time in the village

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